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-   -   US made 416? (http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1446410)

NEOH212 10-06-2012 03:17

US made 416?
 
Who else would like to have one? HK's MR 556 is a great gun but is lacking in a lot of ways. One big deal breaker for me was the absence of a chrome lined barrel!

Seriously HK, WTF? :dunno:

Then there is no nitriding on the parts... Again, WTF?

Then there is the funky stock. I can deal with that since it's easily changed but come on HK, your HK, you can do better than that.

I'd much prefer if they would just produce something much more similar to the 416 in it's original configuration as is possible by law.

Do this HK, and I'll buy two! :cool:

MarcDW 10-06-2012 07:32

All these things you list are costing money.
Not that the MR223 cost almost twice as much!

:steamed:

WoodenPlank 10-06-2012 09:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by NEOH212 (Post 19490040)
Who else would like to have one? HK's MR 556 is a great gun but is lacking in a lot of ways. One big deal breaker for me was the absence of a chrome lined barrel!

Seriously HK, WTF? :dunno:

Then there is no nitriding on the parts... Again, WTF?

Then there is the funky stock. I can deal with that since it's easily changed but come on HK, your HK, you can do better than that.

I'd much prefer if they would just produce something much more similar to the 416 in it's original configuration as is possible by law.

Do this HK, and I'll buy two! :cool:


If they'd put out upper kits (ie: complete upper, buffer and spring) for around $1,000 like was promised a while back, I'd happily buy one. Coughing up close to $5,000 for a grey market 10.5" upper is out of the question. That's about what it would cost me to replace my entire Mk. 18 clone, including optic, light, and stamp.

HalfHazzard 10-06-2012 17:36

From: http://www.hk-usa.com/civilian_produ...56_general.asp

Quote:

But unlike the HK416, the MR556A1 does not use a chrome-lined barrel. Chrome-lining can sometimes mask bore imperfections and negatively affect accuracy. For the new series of Heckler & Koch semi-automatic MR rifles, HK designers and engineers believe best accuracy comes with an unlined bore.
They talk to the engineers so the customers don't have to.

I wish the pistol grip cost less than $70, I'd put one on my AR-15 if they did.

NEOH212 10-07-2012 00:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarcDW (Post 19490352)
All these things you list are costing money.
Not that the MR223 cost almost twice as much!

:steamed:

That's certainly the unfortunate part of it. Maybe in the future with more US produced parts, that price will come down into the sane range.

NEOH212 10-07-2012 00:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by WoodenPlank (Post 19490570)
If they'd put out upper kits (ie: complete upper, buffer and spring) for around $1,000 like was promised a while back, I'd happily buy one. Coughing up close to $5,000 for a grey market 10.5" upper is out of the question. That's about what it would cost me to replace my entire Mk. 18 clone, including optic, light, and stamp.

We can still dream about it though! (And drool a little too)

:drool:

NEOH212 10-07-2012 00:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by HalfHazzard (Post 19491954)
From: http://www.hk-usa.com/civilian_produ...56_general.asp



They talk to the engineers so the customers don't have to.

I wish the pistol grip cost less than $70, I'd put one on my AR-15 if they did.

The ones I've seen haven't been anymore accurate than any other production AR style rifle. I think they just used that BS as a convenient excuse to not line the barrel. I still say they could have done better on this rifle.

(I still want one though! :cool:)

NEOH212 10-07-2012 00:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by HalfHazzard (Post 19491954)
I wish the pistol grip cost less than $70, I'd put one on my AR-15 if they did.

I'm with you on the pistol grip. It feels nice but isn't worth the $70 they want for it.

(I'll still probably end up buying one anyhow...:whistling:)

MarcDW 10-07-2012 04:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by NEOH212 (Post 19492953)
That's certainly the unfortunate part of it. Maybe in the future with more US produced parts, that price will come down into the sane range.

You don't understand the HK price policy.
The MR223 does not cost HK more then the 416 and if so it's minor.
The price of the MR223 is based on how much HK marketing figured that civilian customers will pay for the rifle.

Kimura 10-07-2012 11:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by NEOH212 (Post 19490040)
Who else would like to have one? HK's MR 556 is a great gun but is lacking in a lot of ways. One big deal breaker for me was the absence of a chrome lined barrel!

Seriously HK, WTF? :dunno:

Then there is no nitriding on the parts... Again, WTF?

Then there is the funky stock. I can deal with that since it's easily changed but come on HK, your HK, you can do better than that.

I'd much prefer if they would just produce something much more similar to the 416 in it's original configuration as is possible by law.

Do this HK, and I'll buy two! :cool:

As Woodenplank said, the uppers are out there, you just have to be willing to pay the price for one and be patient about finding one because they don't often show up for sale. And the upper is really what you're looking for as you can use an AR lower with it. So, it's more of a pricing issue. Are you willing to pay market price for one?

I've said in the past that it's the best piston AR out there; however, for most people, LWRC will work just as well for a lot less money. For that matter, for most a Daniel Defense, Colt, BCM rifle will work just fine for their needs. If you just want an HK416, that's perfectly acceptable, but there's a cost for that. HK sells plenty of them to militaries and LEAs around the world. Selling a couple here and there on the civilian market isn't a big deal for them. Because let's be honest, while a lot of people say they want one, for what they would cost, most wouldn't ever buy one. The MR556 is $2500.00. The 416 price would be more than that. And it doesn't matter whether or not it costs them more to produce it, they know that if someone really wants one, they'll pay the price for it. I doubt they sell many MR556s, much less something more expensive.

