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Old 10-03-2012, 11:26   #26
SCmasterblaster
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I'm not big on service calibers for any large game animal. Consider they are marhginal for stopping a 200# man, It's not agood choice for those that take hunting seriously. If you want a 25yd handgun shot, start toting a 41 or 44mag.
A S&W Model 629 6-inch barrelled .44 Magnum revolver.
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Old 10-03-2012, 17:25   #27
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Originally Posted by fredj338 View Post
I'm not big on service calibers for any large game animal. Consider they are marhginal for stopping a 200# man, It's not agood choice for those that take hunting seriously. If you want a 25yd handgun shot, start toting a 41 or 44mag.
I've shot lots of deer with the .44 magnum from a hand gun. A couple of them were a little over 100 yards.

Compare the ballistics of the winchester 240 gr jsp at 100 yards with the ballistics of a .40 S&W at the muzzle. Almost identical.

Under 25 yards I'd have no problem with a service caliber handgun on deer.

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Old 10-03-2012, 17:33   #28
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Originally Posted by vafish View Post
I've shot lots of deer with the .44 magnum from a hand gun. A couple of them were a little over 100 yards.

Compare the ballistics of the winchester 240 gr jsp at 100 yards with the ballistics of a .40 S&W at the muzzle. Almost identical.

Under 25 yards I'd have no problem with a service caliber handgun on deer.

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Your decision, again, service calibers are barely adequate for their purpose of fight stopper, not really a good choice for any large animal IMO. Sure it can be done but why, there are better choices. A 4" " 41 or 44mag or 45colt carries almsot as well & offers quite a lot more in penetration & wounding.
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Old 10-04-2012, 10:09   #29
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Originally Posted by vafish View Post
I've shot lots of deer with the .44 magnum from a hand gun. A couple of them were a little over 100 yards.

Compare the ballistics of the winchester 240 gr jsp at 100 yards with the ballistics of a .40 S&W at the muzzle. Almost identical.

Under 25 yards I'd have no problem with a service caliber handgun on deer.

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Glad to hear your opinion. I am going to go deer hunting with a 6-inch .44 Magnum here in VT this November.
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Old 10-04-2012, 13:44   #30
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Get a glock 20sf and call it a day, load it with underwood 200gr ammo and have at it!
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Old 10-04-2012, 14:42   #31
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Yeah you could, but why go buy the G20sf and get invested into another cartridge when the 9mm or better yet the .40 will kill a deer just fine?
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Old 10-05-2012, 06:20   #32
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The biggest reason service caliber cartridges appear to not work very well is combat shot placement. Combat and hunting are two different environments. In combat shots are fired rapidly with rudimentary aiming a good deal of time, resulting in less than ideal shot placement. Hunting generally produces one well aimed shot.

In a defensive situation, the aggressor continuing to fight for several seconds or minutes after being shot is unacceptable. The same is not true in hunting. Even when shot by high power rifles deer can still run for a few seconds after being struck. The environments are totally different and comparing them is really apples to oranges.

At 20 yards, a well aimed shot from a .40 will dispatch a deer. That is contingent upon proper bullet selection. Arrows do it with 1/4 the kinetic energy. The wounding mechanism for an arrow and a pistol bullet are very similar. Cut and crush.
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Old 10-05-2012, 10:30   #33
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The biggest reason service caliber cartridges appear to not work very well is combat shot placement. Combat and hunting are two different environments. In combat shots are fired rapidly with rudimentary aiming a good deal of time, resulting in less than ideal shot placement. Hunting generally produces one well aimed shot.

In a defensive situation, the aggressor continuing to fight for several seconds or minutes after being shot is unacceptable. The same is not true in hunting. Even when shot by high power rifles deer can still run for a few seconds after being struck. The environments are totally different and comparing them is really apples to oranges.

At 20 yards, a well aimed shot from a .40 will dispatch a deer. That is contingent upon proper bullet selection. Arrows do it with 1/4 the kinetic energy. The wounding mechanism for an arrow and a pistol bullet are very similar. Cut and crush.
I never thought of the similarity between arrow wounds and handgun wounds. Thanks!
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Old 10-06-2012, 02:46   #34
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Neither the 9mm or the .40 would be my first choice for deer hunting, not even for a 20 yard shot. I'm sure it can and has been done thou. The above poster recommended a G20. If I were to use a Glock to hunt that would be the cartridge I'd use with a 6" barrel and propper hot 10mm loads. Of the choices the G23 would work better of the 2 with hot loads, check into what a Lone Wolf 6" barrel would cost. Nothing worse than losing a wounded 10 pointer due to a poorly aimed shot or from a weak caliber. (not to imply your aim sucks but I've seen it too many times at the hunt club on both counts). I may be biased since I use a .44 Super Black Hawk with a 7 3/4" barrel and 300gr flat nosed hard casts on the Ga deer/hogs. Good hunting and let us know how you make out.
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Old 10-06-2012, 07:57   #35
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yankee2718 to add to what you pointed out, a compund bow set with a draw weight of 35 lbs has the apprx the same or more penetration of a 357 magnun round.
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Old 10-06-2012, 08:44   #36
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yankee2718 to add to what you pointed out, a compund bow set with a draw weight of 35 lbs has the apprx the same or more penetration of a 357 magnun round.
That's why bullet selection is important. A deep penetrating bullet like an XTP is required.
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Old 10-06-2012, 09:41   #37
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yankee2718 to add to what you pointed out, a compund bow set with a draw weight of 35 lbs has the apprx the same or more penetration of a 357 magnun round.

