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Old 07-07-2012, 09:53   #121
jdavionic
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SevenSixtyTwo View Post
Anyone watch football? Those guys aren't wimps. When they go down, I'm having a hard time imagining them drawing a weapon from concealment under their shirts and effectively using it. I've been tackled twice in my life. Once by a gang of thugs and once being mugged late at night out for a sandwich. Why folks think they'll be able to draw and shoot while under such an attack is beyond me. Your attacker if it ever happens isn't likely to be some limp wristed fruit loop in drag thlapping at you while you hold him back with your left hand so you can draw with your right hand. Unless you're a good size man and can fend off such an attack, you're going down really quick and drawing isn't going to happen. If you are a good size man, chances are a mugger isn't going to pick you anyhow. This perfect imagined scenario of fending off an attacker with one hand while drawing from concealment and shooting with the other is unrealistic. SA and avoidance will save your life. Don't let someone get to the point of tackling you before you give yourself a chance to draw and defend yourself. No stranger is going to get right up on you all of a sudden unless there's some kind of bad intent. Keep your distance. If he insists against your demands to back off, he's a threat. If your SA is as lax as mine was years ago and you get tackled while armed, my condolences to your family.
That's always a tough message to get to sink in, unless folks have experienced incidents where they have been attacked.

Situational awareness is critical to self defense. Ideally you avoid a conflict altogether by SA. If that's not possible, SA is the critical to having the time to prepare for the conflict. Whether the fraction of second in chambering a round will make a difference in your outcome is dependent on many variables that are unique to the person making that decision to carry in that manner.

Only you can make that decision of what is best for you - based on your environment, your equipment, your training & skills, your own risk assessment, etc. That's why this discussion will continue on & on. There is no 'one right answer' that applies to everyone.
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Last edited by jdavionic; 07-07-2012 at 09:54..
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Old 07-09-2012, 06:20   #122
SouthernBoyVA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SevenSixtyTwo View Post
Anyone watch football? Those guys aren't wimps. When they go down, I'm having a hard time imagining them drawing a weapon from concealment under their shirts and effectively using it. I've been tackled twice in my life. Once by a gang of thugs and once being mugged late at night out for a sandwich. Why folks think they'll be able to draw and shoot while under such an attack is beyond me. Your attacker if it ever happens isn't likely to be some limp wristed fruit loop in drag thlapping at you while you hold him back with your left hand so you can draw with your right hand. Unless you're a good size man and can fend off such an attack, you're going down really quick and drawing isn't going to happen. If you are a good size man, chances are a mugger isn't going to pick you anyhow. This perfect imagined scenario of fending off an attacker with one hand while drawing from concealment and shooting with the other is unrealistic. SA and avoidance will save your life. Don't let someone get to the point of tackling you before you give yourself a chance to draw and defend yourself. No stranger is going to get right up on you all of a sudden unless there's some kind of bad intent. Keep your distance. If he insists against your demands to back off, he's a threat. If your SA is as lax as mine was years ago and you get tackled while armed, my condolences to your family.
Excellent post and points.

Attacks don't usually come slowly but rather quickly with a lot of force and violence. Two things are your best friend before an attack: SA and staying away from questionable places and areas.

Great post.
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Old 07-09-2012, 06:44   #123
RussP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SevenSixtyTwo View Post
Anyone watch football? Those guys aren't wimps. When they go down, I'm having a hard time imagining them drawing a weapon from concealment under their shirts and effectively using it. I've been tackled twice in my life. Once by a gang of thugs and once being mugged late at night out for a sandwich. Why folks think they'll be able to draw and shoot while under such an attack is beyond me. Your attacker if it ever happens isn't likely to be some limp wristed fruit loop in drag thlapping at you while you hold him back with your left hand so you can draw with your right hand. Unless you're a good size man and can fend off such an attack, you're going down really quick and drawing isn't going to happen. If you are a good size man, chances are a mugger isn't going to pick you anyhow. This perfect imagined scenario of fending off an attacker with one hand while drawing from concealment and shooting with the other is unrealistic. SA and avoidance will save your life. Don't let someone get to the point of tackling you before you give yourself a chance to draw and defend yourself. No stranger is going to get right up on you all of a sudden unless there's some kind of bad intent. Keep your distance. If he insists against your demands to back off, he's a threat. If your SA is as lax as mine was years ago and you get tackled while armed, my condolences to your family.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdavionic View Post
That's always a tough message to get to sink in, unless folks have experienced incidents where they have been attacked.

Situational awareness is critical to self defense. Ideally you avoid a conflict altogether by SA. If that's not possible, SA is the critical to having the time to prepare for the conflict. Whether the fraction of second in chambering a round will make a difference in your outcome is dependent on many variables that are unique to the person making that decision to carry in that manner.

Only you can make that decision of what is best for you - based on your environment, your equipment, your training & skills, your own risk assessment, etc. That's why this discussion will continue on & on. There is no 'one right answer' that applies to everyone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthernBoyVA View Post
Excellent post and points.

Attacks don't usually come slowly but rather quickly with a lot of force and violence. Two things are your best friend before an attack: SA and staying away from questionable places and areas.

Great post.
Good posts...
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Old 07-09-2012, 07:10   #124
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Good posts...
Yes, indeed. Good posts.
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Old 07-09-2012, 10:55   #125
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Originally Posted by glock_19guy1983 View Post
an unloaded gun is useless in a fight and you may not have time or the ability to rack the slide.
+1, When handling a firearm a person should ALWAYS ASSUME that it's loaded, then it shouldn't make a difference if a round is chambered or not. A weapon must be respected, empty or not. practice and experience go a long way. I always carry mine loaded, if unloaded it's about as good as a rock.
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Old 07-09-2012, 11:38   #126
Glenn E. Meyer
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Situational awareness, spider sense, close your eyes and use the force, Luke.

Sounds good but ... It is not a guarantee and there is a good of posturing about your preternatural abilities in threads like this. Attentional research clearly shows that you cannot maintain high levels of awareness at all times. Also, the threat can come from a distance where your Aegis radar forehead wasn't scanning - as in a crowded mall rampage. You aren't scanning everyone constantly. Be real. Of course, you should be aware but saying that rationalizes unchambered carry is just silly.

Also, let's go to the range with your loved one or kid. They are on your non-gun side. The bad thing happens and your kid grabs your arm. Throw him or your loved one off and you are way behind the curve when doing your unchambered dance-a-thon. I've been there in a potential car accident. Four lane rainy highway. Four cars in a row - in front of us, a car spins out and is pinwheeling across all four lanes. Holy Whatever. Driving stick shift and my wife grabs my right arm. Wow! I throw her off and managed to not get killed. That's because Pinwheel managed to straighten out. Whee!

As far as getting your hand disabled. Well, I've trained in one handed injured techniques. Once actually with my dominant hand and forearm in a caste. I broke it just for that course. It convinced me that unchambered carry is not for me. No need to handicap myself.

So go to the range and do the video with a 5 year old plastered to your leg.
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