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Old 12-03-2012, 22:17   #1
Gunhaver
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Is prostitution really just capitalism?

Seems simple enough. People own their own bodies (but correct me if you believe the government actually owns us all) and people have a right to contract those bodies to do whatever kind of work they are comfortable doing.

I'm not talking about pimps and hos or forced sex trafficking or anything like that. There are obvious victims and other laws being broken. I'm talking about how the supposedly small-government right supports vice laws despite the fact that it clearly flies in the face of capitalism.

So it's OK to have sex with someone you meet, OK to take them out for dinner and a movie and whatever other offerings are needed to seal the deal but once you just take a cash for sex exchange it becomes criminal?
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Old 12-03-2012, 22:19   #2
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Can't see the forest for the trees, can you?

Is robbing a bank for the money just capitalism too?
What about murdering someone for money?

..

Last edited by JBnTX; 12-03-2012 at 22:21..
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Old 12-03-2012, 22:30   #3
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its legal as long as the state get their cut of the taxes..... regulated, reported income.....legal six counties in nevada have it.
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Old 12-03-2012, 22:49   #4
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When Walmart starts renting Ho's, it would then be safe to say it is now fully into the capitalistic domain.
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Old 12-03-2012, 22:56   #5
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When Walmart starts renting Ho's, it would then be safe to say it is now fully into the capitalistic domain.
I want one that's made in China.

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Old 12-03-2012, 23:11   #6
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Originally Posted by JBnTX View Post
Can't see the forest for the trees, can you?

Is robbing a bank for the money just capitalism too?
What about murdering someone for money?

..
You really have problems with analogies don't you?

So having sex with someone is the same as bank robbery and murder. It's all good as long as nobody walks away with some money?
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Old 12-03-2012, 23:38   #7
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Can't see the forest for the trees, can you?

Is robbing a bank for the money just capitalism too?
What about murdering someone for money?

..
In each of you examples, there is a direct victim. In the first the bank, in the second the dead guy.

Who's the victim in prostitution? If both parties are consenting adults there is no victim.

ARS
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Old 12-04-2012, 00:12   #8
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In each of you examples, there is a direct victim. In the first the bank, in the second the dead guy.

Who's the victim in prostitution? If both parties are consenting adults there is no victim.

ARS
JB has made it clear that he is the only one allowed to give consent. If he doesn't consent to it then it should be verboten.
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Old 12-04-2012, 00:26   #9
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When Walmart starts renting Ho's, it would then be safe to say it is now fully into the capitalistic domain.
renting them, no....but they are fracking their employees like one.
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Old 12-04-2012, 00:56   #10
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Item or service offered.
Item or service accepted.
Payment made
Item or service rendered.

Yes Virgin(a), that is capitalism.
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Old 12-04-2012, 01:01   #11
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I think prostitution needs to go the route of weed. Legalized, taxed, and put in proper places. Weed has legally run dispensaries, prostitution needs legally run whore houses. Hopefully it would clean up our streets a little bit, and get the pimps and hos off of them.

And I agree with Gunhaver. JB has made it very clear that if he doesn't agree with something, and doesn't think it should happen, then nobody should think it should happen.
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Old 12-04-2012, 02:04   #12
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Make it legal and tax it and have health checks. It is a business as far as I am concerned.
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Old 12-04-2012, 03:06   #13
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JB has made it very clear that if he doesn't agree with something, and doesn't think it should happen, then nobody should think it should happen.
I'm trying to get into his head (know thine enemy and all that) and determine what basis he makes these judgments on. It really doesn't seem to follow any baseline of logic or consistency of beliefs at all. Sex for money is like murder, gays are all pedophiles and animal lovers, just a pick-n-choose process based on his knee jerk reaction to each issue.

But he tends to hide when people attempt to question him too much about his beliefs indicating that even he knows that his views are only thought out enough to be worth spouting and not really thought out enough to be worth defending.
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Old 12-04-2012, 05:31   #14
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When Walmart starts renting Ho's, it would then be safe to say it is now fully into the capitalistic domain.
They could keep them by the flowers in little climate controlled booths where the other employees can't despise them for making 10X as much money. Or maybe keep them by the ammo shelf to distract the panic buyers and possibly deplete their budgets.
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Old 12-04-2012, 06:27   #15
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What you're referring to is an old concept known as "liberty of contract" that treated a man or woman's "work" as a commodity that they could dispose of as they saw fit. Liberty of contract was killing our labor force during the years leading up to the Great Depression because people could work 12hrs/day or work for whatever wages they agreed to accept.

The implementation of the National Labor Relations Act changed this, as well as many other laws passed at the time. These laws include 40 hour work week and minimum wage laws. Limiting a person's ability to work 12hrs/day for the same wage, or limiting their ability to contract for whatever wage they want, is actually anti-freedom and anti-capitalist, but Congress decided that public policy considerations outweigh these freedoms.

