[eamonher]

Can anyone use this round for selfdefence? Im in texas any one know if I would have a problem if I actually had to use it(hope never). Any other recommendation for a good self defense round, the platform will be a g23

[MTS532]

Can anyone use this round for selfdefence? Im in texas any one know if I would have a problem if I actually had to use it(hope never). Any other recommendation for a good self defense round, the platform will be a g23

If it's legal for you to own hollowpoint ammunition, you can own Ranger Ts. It's only Winchester's company policy not to sell to civilians.

It's perfectly legal, as long as your state or local ordinances allow hollowpoints.

[eamonher]

Originally Posted by MTS532

If it's legal for you to own hollowpoint ammunition, you can own Ranger Ts. It's only Winchester's company policy not to sell to civilians.

It's perfectly legal, as long as your state or local ordinances allow hollowpoints.

so basically if my local walmart sells hollow points? im good? or where would i search for something like that? Im in texas

[thegriz18]

Originally Posted by eamonher

so basically if my local walmart sells hollow points? im good? or where would i search for something like that? Im in texas

Texas Penal Code

To shorten your search.... Very legal in Texas.

If you can find it online for a decent price pick it up. If not The Winchester PDX1 is a very good round. I tested both PDX1 in 165 grain and RA40TA in .40 SW with very nice results. The Rangers expand more but the PDX1 (Ranger Bonded) hold together through anything.

[eamonher]

Originally Posted by thegriz18

Texas Penal Code

To shorten your search.... Very legal in Texas.

If you can find it online for a decent price pick it up. If not The Winchester PDX1 is a very good round. I tested both PDX1 in 165 grain and RA40TA in .40 SW with very nice results. The Rangers expand more but the PDX1 (Ranger Bonded) hold together through anything.

Thanks. Yeah I have some of those pdx1s but it seems kind of expensive to shoot around 200 of them just to see if they run good in my g23 and then start relying on them(about $1.00 per round) the rangers are more affordable

[thegriz18]

Originally Posted by eamonher

Thanks. Yeah I have some of those pdx1s but it seems kind of expensive to shoot around 200 of them just to see if they run good in my g23 and then start relying on them(about $1.00 per round) the rangers are more affordable

Yea the Rangers are more affordable. If you shoot a few mags through, say 40 or so you should be fine. My G23 eats everything. I simply buy some SD ammo, run 14 rounds through it to check for accuracy or function and then go about my business. If you buy the 165 grain version of PDX1 or Ranger, the WWB 165 grain FMJ load duplicates these loads very well for training. I personally am a big fan of 165 grain 40 rounds.

[eamonher]

Originally Posted by thegriz18

Yea the Rangers are more affordable. If you shoot a few mags through, say 40 or so you should be fine. My G23 eats everything. I simply buy some SD ammo, run 14 rounds through it to check for accuracy or function and then go about my business. If you buy the 165 grain version of PDX1 or Ranger, the WWB 165 grain FMJ load duplicates these loads very well for training. I personally am a big fan of 165 grain 40 rounds.

So no need for running all those rounds?

[thegriz18]

Originally Posted by eamonher

So no need for running all those rounds?

200 is a little much. If your G23 is new then maybe go through 100. If you've had it for a while and it has been jam free then I say a mag or two and you're good. If the round isn't going to feed or shoot well you will notice this in the first 15 shots typically. If the ammo feeds and then jams on the 150th round the problem probably lies with your pistol, not the ammo. Winchester LE ammo is premium stuff. You shouldn't find any issues with it. I don't/can't spend 200 bucks on premium ammo just to make sure it works in my pistol. It's a damn Glock, if rocks had primers it would shoot those too. Test your ammo, but don't waste your money.

[thegriz18]

This being said, there will be someone on here soon that will tell you that you need to run 750 rounds of the SD ammo through your pistol before you can trust your life to it. To each his own.

[eamonher]

Originally Posted by thegriz18

This being said, there will be someone on here soon that will tell you that you need to run 750 rounds of the SD ammo through your pistol before you can trust your life to it. To each his own.

Ok got it thanks. Just one last question. when they say run some of your carry ammo through your gun what are we really testing there the gun or the magazine? I mean should i run lets say two mags through the gun, same magazine or different one? does it matter?

[MTS532]

Ok got it thanks. Just one last question. when they say run some of your carry ammo through your gun what are we really testing there the gun or the magazine? I mean should i run lets say two mags through the gun, same magazine or different one? does it matter?

You're testing the gun for reliability and for accuracy at different ranges. You should use the magazines you intend to use with the gun you carry.

In this way, the gun and the magazines are tested for reliability and you will have some idea where the rounds will impact at different ranges.

[squirrelsniper]

Answers in bold print.

Originally Posted by eamonher

Can anyone use this round for selfdefence?

Yes. Winchester itself is the one that restricts sale to LEO only. Company rule, not a law.

Originally Posted by eamonher

Im in texas any one know if I would have a problem if I actually had to use it(hope never).

Some overzealous attorney could possibly try to twist why you were using ammunition that the manufacturer specified as LE-only. Of course an appropriate answer would be that you chose it for the very reason that LEO throughout the country use it and you knew you would be getting a quality product without having to simply guess at what you would be getting, and that the ammo is often available from several dealers who sell to civilians.

Originally Posted by eamonher

Any other recommendation for a good self defense round, the platform will be a g23

Federal HST and Speer Gold Dot are also excellent rounds.

