GlockTalk.com
Home Forums Classifieds Blogs Today's Posts Search Social Groups



  
SIGN-UP
Notices

Glock Talk
Welcome To The Glock Talk Forums.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-26-2012, 09:36   #51
frank4570
Feral human
 
frank4570's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Cul Va
Posts: 16,679
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunnut 45/454 View Post
So everyone is ok with the Scumbag that will not work to support his six wives that have ten kids and lives in Government housing ,on welfare and food stamps? You going to pay more in taxes just so they can live the life they want?
Compared to the bazillion single moms in the trailer parks and the ghetto?


How in the world do you figure that being a polygamist causes a person to become a deadbeat? Isn't that like how guns turn people into murderers?
__________________
Fear your government.
"Rats aren't creepy, experimenting on them IS." Emilie Autumn.

For too long people have said "screw NY, IL, etc" or "that'll never happen here." Yes, it will eventually. If we dont start standing up together now, it will never stop.-ilgunguygt
frank4570 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 09:39   #52
SPIN2010
Searching ...
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: On the move ... again!
Posts: 1,840
Quote:
Originally Posted by NMG26 View Post
I'm not against either. Why have such laws? .
That is a great question!

Here is one problematic view of polygamy issue:

A person can marry several wives and they all can be on the system as none of them "have" to work (making a great number to set benefit amounts). Let's use a family of six as an example (hubby and his five wives). It would make that sixteen people to draw off your taxes by the act of polygamy if they just decide to have two kids per wife.

Sound good? Not to me.

EDIT: I see I got beat to the punch, good post gunnut 45

Last edited by SPIN2010; 09-26-2012 at 09:40..
SPIN2010 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 09:49   #53
frank4570
Feral human
 
frank4570's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Cul Va
Posts: 16,679
Blog Entries: 1
Why is that different than a piece of crap in the trailer park who gets a bunch of women pregnant and they all are on welfare RIGHT NOW?

If you are saying you don't want MORE people on that system, then ok, I get that. But I don't see how making polygamy illegal accomplishes that. The women are just as pregnant and on govt assistance whether they are married or not. I think?


Quote:
Originally Posted by SPIN2010 View Post
That is a great question!

Here is one problematic view of polygamy issue:

A person can marry several wives and they all can be on the system as none of them "have" to work (making a great number to set benefit amounts). Let's use a family of six as an example (hubby and his five wives). It would make that sixteen people to draw off your taxes by the act of polygamy if they just decide to have two kids per wife.

Sound good? Not to me.

EDIT: I see I got beat to the punch, good post gunnut 45
__________________
Fear your government.
"Rats aren't creepy, experimenting on them IS." Emilie Autumn.

For too long people have said "screw NY, IL, etc" or "that'll never happen here." Yes, it will eventually. If we dont start standing up together now, it will never stop.-ilgunguygt
frank4570 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 09:53   #54
Paul7
New Guy
 
Paul7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: East of Eden
Posts: 13,342
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDDL-UP View Post
There will be no end to it as long as they get to "re-define" marriage. It sure looks like government shouldn't be involved AT ALL!

My opposition to homosexual "marriage" is largely because a homosexual couple will raise children with a warped sense of relationships between the sexes. Now.... if children weren't involved then who really cares?
Exactly. Two women can't teach a boy how to be a man.
__________________
I dont believe that people should be able to own guns. Obama to John R. Lott Jr. in a private conversation at the University of Chicago.
Paul7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 10:09   #55
frank4570
Feral human
 
frank4570's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Cul Va
Posts: 16,679
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul7 View Post
Exactly. Two women can't teach a boy how to be a man.
Really? What knowledge is there that a human male can teach, but a human female can not?
__________________
Fear your government.
"Rats aren't creepy, experimenting on them IS." Emilie Autumn.

For too long people have said "screw NY, IL, etc" or "that'll never happen here." Yes, it will eventually. If we dont start standing up together now, it will never stop.-ilgunguygt
frank4570 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 10:19   #56
Gundude
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 6,662
Quote:
Originally Posted by SPIN2010 View Post
That is a great question!