HK is a company that has always relied on military and LEA contracts for the bulk of their business. The public has been secondary for them. That's their business model and while people criticize them for it, it works for them. It's a choice. They would rather provide weapons to the military. In return, as a private citizen, if you're willing to pay the price, you get weapons that are built to the highest standard and thoroughly tested before release. Is that important? That's up to you.

WoodenPlank 10-07-2012 12:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by HalfHazzard (Post 19491954)
From: http://www.hk-usa.com/civilian_produ...56_general.asp



They talk to the engineers so the customers don't have to.

I wish the pistol grip cost less than $70, I'd put one on my AR-15 if they did.

Quote:

Originally Posted by NEOH212 (Post 19492960)
I'm with you on the pistol grip. It feels nice but isn't worth the $70 they want for it.

(I'll still probably end up buying one anyhow...:whistling:)


Psst....

Thank me later.

Same grip angle as the HK grip, and about a third the price.

NEOH212 10-07-2012 19:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by WoodenPlank (Post 19494135)
Psst....

Thank me later.

Same grip angle as the HK grip, and about a third the price.

Like I said.....

:wavey:

quichedem 10-08-2012 16:57

Do you really need an Hk? Have you considered any U.S. manufacturers that provide what you're looking for? I love my Hk just as much as the next person, but I don't feel that their take on the AR is any better than, say, LWRC. I've been fortunate enough to handle a real 416. Gemtech supressor and all. While robust, I don't think it was the end-all AR. So, to answer your question: No. I don't need to see one. Your money is your money, though.

MarcDW 10-08-2012 18:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by quichedem (Post 19498035)
...Have you considered any U.S. manufacturers ...

Isn't the MR223 made in Portsmouth, NH like the HK45??

majette 10-11-2012 18:26

chrome lining is a non-issue. most will not have their rifles in jungle humidity or shoot corrosive ammo.

hk is billing the mr in mr556 as a mATCH rIFLE, dont know of many match rifle shooters concerned about a chrome lined barrel.

i only have one ar with a chrome lined barrel and that is only because aac makes their .300blk that way.

no nitriding? have not seen anyone say it is a issue. you can always get it done later.

spend less time paying attention to what spec it doesnt/does have, buy one and spend more time shooting.

:-)

Foxtrotx1 10-11-2012 18:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by majette (Post 19508613)
chrome lining is a non-issue. most will not have their rifles in jungle humidity or shoot corrosive ammo.

hk is billing the mr in mr556 as a mATCH rIFLE, dont know of many match rifle shooters concerned about a chrome lined barrel.

i only have one ar with a chrome lined barrel and that is only because aac makes their .300blk that way.

no nitriding? have not seen anyone say it is a issue. you can always get it done later.

spend less time paying attention to what spec it doesnt/does have, buy one and spend more time shooting.

:-)

Chrome lining is not just for corrosion protection. It greatly adds in reliability. Makes the chamber much slicker. The "match rifle" is bull****. People wanted a carbine not a bench gun.

majette 10-12-2012 07:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Foxtrotx1 (Post 19508641)
Chrome lining is not just for corrosion protection. It greatly adds in reliability. Makes the chamber much slicker. The "match rifle" is bull****. People wanted a carbine not a bench gun.

i would say that hk knows how to build a reliable rifle and i would put the mr556 reliability up there with any top tier rifle maker.

keep in mind they have a govt that does not want 'weapons of war' in civilan hands. they were engineering the rifle with non standard pin locatiobs so yhe upper would not fit on standard lowers and it is why fealets can no longer sample hk416's to agencies as the uppers were being parted out to civvies after the demo.

most people who bash the mr556, even if it was identical to the 416 still would not buy one. people who do buy one know what they are getting and seem pleased with their choice.

deeHKman 10-12-2012 08:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by majette (Post 19508613)
chrome lining is a non-issue. most will not have their rifles in jungle humidity or shoot corrosive ammo.

hk is billing the mr in mr556 as a mATCH rIFLE, dont know of many match rifle shooters concerned about a chrome lined barrel.

i only have one ar with a chrome lined barrel and that is only because aac makes their .300blk that way.

no nitriding? have not seen anyone say it is a issue. you can always get it done later.

spend less time paying attention to what spec it doesnt/does have, buy one and spend more time shooting.

:-)

I agree plus metal's and ammo have come along way over the year's except for the Chinese ha :)... :thumbsup:

NEOH212 10-13-2012 20:01

You have all made great points but seriously, they could at least have nitride treated the barrel. It's not like they don't have the facilities to do it and it couldn't cost them all that much.

Better metal or not, it still can be made better and be priced close to what it is now. I just expect more from HK at that price point.

This rifle has potential but is disappointing as it currently exists.

NEOH212 10-13-2012 20:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by WoodenPlank (Post 19494135)
Psst....

Thank me later.

Same grip angle as the HK grip, and about a third the price.

For some of us, I guess it's the same thing as it is for those that pay three times what something's worth because it has the Harley Davidson logo on it.

I like it because it feels good in my hand but even more so because it says HK on it!

:wavey:


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