Jim Cirillo

Chuck54 · 07-05-2012, 09:51

Has anybody else read his book "Guns,Bullets and Gunfights" ?

I enjoyed the book and on page 57 he addresses stopping power to my satisfaction.

I won't be a spoiler and tell you about the rest of the book.

***Glockdude1*** · 07-05-2012, 10:04

I have not read the book, but in 2001 I met him at the F.L.E.T.C in Georgia. Really nice guy. Defiantly knew what he was talking about.

Chuck54 · 07-05-2012, 11:12

Was he a guest speaker ?

***Glockdude1*** · 07-05-2012, 11:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuck54

Was he a guest speaker ?

Yes he was.

It was in March 2001.

Zombie Steve · 07-05-2012, 12:28

We went to different high schools together.

Seriously, I read it, liked it, and agree with what he said about it.

cowboy1964 · 07-05-2012, 12:47

Is that the book written back before the advent of today's modern hollowpoints?

We all know 9mm FMJ sucks. So does .45 ACP.

G26S239 · 07-05-2012, 12:59

I had it and loaned it someone and never got it back. Cirillo was a true badass but his views on ammo led him to endorse the ultra light ultra fast RCBD ammo before he died. I disagree with his conclusion there but he won plenty of shootouts.

4949shooter · 07-05-2012, 14:44

Jim Cirillo and I believe Mas Ayoob both avocate(d) the Glock 30 as a carry / fighting pistol.

WiskyT · 07-05-2012, 18:08

He was a badass in real life, and an amazing shooter. I watched a video of his at my partner's house and he was shooting with the gun at chest height due to his injured shoulders. He was just indexing the gun without using the sights and it was like watching an exhibition shooter.

Tiro Fijo · 07-05-2012, 18:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by cowboy1964

Is that the book written back before the advent of today's modern hollowpoints?...

He had used at one time or another 9mm +p+ and liked it. He also swore by the M1 Carbine with 110 gr. HP's and said it put people down right now. The again, he loved his own .45 ACP full WC bullets for the 1st shot in a 1911 as well as full wadcutters in .44 & .45 DA revolvers. These of course were his own handloads in the days before the ACLU and the hand wringing Liberals for the most part

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4949shooter

Jim Cirillo and I believe Mas Ayoob both avocate(d) the Glock 30 as a carry / fighting pistol.

At the end of his life he carried a Glock G30 & a G27 as a backup.

Quote:

Originally Posted by WiskyT

...he was shooting with the gun at chest height due to his injured shoulders. He was just indexing the gun without using the sights...

I shoot the same way due to a bad shoulder and also because like Jim I learned in the old days of the REAL Weaver Stance with DA revolvers:

The REAL Weaver Shooting Stance - YouTube

PghJim · 07-06-2012, 10:49

I have not read the book, so please share his thoughts on stopping power. I know in the NYC stake out squad he was limited to a 38 and had Super Vel make him special 110gr HP's that would be considered +p. I believe he attended autopsies to see what performed and what did not. I think he was in the class of light and fast bullets.

Again, please share his toughts in the book on this subject.

Droid noob · 07-06-2012, 10:59

I just started reading this book. He loves those wadcutters. I keep meaning to get more info on those. I could've sworn he referenced wc performing better than hp at the time.

Are wadcutters banned now? I assume today's hollow points are way better.

Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

SCmasterblaster · 07-10-2012, 12:36

JC died in a July 2007 auto accident.

**robhic** · 07-10-2012, 16:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Droid noob

Are wadcutters banned now? I assume today's hollow points are way better.

I think that's subjective. I've read where the WC is pretty accurate for a flat-nosed bullet. And they hit like a freight train! With enough power behind it, a WC is a formidable round.

I'm sure someone with a lot more and better info will chime in.

***Glockdude1*** · 07-10-2012, 17:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Droid noob

Are wadcutters banned now? I assume today's hollow points are way better.