Here is one problematic view of polygamy issue:

A person can marry several wives and they all can be on the system as none of them "have" to work (making a great number to set benefit amounts). Let's use a family of six as an example (hubby and his five wives). It would make that sixteen people to draw off your taxes by the act of polygamy if they just decide to have two kids per wife.

Sound good? Not to me.

EDIT: I see I got beat to the punch, good post gunnut 45
So these people wouldn't exist or "draw off my taxes" if it wasn't for polygamy? What is it about them being married that suddenly makes me have to pay for it?
Gundude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 10:32   #57
Rabbit994
Senior Member
 
Rabbit994's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 1,830
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul7 View Post
Exactly. Two women can't teach a boy how to be a man.
Maybe not, but neither can single mothers. I think two people in loving relationship have better chance then single mother who is constantly trying to find love and failing.

For those who are lamenting the break down of traditional families, I'm not sure what to tell you. That broke down a long time ago and gay marriage is not going to do any damage that hasn't been already done. You can blame godless heathens (that's fine, I get blamed for alot of things), lack of school prayer, women voting or the 60s. At some point, to quote John Ross "You have to stop building sand castles and take up surfing."

As for original post about polygamy, I don't really see the issue with it because at least they are trying to be all proper about it.

Sam, how many calls have you taken about BS Baby Mama drama that involves two ladies fighting over the same dude? Polygamy is here whether or not it's official.
Rabbit994 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 14:53   #58
frank4570
Feral human
 
frank4570's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Cul Va
Posts: 16,679
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rabbit994 View Post

Sam, how many calls have you taken about BS Baby Mama drama that involves two ladies fighting over the same dude? Polygamy is here whether or not it's official.
That might be sig line material right there.
__________________
Fear your government.
"Rats aren't creepy, experimenting on them IS." Emilie Autumn.

For too long people have said "screw NY, IL, etc" or "that'll never happen here." Yes, it will eventually. If we dont start standing up together now, it will never stop.-ilgunguygt
frank4570 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 15:03   #59
Bren
NRA Life Member
 
Bren's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 33,434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rabbit994 View Post
Sam, how many calls have you taken about BS Baby Mama drama that involves two ladies fighting over the same dude? Polygamy is here whether or not it's official.
True. The reason I object to the laws here in Kentucky against both Bigamy/Polygamy and snake handling is that they both penalize something on purely religious grounds.

You can have a house full of snakes and handle them all you want, in Kentucky, but if you do it during a religious ceremony it becomes a crime - clearly an unconstitutional law, where the practice of religion is the only difference between legal and illegal.

The same is true of bigamy/polygamy - as many men and women as want to can live together, have sex, etc., but if they have a religious ceremony to declare themselves married, they become criminals (it apparently doesn't require an actual government marriage license and certificate to make it a crime). Obviously, that same argument applies equally to gay marriage, except that gay marriage isn't a crime.
__________________
Open carry activists are to gun rights what the Westboro Baptist Church is to free speech.
Bren is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 15:10   #60
Beware Owner
NOT a victim.
 
Beware Owner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 9,143
And what is your opinion of gays fighting to lower age of consent laws so they can have sex with minors? If they can have sex with them, they'll be able to marry them, too.
__________________
Free men have arms; slaves do not. Tyrants mistrust the people, hence they deprive them of arms.
Criminals for Gun Control
Myth: Gun Control Reduces Crime
Homegrown Terrorism
Beware Owner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 15:34   #61
Gunnut 45/454
Senior Member
 
Gunnut 45/454's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 14,039
frank4570
I see no difference at all! Still dead beats feeding off my tax dollars! Cause the Government lets them! Where as if the welfare queens didn't get one dime more for having a baby out of wedlock then I'd bet money she wouldn't have those children! If they made the dead beat dad pay for those kids they wouldn't go around knocking up women for fun! Would not give them the tax break for a dependant child either unless they prove it was born in wedlock or the father was named! I know I'm a heartless SOB so be it!
__________________
Gunnut45/454-One shot one kill!

