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Old 12-06-2012, 17:18   #1
ArrowJ
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I believe...

I thought it might be beneficial to have a thread for users to delineate their beliefs without addition of supporting evidence (or lack there of). Basically, just a place to clarify what your positions are. This could be helpful in a lot of ways. For instance it would give others the opportunity to call others out on inconsistencies (in other threads), or see if a post made by another user is sarcastic, or troll bait, etc. At any rate, I am willing to do so. I will type up my beliefs and post them here soon.

Last edited by ArrowJ; 12-06-2012 at 17:23..
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Old 12-06-2012, 19:12   #2
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Off the top of my head.

I believe in humanity.

I believe that humanity is spiritual.

I choose to be theist therefore believe in God. I don't have God in a box where I can explain every aspect of God.

I believe the Bible has some great spiritual truths and some horrible spiritual errors.

I don't believe that you have to have all the answers concerning God, Jesus, or life; We are all learning and progressing.

I believe that doctrine is what stifles growth in Christians.
Doctrine can be good and bad, but if it is mixed with an unwillingness to budge when things don't make sense, then it is paralyzing.

I believe in faith, hope, and love.

I believe portions of the Bible that I find spiritually nourishing to myself.

I believe that it is perfectly alright to find truth in some portions of the Bible and thow away what does not work.

I believe that all people have God within.

I believe in spell checkers, but don't have one at work. Sometimes I post from work and it shows.

Thanks for asking.
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Old 12-06-2012, 19:53   #3
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I believe that a knife is necessary because I'll eventually run out of bullets.
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Old 12-06-2012, 20:13   #4
ArrowJ
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I am a Christian Theist with the following worldview:

God/Prime Reality:
Creator, Infinite, Personal, Triune, Rational
Transcendent And Immanent
Sovereign And Good

Cosmos:
Created Ex Nihilo
Operates With A Uniformity Of Cause And Effect
Open System (Miracles Possible Through God’s Immanence)
Fallen World

Humans:
Created In The Image Of God
Possess Self-Transcendence, Rationality, Personality, Morality, Creativity, Sociability
Originally Good, Now Fallen But Capable Of Redemption

Knowledge/Revelation:
Can Have Adequate Knowledge Of The World And God
Available Through General And Special Revelation

Ethics:
Transcendent
Based On the Character Of God As Good (Holy And Loving)
Some Ethical Principles Are Universal (Not Relative)
Given By General And/Or Special Revelation

Death:
Gateway To Eternity With Or Eternity Separated From God
Outcome Determined By Relationship With Christ
Individuality Retained

History:
Linear
Meaningful
Leading To the Fulfillment Of God’s Purposes
Guided By God’s Providence And Miraculous Intervention
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Old 12-06-2012, 20:30   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArrowJ View Post
I am a Christian Theist with the following worldview:

God/Prime Reality:
Creator, Infinite, Personal, Triune, Rational
Transcendent And Immanent
Sovereign And Good

Cosmos:
Created Ex Nihilo
Operates With A Uniformity Of Cause And Effect
Open System (Miracles Possible Through God’s Immanence)
Fallen World

Humans:
Created In The Image Of God
Possess Self-Transcendence, Rationality, Personality, Morality, Creativity, Sociability
Originally Good, Now Fallen But Capable Of Redemption

Knowledge/Revelation:
Can Have Adequate Knowledge Of The World And God
Available Through General And Special Revelation

Ethics:
Transcendent
Based On the Character Of God As Good (Holy And Loving)
Some Ethical Principles Are Universal (Not Relative)
Given By General And/Or Special Revelation

Death:
Gateway To Eternity With Or Eternity Separated From God
Outcome Determined By Relationship With Christ
Individuality Retained

History:
Linear
Meaningful
Leading To the Fulfillment Of God’s Purposes
Guided By God’s Providence And Miraculous Intervention

That all sounds good on paper, or where ever you copied it from.

Now tell us what you really believe in your own words.
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Old 12-06-2012, 20:39   #6
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Originally Posted by JBnTX View Post
That all sounds good on paper, or where ever you copied it from.

Now tell us what you really believe in your own words.
I believe...
that covers it quite well. I went to college at a Christian college so that is how I think of it. Feel free to add your beliefs here in whatever format you choose

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Old 12-06-2012, 21:38   #7
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Quote:
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... Feel free to add your beliefs here in whatever format you choose

I've already done that, all over this fine forum...
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Old 12-06-2012, 23:23   #8
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I don't like the word believe/belief/faith, because they imply the absence of evidence.
I go off of whatever the evidence points me towards. When the evidence is there, belief is not necessary.