So, in essence, yes prostitution would be a commodity under the liberty of contract theory, but Congress has already said that liberty of contract can be limited by public policy decisions and laws. In this case I would say banning prostitution is a public policy consideration.
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Old 12-04-2012, 06:30   #16
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http://www.cato.org/store/books/libe...ight-hardcover

"This fundamental right was protected by the Supreme Court in the early 20th century, from 1897 until the New Deal, during what is called the "Lochner era." Named after the historic liberty-of-contract decision by the Supreme Court, the Lochner era saw the Court strike down laws that interfered with the freedom of people to bargain over the terms of their own contracts. These included minimum-wage and maximum-hours laws, housing segregation laws, licensing laws and laws interfering with the freedom of parents to determine what kind of schooling their children receive. Then in 1937, as part of the "New Deal revolution," the Court abandoned its protection of these vital economic and personal liberties, contributing significantly to the tremendous growth in the nation's regulatory and welfare state over the past several decades."

Just for your general knowledge regarding freedom of contract and your right to dispose of your labor as you see fit.
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Old 12-04-2012, 06:35   #17
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Originally Posted by Gunhaver View Post

But he tends to hide when people attempt to question him too much about his beliefs indicating that even he knows that his views are only thought out enough to be worth spouting and not really thought out enough to be worth defending.

I'm not hiding anything.

It just seems that our society has just given up trying to enforce any concept of good or evil, or right or wrong.

It's not about prostitution, same sex marriage or drug legalization. It's about the fact that no one ever stands up and resists these major changes in our commonly accepted standards of decency and morality.

Whatever perverted or warped concept floats down the river, the American people just bend over and accept it. No one resists anymore for fear of being labeled as some social misfit.

If it becomes a problem, just legalize it and the problem goes away. I'm sorry but the world doesn't work that way.
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Old 12-04-2012, 06:52   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JBnTX View Post
I'm not hiding anything.

It just seems that our society has just given up trying to enforce any concept of good or evil, or right or wrong.

It's not about prostitution, same sex marriage or drug legalization. It's about the fact that no one ever stands up and resists these major changes in our commonly accepted standards of decency and morality.

Whatever perverted or warped concept floats down the river, the American people just bend over and accept it. No one resists anymore for fear of being labeled as some social misfit.

If it becomes a problem, just legalize it and the problem goes away. I'm sorry but the world doesn't work that way.
JB - how do you feel about dirty raunchy sex between two consenting adults?
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Old 12-04-2012, 06:55   #19
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If it becomes a problem, just legalize it and the problem goes away. I'm sorry but the world doesn't work that way.
Ending slavery?

Segregation?

Interracial marriage?

Ending prohibition?

You also realize that if I used your analogy, and I said that our problem was "gun violence"...then by your reasoning, legalizing concealed carry and and lessening gun laws wouldn't work.

I'm pretty sure almost every gun owner posting on this forum would say that "legalizing" open carry or concealed carry in deep blue states would most definitely help do away with the problem of gun violence.

Legalizing guns = problem goes away. Sometimes, the world does work that way.
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Last edited by Hyksos; 12-04-2012 at 06:56..
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Old 12-04-2012, 07:30   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunhaver View Post
Seems simple enough. People own their own bodies (but correct me if you believe the government actually owns us all) and people have a right to contract those bodies to do whatever kind of work they are comfortable doing.

I'm not talking about pimps and hos or forced sex trafficking or anything like that. There are obvious victims and other laws being broken. I'm talking about how the supposedly small-government right supports vice laws despite the fact that it clearly flies in the face of capitalism.

So it's OK to have sex with someone you meet, OK to take them out for dinner and a movie and whatever other offerings are needed to seal the deal but once you just take a cash for sex exchange it becomes criminal?
Meet a few prostitutes (not as a client) and get to know the. I've had a few as informants and there is never a happy story about how they got into prostitution. They are usually women who have been sexually victimized their entire life and the prostitution is just the next chapter in that.

People who use prostitutes don't won't to hear about that or think about their role in that. I don't blame them.
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Old 12-04-2012, 07:36   #21
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Meet a few prostitutes (not as a client) and get to know the. I've had a few as informants and there is never a happy story about how they got into prostitution. They are usually women who have been sexually victimized their entire life and the prostitution is just the next chapter in that.

People who use prostitutes don't won't to hear about that or think about their role in that. I don't blame them.
Then what we should really do is address the root cause and ban the sexual victimization in their early life.

I think most people would prefer that prostitution and drug addiction didn't exist in our society. However, it does and always will no matter what the laws say.

By keeping prostitution illegal, the government pushes them into the shadows so that they cannot seek remedy from the judicial system, for crimes committed against them and thusly invites violence into their lives.
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Old 12-04-2012, 07:47   #22
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Then what we should really do is address the root cause and ban the sexual victimization in their early life.

I think most people would prefer that prostitution and drug addiction didn't exist in our society. However, it does and always will no matter what the laws say.

By keeping prostitution illegal, the government pushes them into the shadows so that they cannot seek remedy from the judicial system, for crimes committed against them and thusly invites violence into their lives.
We sure are full up to the brim with social problems we don't have a clue how to fix, aren't we?
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Old 12-04-2012, 08:14   #23
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Basic economics folks,find a need and market the product.My knowledge is a by-product of my experience.'08.
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Old 12-04-2012, 08:18   #24
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I want one that's made in China.
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Good one!
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Old 12-04-2012, 08:40   #25
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We sure are full up to the brim with social problems we don't have a clue how to fix, aren't we?
Yup..
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