Last edited by Gunnut 45/454; 09-26-2012 at 15:37..
Gunnut 45/454 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 16:00   #62
frank4570
Feral human
 
frank4570's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Cul Va
Posts: 16,679
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beware Owner View Post
And what is your opinion of gays fighting to lower age of consent laws so they can have sex with minors? If they can have sex with them, they'll be able to marry them, too.
Exactly the same as my opinion of straight people who fight to lower the age of consent laws. Children can't give consent. There is nothing complicated about it.
__________________
Fear your government.
"Rats aren't creepy, experimenting on them IS." Emilie Autumn.

For too long people have said "screw NY, IL, etc" or "that'll never happen here." Yes, it will eventually. If we dont start standing up together now, it will never stop.-ilgunguygt
frank4570 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 16:03   #63
frank4570
Feral human
 
frank4570's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Cul Va
Posts: 16,679
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunnut 45/454 View Post
frank4570
I see no difference at all! Still dead beats feeding off my tax dollars! Cause the Government lets them! Where as if the welfare queens didn't get one dime more for having a baby out of wedlock then I'd bet money she wouldn't have those children! If they made the dead beat dad pay for those kids they wouldn't go around knocking up women for fun! Would not give them the tax break for a dependant child either unless they prove it was born in wedlock or the father was named! I know I'm a heartless SOB so be it!
If we stopped paying people to have children, a bunch of our problems would just go away, and our culture would change for the better.
__________________
Fear your government.
"Rats aren't creepy, experimenting on them IS." Emilie Autumn.

For too long people have said "screw NY, IL, etc" or "that'll never happen here." Yes, it will eventually. If we dont start standing up together now, it will never stop.-ilgunguygt
frank4570 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 17:09   #64
G17Jake
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 7,135
Quote:
Originally Posted by countrygun View Post
"Polygamy": A Crime that is also it's own punishment.
G17Jake is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 17:27   #65
jtull7
CLM Number 289
Pistolero
 
jtull7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico
Posts: 6,829
A cult is an unpopular religion, whereas a religion is a popular cult.
__________________
Cocked, locked, and ready to rock!

Every day I face Ogden, Utah, and pray that God might bless John Moses Browning.

Outpost Member #69 I collect and shoot many fine firearms. CCW: NM, CT, and NH. N5JHT. WFR. Former LEO. SAR. Bilateral trans-tibial amputee. Survivor of bubonic plague. Tough sum-*****.
jtull7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 17:31   #66
Davegrave
Dapper Dan
 
Davegrave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: NW IN
Posts: 5,752


Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunnut 45/454 View Post
So everyone is ok with the Scumbag that will not work to support his six wives that have ten kids and lives in Government housing ,on welfare and food stamps? You going to pay more in taxes just so they can live the life they want?
I hate this argument so much that it causes me physical pain. I hate it now, I hate it when it's applied to seatbelt and helmet laws. It's so wrong. It's everything that's wrong with humanity. It's every bit of illogical, horrendous thinking that ever get's spewed out to the public as truth.

If you don't like paying for peoples stupid mistakes, e.g. having children they can't afford, having children with multiple wives they can't afford, getting in car wrecks with no insurance- why is the answer in your mind ALWAYS to legislate away their right to make a mistake, and not to legislate away your duty to pay for it????

I can't stand it. THAT is the problem. Not seat belt laws, not consenting ADULTS (this has nothing to do with kids) living the sexual existence that brings them to peace...the problem is you paying for that. Legislate that away.