But to follow along with your thread.....
I believe that this world will one day get past all/most religious nonsense, and will become a truly advanced society that is capable of traveling and exploring the vast universe.
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Old 12-06-2012, 23:33   #9
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I believe that this world will one day get past all/most religious nonsense, and will become a truly advanced society that is capable of traveling and exploring the vast universe.
How did that feel?

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Old 12-06-2012, 23:36   #10
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How did that feel?

It is more of a hope than a belief.
I really do hope we can one day get past all of this religious garbage that is holding us back, though the evidence of how the religious types act(especially the muslims), really worry me.
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Old 12-07-2012, 07:17   #11
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It is more of a hope than a belief.
I really do hope we can one day get past all of this religious garbage that is holding us back, though the evidence of how the religious types act(especially the muslims), really worry me.
I like to use the word Expect or Expectation. That is a word that can reasonably by used in an evidence based conclusion.

Similar to you I expect that most of the world will move beyond religion. However I suspect there will always be an uneducated portion of mankind that will always believe in wizards and demons and will become a constant thorn in the side of that modern society we create. Possibly even a threat to it.
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Old 12-07-2012, 08:43   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Altaris View Post
....When the evidence is there, belief is not necessary.

I believe that this world will one day get past all/most religious nonsense, and will become a truly advanced society that is capable of traveling and exploring the vast universe.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Altaris View Post
I really do hope we can one day get past all of this religious garbage that is holding us back...

What if the lack of evidence is there for a reason. Maybe we've not been given all the answers so we will seek out those answers and then "become a truly advanced society that is capable of traveling and exploring the vast universe"?

It's not religion that's holding us back, it's the lack of adherence to a set of common standards and beliefs.

God gave us those standards and beliefs so we'd be united, but Man has chosen to follow his own path.

..

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Old 12-07-2012, 09:23   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JBnTX View Post
It's not religion that's holding us back, it's the lack of adherence to a set of common standards and beliefs.

God gave us those standards and beliefs so we'd be united, but Man has chosen to follow his own path.

..
God given common standards and beliefs?

The reason that people are not posting what they believe in this thread is because we don't have common ground when it comes to beliefs. I find it easy to talk about my beliefs, but most people are uncomfortable with it.

Beliefs change with situations. Happenstance can bring us to new beliefs.

I find that you are right that part of the design is that we don't know. There is an awe, or a feeling, in not knowing, that comes with searching and finding faith. That is why I asked Altaris how did that feel? I get a sense of euforia when I come to conclusions on belief. An epiphany feeling. God is with us, but I just can't always explain how. The not knowing is part of the design.
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Old 12-07-2012, 09:56   #14
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Scientifically, I believe in what I can see, hear, touch or otherwise measure in some precise way. Everything else is relegated to the realm of myth.

Philosophically, I believe that the nature of man will never fundamentally change. Even with our current trend of advancement in knowledge and technology, we are ultimately doomed to repeat all of the horrors of our own history. It is a statistical certainty, but that does not mean that we should not strive to do better. It is also a statistical certainty that there will be periods of great peace and understanding. Despite what many today believe, we are actually living in such a time right now. Look back on history and the inescapable conclusion is that this is one of the best and most peaceful times to be alive on record.
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:11   #15
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I believe that there is a Truth.

I believe that God defines absolute morality and absolute innocence.

I believe that God paid the price for those who broke that absolute morality to be elevated back to that state with Him. He made the sacrifice Himself in the person of the Son who gave His life blood for us.

I believe that God can fix me and heal me as I believe the Truth as He has outlined in the Bible which is His word.

I believe that without God life has no purpose or meaning. Without absolutes things ideas like principle and love and faith become distorted and worthless.
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Old 12-07-2012, 13:02   #16
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Originally Posted by Geko45 View Post
Scientifically, I believe in what I can see, hear, touch or otherwise measure in some precise way. Everything else is relegated to the realm of myth.
Does this include things that happened in the past? For example, none of the criteria you mentioned verifies the existence of George Washington.
Does it also apply to emotions?

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Old 12-07-2012, 13:30   #17
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Quote:
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Does this include things that happened in the past? For example, none of the criteria you mentioned verifies the existence of George Washington.
Does it also apply to emotions?
We have his writings, his belongings, and his story is consistent with others (and not extraordinary in the sense that it violates known physical principles), so I conclude that the probability that a person named George Washington who did those things described in history as a near certainty.

I also find it highly likely that a man named Jesus Christ once existed and was a religious teacher of some influence in his time. I see no reason to accept that as proof of any of the extraordinary claims about his divinty made in the bible.

