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-   -   Florida AG Says Carrying a Gun is Always Presumably a Crime (http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1446747)

cajun_chooter 10-07-2012 09:46

Florida AG Says Carrying a Gun is Always Presumably a Crime
 
ever since the Martin shooting in Florida... cops will be trying to deter anyone from carrying.. nuf said

Moderator Note: I moved this discussion to its own thread so as not to derail Arrested, prosecuted for incidental exposure.

Lets center it around the FL AG's opinion. Link to commentary on that is in Posts #5 and #8.

LApm9 10-07-2012 11:34

Louisiana law keys on carrying "in a manner to alarm the public".

Even if one thinks this is a poor legal description, it is a good guide line to use when selecting one's own mode of carry.

This definition would protect (though not perfectly) me from being picked up due to a printing noticeable only by a trained eye. It would also give some protection to Safepacker and fanny pack rigs.

rvrctyrngr 10-07-2012 15:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by cajun_chooter (Post 19493638)
ever since the Martin shooting in Florida... cops will be trying to deter anyone from carrying.. nuf said

Funny thing is...up to this point, the police are the only ones who got that one right.

MAC702 10-07-2012 21:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by cajun_chooter (Post 19493638)
ever since the Martin shooting in Florida... cops will be trying to deter anyone from carrying.. nuf said

How much you wanna bet TM would be alive today if Z had been openly carrying?

StogieC 10-07-2012 22:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAC702 (Post 19495784)
How much you wanna bet TM would be alive today if Z had been openly carrying?

Interesting that you live in Clark County NV. and say this. TM might be alive but Z may have been shot like Erik Scott was in Clark County if our Attorney General's Office wins another important case that is now before the FL Supreme Court.

Mackey v. State

Jeff Knox lays is out at:
http://www.allnineyards.com/2012/10/.../#comment-1007

MAC702 10-07-2012 23:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by StogieC (Post 19495807)
... shot like Erik Scott was in Clark County...

Erik Scott was carrying concealed and got made. This is extremely different than openly carrying.

I am by no means excusing his murder caused by Costco management and the police.

Bruce M 10-08-2012 07:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by cajun_chooter (Post 19493638)
ever since the Martin shooting in Florida... cops will be trying to deter anyone from carrying.. nuf said

Really? Where have officers gone on record saying no one should carry? I keep reading things like this on the internet and yet, oddly, I never seem to hear anything like it in real life.

RussP 10-08-2012 07:27

Florida AG Says Carrying a Gun is Always Presumably a Crime
 
FL Attorney General Pam Bondiís position is that anyone carrying a gun should always be presumed to be a committing a felony

Bruce M 10-08-2012 07:46

The arrest in question involved a guy with previous arrests (convicted felon) leaning on a fence with grip of the gun sticking out of his pocket (pocket carry - another thread) in a drug hole. I am uncertain what the AG's position is, although admittedly it seems messed up based on the title. But the incident in question sounds like solid Constitutional police work to me.

Bruce M 10-08-2012 07:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAC702 (Post 19495938)
Erik Scott was carrying concealed and got made. This is extremely different than openly carrying.

I am by no means excusing his murder caused by Costco management and the police.


If we are going to assign blame as to his death, let's not forget that Mr. Scott had a high level of morphine in his system and reached for his gun when he was stopped by the police. I wonder how many other people LVMPD contacted that day and other days that do not reach for guns while they are high on morphine do not get shot.

John Rambo 10-08-2012 07:51

Strange, any time I've told a cop I was carrying when it came up in conversation they didn't even bat an eye.

Whats that phrase again...tot...totall....totally...circumstances? Pam Bondi is an idiot. Pam Bondi is also not a police officer and our police officers (as long as you stay away from the Southeastern seaboard and out of St Petersburg/Clearwater) are not generally idiots.

fuzzy03cls 10-08-2012 08:30

Depends heavily on your location within Florida. I've had traffic stops where the officer didn't even ask me if I had a weapon. And then I know people that have been dragged out of the car & cuffed for LEGALLY carrying concealed while they were in a bad area or late at night.
No duty to inform in FL so I shut my mouth.

redbaron007 10-08-2012 08:47

Maybe we should assume 95% politicians are cheats and they should be arrested/investigated to prove they are not. :faint:

The AG is stretching and reaching for anything to develop reasonable suspicion. :steamed:

Sounds like a bureaucratic government leach....trying to get more power for the gubbermit!


:wavey:

red

Dragoon44 10-08-2012 09:22

One thing to bear in mind about whatever the Florida AG has to say.

The FLorida AG has opinions and that is all. unlike many other states the Fl AG has no authority whatsoever over Fl LE agencies and cannot dictate policies for LE.

The Ag's role in Fl is strictly advisory with no legal weight behind the advisory.

cowboy1964 10-08-2012 09:27

The guy is an idiot. He can say the world is flat too. Doesn't change reality.

Chris Chris 10-08-2012 09:28

The FL CCW permit is legal authorization granted to the permit holder by the State of Florida to carry a concealed weapon in the manner proscribed by FL law.

If the CCW holder is doing that in accordance with the law, then politely answering an officer's questions and producing the permit should end the matter. It's up to the permit holder to obey the laws under which the permit was issued, and not be a complete flaming jerk should an officer see what they view as a suspicious bulge under the permit holder's clothing and decide to investigate.

An officer who does choose to investigate a 'suspicious bulge' is understandably concerned about a possible crime, and about their personal safety. A little common sense and common courtesy on the CCW's part can defuse just about any such situation.

Becoming antagonistic and loudly arguing your 2nd Ammendment rights while an officer is trying to decide if he is dealing with an armed felon is rather stupid.

The Bondi opinion may presume a felony, but my CCW permit clearly states otherwise to any officer I am contacted by, once I politely show him my permit. That is the point you want to get to quickly, and without drama, in any officer initiated contact.

JW1178 10-08-2012 13:30

When anyone in the justice system who gets the "everyone is a criminal" mentality; they have either been on the job too long or are mentally defective and need to be let go.

MAC702 10-08-2012 15:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bruce M (Post 19496512)
...Mr. Scott ... reached for his gun when he was stopped by the police.....

It is not my intention to hijack this thread, but if you are going to bring this up, then clarification is in order.

Mr Scott did not have a gun in his hand. One of the police officers yelled at him to drop his gun. It's awfully hard to drop it until you reach for it.

Mistakes were made on all sides. The shoot was a bad one.

janice6 10-08-2012 15:57


Basic tenet in our country: Presumed guilty until proven otherwise.

What an *****.

Bruce M 10-08-2012 17:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAC702 (Post 19497837)
It is not my intention to hijack this thread, but if you are going to bring this up, then clarification is in order.

Mr Scott did not have a gun in his hand. One of the police officers yelled at him to drop his gun. It's awfully hard to drop it until you reach for it.

Mistakes were made on all sides. The shoot was a bad one.


Out of curiosity was there an investigation? An inquest?


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