Wadcutters are not banned, never have been. They are used by target shooters.

Zombie Steve · 07-10-2012, 17:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glockdude1

Wadcutters are not banned, never have been. They are used by target shooters.

Maybe the most accurate handgun bullet out there. Trouble is keeping them stabilized out past 20-25 yards, hence the invention of the semi-wadcutter, which is the majority of what I cast and shoot today.

Read up on Elmer Keith if you want to know more about that style of bullet. They still work.

As far as hollow points being better... meh. I'll get by without 'em.

Tiro Fijo · 07-10-2012, 17:27

Remember, Cirillo liked WC's in .44 & .45 cal. These were his own hot handloads and not cream puff over the counter crap.

countrygun · 07-10-2012, 17:41

His comments and the quotes from him in the very first "Combat Handguns" magazine issues were priceless.

Quite the gunfighter. After all of his shootings on the Stake Out Squad he said "I never so much as nicked a can of beans".

remember about the wadcutters, they were also HBs (Hollow Based) great at 25 yds but they got shakey past there in most guns. The SWC does the same thing on a paper target and really delivers on game in the larger calibers.

You can "shoot for the far shoulder/hip" with them and probably get there

R*E · 07-10-2012, 18:47

All of his books have been excellent reading. Tales of the stakeout squad is my favorite.

He designed a bullet similar to Hornady's critical defense. IIRC it was a hollowpoint equipped with all bearing to ensure expansion. It was sold commercially but didn't catch on. He was ahead of his time.

***Glockdude1*** · 07-10-2012, 23:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by R*E

All of his books have been excellent reading. Tales of the stakeout squad is my favorite.

He designed a bullet similar to Hornady's critical defense. IIRC it was a hollowpoint equipped with all bearing to ensure expansion. It was sold commercially but didn't catch on. He was ahead of his time.

Sounds like the Pow'r ball round.

Trigger Finger · 07-11-2012, 16:31

Slight Spoilers***

This is a great book and I have read it twice and keep referring back to it several times each year. Especially the last 7 years on the job when I worked the Surveillance Unit.

Jim Cirillo liked, very much, the S&W 4546, (p92). This a a 4500 series of Smith's that is double action only. This is one of the things that got my unit using the S&W 4500 series of pistols!

Cirilo also liked the 41 Magnum on a S&W frame a Dan Wesson barrel and with his own designed and patented wadcutter bullets for it and the 44. He also liked the 44 Magnum with a 4 or 5 inch barrel double action.

It says in this book that if he were still on the stakeout squad he would use a Glock 21 as his primary gun!! (p116).

He also has a very good section on shooting handguns.

Cirillo says several times in this book that the main considerations with a handgun shooting are 1) Construction and configuration of the bullet. 2) Diameter. 3) Velocity. and 4) Weight!!! (p47).

I think I might read this book again!

Chuck54 · 07-11-2012, 16:51

I get something out of it every time I read it and use it for reference too.

PghJim · 07-12-2012, 22:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glockdude1

Sounds like the Pow'r ball round.

The ammo Jim helped develop was the RBCD Performance Plus and it is still available.

http://www.rbcd.net/home.cfm

agtman · 07-14-2012, 05:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4949shooter

Jim Cirillo and I believe Mas Ayoob both avocate(d) the Glock 30 as a carry / fighting pistol.

Actually, in some gun mag articles hyping the RCBD ammo that G26S239 mentioned, he was using the G20 and G29 and shooting their 10mm product. In another gun-rag piece, he was shown CCW-ing a G29 ...

Just FYI ...

4949shooter · 07-14-2012, 06:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by agtman

Actually, in some gun mag articles hyping the RCBD ammo that G26S239 mentioned, he was using the G20 and G29 and shooting their 10mm product. In another gun-rag piece, he was shown CCW-ing a G29 ...

Just FYI ...

10mm...Excellent!