Tying that back in to George Washington for example, if you tell me that he was a shrewd general that lead us to victorty in the American Revolution then I'll take that at face value as all the evidence supports it. If you tell me that he was superhuman and could not be defeated and turned the tide of war through divine power then I'll need to see something more compelling than his wooden teeth.

As for feelings, I can only speak to my own. I have no idea what anyone else is feeling with any real certainty. If you're gonna ask me if I love my father, please spare us the Contact reference.
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Old 12-07-2012, 15:15   #18
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Gecko,
We're not all that different then. I too find it likely that a person named Jesus Christ existed based on extra-biblical accounts, had followers, and generally poked a stick in the eye of leaders of the time. However, I take it a step farther and do think it's likely that what is written in the gospels is accurate, including his divinity. Why? I find it difficult to believe that ordinary men would fabricate their accounts. There's no compelling reason for them to stick to a story that brought them persecution and death. Also, there's no compelling reason for them to fabricate the story in the first place since there was no payoff for them to do so. I also find credibility in their writings in the fact that the separate accounts of the same events differ in details, but not in meaning. As an aside, I've conducted plenty of inquiries during my career in the military, and in my experience, if all the stories match up perfectly, there's probably collusion with the intent to deceive. There's also the way the authors of the gospels weren't flattering to themselves in their accounts; the writers clearly didn't get it when they were with Jesus, and they were skeptical even after his return. Acts goes into detail of the disagreements of some of the apostles; it's hardly a story of unity and agreement that would be expected if they conspired to perpetrate a fraud. Then there's the question of the apostles - they were not men of renown or influence. If Jesus were a man looking to start a movement and influence people, it would make sense to pick better followers, not fishermen and tax collectors.
So for me, there is evidence the writers of the New Testament were credible and accurately recorded what they saw and heard, and that the gospels we read today are congruent with what was written in the first century. I therefore have faith that even though the accounts of miracles and Jesus' claim to be divine are hard to believe, they accurately describe what was witnessed.
In a nutshell, I believe it's true.

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Old 12-07-2012, 16:05   #19
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Scientifically, I believe in what I can see, hear, touch or otherwise measure in some precise way. Everything else is relegated to the realm of myth.
This is pretty close to what I would say. If it can't be proven to me to exist in some logical way, then as far as I'm concerned, it doesn't exist.

The BBT, Abiogenisis, Evolution, Quantum physics etc. make sense to me, even though I haven't the education to fully understand them. I'll take the scientific community's word that they have evidence to back up these theories, and in some cases I'm interested enough to educate myself (as much as reasonably possible) in the fields to get a better understanding of what the theories actually say and what they actually cover.

Interestingly enough, this forum has sparked most of my curiosity in these and other subjects. There are so many knowledgeable people here whom I suspect aren't actually scientists, yet know so much more than I that inspired me to learn as much as I can.

And I must say, some of the things I've learned, that I didn't know 2 years ago, are amazing and mind bending.


Quote:
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Philosophically, I believe that the nature of man will never fundamentally change. Even with our current trend of advancement in knowledge and technology, we are ultimately doomed to repeat all of the horrors of our own history. It is a statistical certainty, but that does not mean that we should not strive to do better. It is also a statistical certainty that there will be periods of great peace and understanding. Despite what many today believe, we are actually living in such a time right now. Look back on history and the inescapable conclusion is that this is one of the best and most peaceful times to be alive on record.
Again, mostly agree. Except that I am much more pessimistic. I don't think that as a race, we have it in us to keep from fighting amongst ourselves, for whatever reason, the forward vision and the willingness to advance our knowledge and technology and our attitudes toward each other to save ourselves. And when I say "save ourselves" I mean save us from ourselves. The human race will bicker and fight amongst themselves over petty and silly reasons, and for all the advances designed to make our lives better, we will invent new and horrific methods of killing each other in faster, more efficient ways. I think eventually the human race will kill itself off. Probably in one of two ways, a natural disaster that we should have seen coming i.e. an extinction level event, or we will simply develop a weapon that gets into the wrong hands and is utilized, say a superbug, that no one can stop.

I dont think we have a hope in hell of making it to the time we need to worry about the sun destroying the planet.
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Old 12-07-2012, 16:14   #20
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The human race will bicker and fight amongst themselves over petty and silly reasons, and for all the advances designed to make our lives better, we will invent new and horrific methods of killing each other in faster, more efficient ways.
The only upside to nuclear weapons seems to be that we eventually reached a point where we invented a weapon that was so horrific that almost no one is willing to use it. There appears to be at least some limit to our depravity. Still, that genie can't be kept in the bottle forever. Sooner or later some unstable individual (probably a religious zealot) will get their hands on one and destroy a major city or three. The world will undergo a radical change that day, for the better or worse is uncertain.
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