But I suspect people that use this argument don't care about paying as much as they care about forcing people to live the life that they themselves see fit. The tax money is just a pathetic excuse that sound less nosy than "I hate what you do and my way is better".
__________________
YOU FORGOT YOUR BRIEFCASE!!!
Davegrave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 17:59   #67
countrygun
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 17,068
Quote:
Originally Posted by Davegrave View Post
I hate this argument so much that it causes me physical pain. I hate it now, I hate it when it's applied to seatbelt and helmet laws. It's so wrong. It's everything that's wrong with humanity. It's every bit of illogical, horrendous thinking that ever get's spewed out to the public as truth.

If you don't like paying for peoples stupid mistakes, e.g. having children they can't afford, having children with multiple wives they can't afford, getting in car wrecks with no insurance- why is the answer in your mind ALWAYS to legislate away their right to make a mistake, and not to legislate away your duty to pay for it????

I can't stand it. THAT is the problem. Not seat belt laws, not consenting ADULTS (this has nothing to do with kids) living the sexual existence that brings them to peace...the problem is you paying for that. Legislate that away.

But I suspect people that use this argument don't care about paying as much as they care about forcing people to live the life that they themselves see fit. The tax money is just a pathetic excuse that sound less nosy than "I hate what you do and my way is better".

The first three paragraphs are laced with intellectual dishonesty. You obviously well know that this Country and Society do not vote to pull the carpet out from under a group once "we" have decided that they are "special" or require help. You are obviously intelligent enough to be aware of this and know that it is an unrealistic expectation.

After constructing your three paragraph "straw man" you demolish it by saying you don't "think they care about paying as much as they care about forcing people to live....blah...blah"

Just so you can say that you think it's all about morals any way, was that it?
countrygun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 18:31   #68
Davegrave
Dapper Dan
 
Davegrave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: NW IN
Posts: 5,752


Quote:
Originally Posted by countrygun View Post
The first three paragraphs are laced with intellectual dishonesty. You obviously well know that this Country and Society do not vote to pull the carpet out from under a group once "we" have decided that they are "special" or require help. You are obviously intelligent enough to be aware of this and know that it is an unrealistic expectation.

After constructing your three paragraph "straw man" you demolish it by saying you don't "think they care about paying as much as they care about forcing people to live....blah...blah"

Just so you can say that you think it's all about morals any way, was that it?

The first three paragraphs are as intellectually honest as can be. The absolute epitome. Saying that if you don't want to pay for someone...then fight to not have to pay for them, don't instead fight to illegalize activities that you MIGHT lead to you having to pay for them.

Those paragraphs broke down and trivialized the "I don't want to pay for it argument"

The last paragraph was for the majority who I think use that argument falsely. I think most who say that only say it because it seems more socially acceptable than voicing their true concerns.

There's no more to it than that.
__________________
YOU FORGOT YOUR BRIEFCASE!!!
Davegrave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 18:37   #69
countrygun
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 17,068
Quote:
Originally Posted by Davegrave View Post
The first three paragraphs are as intellectually honest as can be. The absolute epitome. Saying that if you don't want to pay for someone...then fight to not have to pay for them, don't instead fight to illegalize activities that you MIGHT lead to you having to pay for them.

Those paragraphs broke down and trivialized the "I don't want to pay for it argument"

The last paragraph was for the majority who I think use that argument falsely. I think most who say that only say it because it seems more socially acceptable than voicing their true concerns.

There's no more to it than that.
Show me an honest example of the people/society/government turning someone "out on their own" once they have become, in some way, "protected" by society.


The "I don't want to pay for it" argument is very valid and I do believe a large percentage of the folks that put it forth believe it, and simply don't want more "Protected" groups on the "payroll" since there are no examples of us being able to get them off.

I think you have a prediliction to try and blame some type of "bigotry"
countrygun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 18:58   #70
Davegrave
Dapper Dan
 
Davegrave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: NW IN
Posts: 5,752


Quote:
Originally Posted by countrygun View Post
Show me an honest example of the people/society/government turning someone "out on their own" once they have become, in some way, "protected" by society.


The "I don't want to pay for it" argument is very valid and I do believe a large percentage of the folks that put it forth believe it, and simply don't want more "Protected" groups on the "payroll" since there are no examples of us being able to get them off.