Care to how you came to that conclusion? And what are you comparing the so call arrow to? FMJ,HC,JHP,JSP,Wadcutter,Keither, FN,etc.......

Remember arrows kill via bloodlost & wide wound track done to the animal. Bullets from handguns do not typically generate a permanent wide wound channel to a animal. And typically don't produce major blood lost

Penetration in a bullet is different than that of a requirement of a Arrow with a broadhead fixed or mechanical.
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Old 10-06-2012, 09:46   #38
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A Glock 17 or a Glock 23? Either would accompany my .30-06. Maybe use it if I was presented a shot under 20 yards.
First, check the law. It is not likely that either the 17 or 23 are legal for use in hunting deer. Next, get real. For other than a very close shot, neither the 17 nor the 23 are "hunting capable." Yes, even with a .22 top unit on the 17, you could kill a deer... if you got lucky. But hunting deer is not about being a stunt player. It's about killing a deer in a humane manner. A .30-06 will in almost any instance kill very humanely. Neither of the two pistols you've listed are in that class.
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Old 10-06-2012, 11:44   #39
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First, check the law. It is not likely that either the 17 or 23 are legal for use in hunting deer. Next, get real. For other than a very close shot, neither the 17 nor the 23 are "hunting capable." Yes, even with a .22 top unit on the 17, you could kill a deer... if you got lucky. But hunting deer is not about being a stunt player. It's about killing a deer in a humane manner. A .30-06 will in almost any instance kill very humanely. Neither of the two pistols you've listed are in that class.
I'd use my G17 or finishing shots only.
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Old 10-06-2012, 17:58   #40
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To answer your question NOWAY. the bullet would be a fmj and my formula is in the field experiance hunting deer with said weapons.
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Old 10-06-2012, 18:26   #41
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Why on earth would you consider taking a 9mm to a deer? One, I am not even sure its legal, so the game warden may get with you if you try. Two, it is not humane, and would require multiple hits. Three, you might end up tracking it for a long time and never finding it it.
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Old 10-06-2012, 22:52   #42
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Both are legal. Either will work in the right situation with the proper application.
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Old 10-07-2012, 16:45   #43
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What you should be looking at is a G20SF for the intended use. I've taken a doe with mine at 50 yards in an extended LWD 6.02" barrel and handloaded 180XTP @ 1300fps. The doe dropped on the spot, and the bullet completely penetrated.

If you want a double duty SD woods gun the G22/G23 would be the way to go for finishing shots, but I wouldn't try using it as a primary. .
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Old 10-07-2012, 19:56   #44
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Unless perhaps you're packing a big revolver (.44 Mag, heavy .45 Colt and up), most handguns will not be your primary hunting tool, 10mm included and the OP stated that the pistol would accompany his rifle. Deer aren't exactly hard to kill, and service calibers will get the job done up close, which is more an issue of shot placement and not power. We all know a .22 will kill deer, so it's obvious a 9mm or anything bigger will too, heck there's a video of a girl killing a 900+lb hog with a .40.
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Old 10-07-2012, 20:26   #45
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Unless perhaps you're packing a big revolver (.44 Mag, heavy .45 Colt and up), most handguns will not be your primary hunting tool, 10mm included and the OP stated that the pistol would accompany his rifle. Deer aren't exactly hard to kill, and service calibers will get the job done up close, which is more an issue of shot placement and not power. We all know a .22 will kill deer, so it's obvious a 9mm or anything bigger will too, heck there's a video of a girl killing a 900+lb hog with a .40.
I've seen the video of the girl killing the hog. The results in that video are the exact reason a 40S&W should not be used. She had to use the entire magazine. Pumping round after round into a game animal is unethical. Also there is a significant difference between a 40S&W in a compact, and a warm handloaded 10mm in an extended 6" barrel IMO. In this format the 10mm beats out the 357Mag. and is moving into lower end 41 Mag territory.
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Old 10-07-2012, 21:39   #46
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I've seen the video of the girl killing the hog. The results in that video are the exact reason a 40S&W should not be used. She had to use the entire magazine. Pumping round after round into a game animal is unethical. Also there is a significant difference between a 40S&W in a compact, and a warm handloaded 10mm in an extended 6" barrel IMO. In this format the 10mm beats out the 357Mag. and is moving into lower end 41 Mag territory.
At the ranges you used the pistol, sure, you're correct. I don't plan on using it for anything longer than 20-25 yards. Anything longer and I'll just use my rifle. I just don't see the point in blasting a deer with an '06 at 10 yards when a well placed 40 will do the trick. Also, using a scope, even at 3x at close ranges is difficult. I used to live in a shotgun only state. We had thick woods and normally ranges were short, maybe 75 yards at the most. A lot of guys would carry a revolver for short range work instead of slamming a 1oz slug into them.