[betyourlife]

Originally Posted by MTS532

You're testing the gun for reliability and for accuracy at different ranges. You should use the magazines you intend to use with the gun you carry.

In this way, the gun and the magazines are tested for reliability and you will have some idea where the rounds will impact at different ranges.

This. Just because the mags, ammo etc. are marked Glock, Winchester, etc. doesn't mean you can't get a lemon. Test the gun and mags you intend to carry, and try to use ammo from the same lot you tested when you load your mags for carry.

Test it enough until YOU'RE comfortable. The reality is that if there is a problem, it will likely surface very quickly and consistently.

[beforeobamabans]

Originally Posted by squirrelsniper

Yes. Winchester itself is the one that restricts sale to LEO only. Company rule, not a law.

So what happens is that ammo dealers who sell to both LE and the public place large orders with Winchester to service a PD order and if for some reason they don't take it all, some dealers feel free to sell any excess to the public. That's why its availability is kind of hit and miss. For some reason, there seems to be a lot of it around at the moment.

[IndyGunFreak]

750rds? That seems a little extreme, but I don't think 1-200 is out of line at all.

Only thing I don't like about Rangers, is the absolute PITA that they are to find. Personally, I'd try to get a round that is a little more available. The Winchester PDX1 is getting some really good reviews. Gold Dots are usually easy to find. The *generic* Winchester USA JHP's are also pretty good.

In the end, it doesn't really matter what round you carry, placement is what gets it done.

IGF

[beforeobamabans]

Originally Posted by IndyGunFreak

750rds? That seems a little extreme, but I don't think 1-200 is out of line at all.

Only thing I don't like about Rangers, is the absolute PITA that they are to find. Personally, I'd try to get a round that is a little more available. The Winchester PDX1 is getting some really good reviews. Gold Dots are usually easy to find. The *generic* Winchester USA JHP's are also pretty good.

In the end, it doesn't really matter what round you carry, placement is what gets it done.

IGF

PM coming at you that may help.

[G23c]

Originally Posted by thegriz18

200 is a little much. If your G23 is new then maybe go through 100. If you've had it for a while and it has been jam free then I say a mag or two and you're good. If the round isn't going to feed or shoot well you will notice this in the first 15 shots typically. If the ammo feeds and then jams on the 150th round the problem probably lies with your pistol, not the ammo. Winchester LE ammo is premium stuff. You shouldn't find any issues with it. I don't/can't spend 200 bucks on premium ammo just to make sure it works in my pistol. It's a damn Glock, if rocks had primers it would shoot those too. Test your ammo, but don't waste your money.

Griz, this is the quote of this thread.

[ZombieKing]

:lol:

That is a good line.

No ammo that I know of is banned to the general public. It's just various companies that don't want to sell to civilians which really hacks me off. I'm LEO so I can buy it but seriously what the heck is the difference? This bullet isn't that special.

If I had the money I'd start my own ammo factory and sell everything to anyone. I'd also sell it in 50 rounds boxes instead of gouging people with 20-25 round boxes. And it'd be damn good ammo too.

I'd bet you'd see Winchester start selling those super-duper "Ranger T" to civilians then...

[eamonher]

no its just a matter of where to find them

[Eagle22]

Federal HST .40 180gr Hollow points

and Federal FMJs in .40 180gr

Shoot and feel almost identical. They might be.

go plinking with FMJs box of 50 Federal Premium from wally world under $14.00

and order the Federal HST 180grs on line. ~ $25 / $27 box of 50

Practice with the FJM, carry the HSTs Use the same brand and wt.

And are not the Winchester SXT ( Same EXact Thing ) as tallons ??

just say'n

[IndyGunFreak]

Originally Posted by ZombieKing

I'd bet you'd see Winchester start selling those super-duper "Ranger T" to civilians then...

The PDX1 performs in a similar fashion.. I'm actually tempted to buy some PDX1's to try.

IGF

[glocksterr]

Originally Posted by Eagle22

are not the Winchester SXT ( Same EXact Thing ) as tallons ??

current production, they are not the same.

[thegriz18]

Winchester SXT is also being dropped from the Winchester lineup in favor of PDX1.

[Clem Eastwood]

if i go with a new round my testing proceedure is as follows:

with my carry mags, i load 2 mags of the new JHP load.

i shoot one mag through the weapon while it is perfectly clean as i would be carrying it or keeping it around the house for SD purposes.

then i run 300-500rds of the cheapest, nastiest practice ammo i can through it to get it hot and nice and dirty.

then i shoot the second mag of JHPs through it. if it doesnt have a problem with JHPs clean and dirty than i trust it. i have also heard the "you need to run a case of your carry ammo through it to make sure it wont have a problem. forget that bull*****.

[eamonher]

Originally Posted by Clem Eastwood

if i go with a new round my testing proceedure is as follows:

with my carry mags, i load 2 mags of the new JHP load.

i shoot one mag through the weapon while it is perfectly clean as i would be carrying it or keeping it around the house for SD purposes.

then i run 300-500rds of the cheapest, nastiest practice ammo i can through it to get it hot and nice and dirty.

then i shoot the second mag of JHPs through it. if it doesnt have a problem with JHPs clean and dirty than i trust it. i have also heard the "you need to run a case of your carry ammo through it to make sure it wont have a problem. forget that bull*****.

this makes sence thanks