I think you have a prediliction to try and blame some type of "bigotry"
I'm not saying we HAVE turned them away yet. I'm saying it's what we should be fighting for.

It seems the same, at least in my eyes, as all of our arguments against gun control. I'm assuming you are in the GT majority on that subject since you're here.

We all say, "regulate the ones causing damage". "Prosecute the criminals, not he innocent citizens exercising their rights".

We all (or so we say) use guns responsibly and want the right to keep doing so to remain un-infringed. The crimes committed shouldn't affect US. We aren't doing wrong.

Same with polygamists. They aren't necessarily doing wrong. They just may affect you badly IF THEY DO. So why not worry about protecting yourself from the IF THEY DO part of it, and not the part that involved consenting adults that aren't infringing on your rights or your paycheck?

I'm sure we'll never see eye to eye on this. I've never seen a debate here end with someone changing their mind. But I enjoy it either way and bare you no ill feeling for your opinions. I'm a hypocrite on more than a few issues, but unwavering opinions isn't one of them.
__________________
YOU FORGOT YOUR BRIEFCASE!!!
Davegrave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 19:05   #71
frank4570
Feral human
 
frank4570's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Cul Va
Posts: 16,679
Blog Entries: 1
Maybe we should take a vote. "How many people would be ok with making polygamy legal as long as you don't have to pay for the children."
I absolutely think that way. But there are a lot of people who want it to be illegal "because it's just wrong."



Quote:
Originally Posted by countrygun View Post
Show me an honest example of the people/society/government turning someone "out on their own" once they have become, in some way, "protected" by society.


The "I don't want to pay for it" argument is very valid and I do believe a large percentage of the folks that put it forth believe it, and simply don't want more "Protected" groups on the "payroll" since there are no examples of us being able to get them off.

I think you have a prediliction to try and blame some type of "bigotry"
__________________
Fear your government.
"Rats aren't creepy, experimenting on them IS." Emilie Autumn.

For too long people have said "screw NY, IL, etc" or "that'll never happen here." Yes, it will eventually. If we dont start standing up together now, it will never stop.-ilgunguygt
frank4570 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 19:37   #72
janice6
Platinum Membership
NRA
 
janice6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: minnesota
Posts: 17,281


Quote:
Originally Posted by NMG26 View Post
Well they can't hire their own lawyers so there is little chance............



.


True. Lawyers always make the difference.


(maybe a pubic defender?)
__________________
janice6

"Peace is that brief, glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading". Anonymous

Earp: Not everyone who knows you hates you.
DOC: I know it ain't always easy bein' my friend....but I'll BE THERE when you need me.
janice6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 19:42   #73
OctoberRust
Anti-Federalist
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Texas
Posts: 5,642
Quote:
Originally Posted by NMG26 View Post
I'm not against either. Why have such laws?




.

WHAT ?!?! POLYGAMY AND HOMOSEXUALITY?!@#!


Political Issues
OctoberRust is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 19:44   #74
steveksux
Massive Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 13,397
First gay marriage, now polygamy; what next?

Dogs and cats living together!!!!!


Randy
steveksux is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2012, 20:08   #75
Davegrave
Dapper Dan
 
Davegrave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: NW IN
Posts: 5,752


Quote:
Originally Posted by jtull7 View Post
A cult is an unpopular religion, whereas a religion is a popular cult.
I like the quote, and I'm paraphrasing...

"The difference between a cult and a religion is: In a cult there is someone at the top of the chain who know's it's a scam. In a religion, that person is dead."
__________________
YOU FORGOT YOUR BRIEFCASE!!!
Davegrave is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:24.



Homepage
FAQ
Forums
Calendar
Advertise
Gallery
GT Wiki
GT Blogs
Social Groups
Classifieds


Users Currently Online: 724
201 Members
523 Guests

Most users ever online: 2,244
Nov 11, 2013 at 11:42