I don't own a revolver. If I did, I'd probably bring that along. But I do own a .30-06 and a Glock 23.
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Old 10-07-2012, 22:03   #47
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I'm considering taking my 21SF this year as my Bowhunting side arm, ( I do have a 23 & 27) but we have had frequent bear visit's..not to hijack the thread...but what would you take considering a potential run in with a black bear?
The 23 does not have night sight's but does have a TLR1.
The 27 has night sigh'ts but is a Gen 1... I can also take the TLR1 off and put it on the 21SF.
We had one of the guy's have a run in with a bear, and no matter how much racket he made, that bear would not leave the base of his tree. After that bear milled around at his leisure...he finally waddled off...and our buddy made it back to camp a bit rattled. He only had a 1/2 mile walk...more like sprint. I don't want to be toting a 12G. TIA for any suggestions...and I apologize to the OP...even though it's somewhat still on track. Large game, handgun options...specific to what is owned.
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Old 10-07-2012, 22:15   #48
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I'm considering taking my 21SF this year as my Bowhunting side arm, ( I do have a 23 & 27) but we have had frequent bear visit's..not to hijack the thread...but what would you take considering a potential run in with a black bear?
The 23 does not have night sight's but does have a TLR1.
The 27 has night sigh'ts but is a Gen 1... I can also take the TLR1 off and put it on the 21SF.
We had one of the guy's have a run in with a bear, and no matter how much racket he made, that bear would not leave the base of his tree. After that bear milled around at his leisure...he finally waddled off...and our buddy made it back to camp a bit rattled. He only had a 1/2 mile walk...more like sprint. I don't want to be toting a 12G. TIA for any suggestions...and I apologize to the OP...even though it's somewhat still on track. Large game, handgun options...specific to what is owned.
To be honest, I'm not sure the ACP will pack enough penetration. Perhaps a 230+P XTP/FMJ/FMJ-FP would do the trick. If it were me, I might pack the 23 with some 180gr FMJ rounds. Sure, the FMJ isn't legal to hunt with, but you aren't "hunting" with the pistol. I doubt if you shot an aggressive bear with an FMJ that anyone would give you a hard time, as long as you were justified.

Check out some of the underwood or buffalo bore stuff. People seem to really like their products.
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Old 10-07-2012, 22:30   #49
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To be honest, I'm not sure the ACP will pack enough penetration. Perhaps a 230+P XTP/FMJ/FMJ-FP would do the trick. If it were me, I might pack the 23 with some 180gr FMJ rounds. Sure, the FMJ isn't legal to hunt with, but you aren't "hunting" with the pistol. I doubt if you shot an aggressive bear with an FMJ that anyone would give you a hard time, as long as you were justified.

Check out some of the underwood or buffalo bore stuff. People seem to really like their products.
Thanks...I have two boxes of BB +P for the 40 and the 45. Were on 9000 acres of private property, so I doubt there would be a problem. I often thought of getting a Bear permit, but my stand isn't really where they hang out and it's an extra $350. Were bowhunting deer...and coyote are a bigger problem to be honest with ya...I do like my 23...mightl bring them both.
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Old 10-08-2012, 05:10   #50
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Thanks...I have two boxes of BB +P for the 40 and the 45. Were on 9000 acres of private property, so I doubt there would be a problem. I often thought of getting a Bear permit, but my stand isn't really where they hang out and it's an extra $350. Were bowhunting deer...and coyote are a bigger problem to be honest with ya...I do like my 23...mightl bring them both.
9000 acres? Sign me up!!! If I were you I'd bring the 23. Smaller, easier to pack, pretty much does the same thing as the 21SF. The chances of needing it for a bear are probably small.

I find that I like my 23 more than most any other pistol. I just wish shooing it wasn't like putting gas in my car!

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