Christian who relies on God vs guns - Page 3

Glock36shooter · 12-06-2012, 17:19

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Originally Posted by Colubrid

So glock36shooter,
Why do you hav a gun then?

I have a gun because I do not trust in a God to protect me. I understand this is a world based on reality and not mythology. There is no God watching over me. There are no Angels coming to protect me. And there is no Devil that makes people do the bad things they do. If another human being means me harm I will do to them as much harm first as is needed to stop them. This is why I carry a gun.

Believers are often hypocrites. You ask them why a child dies with cancer and they'll say God has a plan and works in mysterious ways. Yet they'll kneel a pray for God to heal a sick child dying from cancer to ask for something OTHER than God's plan. If it is God's will that the child dies then prayer is not trusting in his plan... it's asking him to change his plan. And the Christian that carries a firearm doesn't trust in God's plan either. If God means for you to be murdered then that is his will and you should want to please him and not turn away from his will. If God is truly in control and has a plan and his will shall be done... there is no need for a gun because whatever happens is his will and the believer should just accept that. But they don't. They don't trust in God's plan... in fact they mean to interfere with it if his will is for them to die. If a gun is needed by a believer... they do not put real stock in God's plan. They say they do but they don't. They won't admit it, and they'll say I have no idea what I'm talking about because their brains can't handle the hypocrisy and contradiction of their beliefs versus their ideals about defense. But there it is.

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i take it is a G36 you like. iI just sold mine. i had 3 before and keep coming back to that model.. i just like guns. The way they are made.

I used to... especially when I chose my screen name. I had just gotten my G36 and thought it was the coolest thing ever. Since then I have found that it didn't suit my needs so I got rid of it. I didn't like that you had to raise your pinky to reload it or risk pinching the crap out of your finger or worse failing to reload the gun. But I carry a Glock 19 daily.

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i don't look at them as killing machines.

I'm fascinated by the machinery of them as well. All the little working parts and do-dads. But the purpose of the gun is to be a weapon. It's purpose is to kill. Or at the very least wound. But it's a weapon first and foremost. I think Christ would have been opposed to them on principle. I think he would have been disgusted that man had found such a efficient and accurate method of killing one another.

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BTW the girl i am talking to is single and so am I. So we are speaking to work out our differences in what we agree and don't agree on.

Is she cute?

Glock36shooter · 12-06-2012, 17:24

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Originally Posted by Colubrid

WOW! I learned a lot here.

I was actually the one on the other side of the fence. but now hearing you and this girl i was debating with i am rethinking my whole walk with God. not just about guns.

Well there is room for lots of beliefs out there. But if you want to get strictly biblical and more specifically new testament biblical (Jesus and Friends) then carrying a gun is not trusting in God's will. Resist not evil and let God's will be done. That's what Christ said.

But to say "screw that I'm carrying anyway" is what most Christians do so don't feel alone. The girl is correct however. If it's God's will... it's God's will. It's not your place to try and change it or interfere. Biblically speaking of course.

Colubrid · 12-06-2012, 18:24

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Believers are often hypocrites. You ask them why a child dies with cancer and they'll say God has a plan and works in mysterious ways. Yet they'll kneel a pray for God to heal a sick child dying from cancer to ask for something OTHER than God's plan. If it is God's will that the child dies then prayer is not trusting in his plan... it's asking him to change his plan

With your thinking though there would be no reason to pray to God for anything because He just runs on batteries.

i think where people go wrong in prayer is asking for the wrong thing or with wrong motives ect. But beleivers are called to pray in Gods will according to and in accordance to His words..

Colubrid · 12-06-2012, 18:29

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Originally Posted by Glock36shooter

.

Is she cute?

I am not thinking about that. I am attracted to her obedeince and repentance to God...which is really attractive in an already attractive woman.

Quite different from what the norm is. Wouldn't you say?

muscogee · 12-06-2012, 18:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colubrid

I am not thinking about that. I am attracted to her obedeince and repentance to God...which is really attractive in an already attractive woman.

Quite different from what the norm is. Wouldn't you say?

Most Christians I have know just talk the talk, but I have know a few that actually do their best to walk the walk. I really respect people who do that. It's a tough road.

Glock36shooter · 12-06-2012, 18:46

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Originally Posted by Colubrid

With your thinking though there would be no reason to pray to God for anything because He just runs on batteries.

Batteries? No... his will.

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i think where people go wrong in prayer is asking for the wrong thing or with wrong motives ect.

I don't disagree.

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But beleivers are called to pray in Gods will according to and in accordance to His words..

Praying that his will be done is just asking him to continue running on batteries... as you put it.

Glock36shooter · 12-06-2012, 18:51

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Originally Posted by muscogee

Most Christians I have know just talk the talk, but I have know a few that actually do their best to walk the walk. I really respect people who do that. It's a tough road.

I know ONE personally. You couldn't ask for a higher quality person. Just as an example... he left $6,000 for a family that needed it to get some kind of surgery for their little girl at his church. He refused to let them know who did it. He did it just because it was what he thought was his duty to Christ. If I recall that put him in a financial position of living paycheck to pay check for about a year. Everytime that man gets a dollar he doesn't need to survive... he gives it away to someone that needs it.

Colubrid · 12-06-2012, 20:43

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Originally Posted by Glock36shooter

I know ONE personally. You couldn't ask for a higher quality person. Just as an example... he left $6,000 for a family that needed it to get some kind of surgery for their little girl at his church. He refused to let them know who did it. He did it just because it was what he thought was his duty to Christ. If I recall that put him in a financial position of living paycheck to pay check for about a year. Everytime that man gets a dollar he doesn't need to survive... he gives it away to someone that needs it.

what one does with there money shows everything.

I feel like such a hypocrite.

fgutie35 · 12-07-2012, 07:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glock36shooter

I know ONE personally. You couldn't ask for a higher quality person. Just as an example... he left $6,000 for a family that needed it to get some kind of surgery for their little girl at his church. He refused to let them know who did it. He did it just because it was what he thought was his duty to Christ. If I recall that put him in a financial position of living paycheck to pay check for about a year. Everytime that man gets a dollar he doesn't need to survive... he gives it away to someone that needs it.

On the flip side, I know of atheists and muslims aquaintances, that behave more christian like than many of the self proclaim devout christians. Like Muscogee said, "Is a though road", many are not willing to walk it out of convenience, many are not willing to walk it out of fear, but few are doing their best to try to walk thru it the best way they can or know. We are not perfect, we are humans. IF God would have wanted perfect beings that would worship him day and night no questions asked, he could have created those creatures (robots), but He would be fooling Himself into thinking those beings would be doing it out of love and unconditionally. That is the whole purpose of the free will.

Colubrid · 12-07-2012, 10:44

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On the flip side, I know of atheists and muslims aquaintances, that behave more christian like than many of the self proclaim devout christians

Yep! Me to!

They do everything that Jesus taught and they follow His teachings yet they still reject the creator and savior.

Gunhaver · 12-07-2012, 11:28

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Originally Posted by Colubrid

With your thinking though there would be no reason to pray to God for anything because He just runs on batteries.

i think where people go wrong in prayer is asking for the wrong thing or with wrong motives ect. But beleivers are called to pray in Gods will according to and in accordance to His words..

So there just aren't enough people selflessly asking god for world peace or a cure for cancer?

Roering · 12-07-2012, 13:02

Isn't there an old saying about praying for peace but preparing for war?

Also, I think that not taking safety precautions is more like testing God than trusting Him.

muscogee · 12-07-2012, 13:16

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Originally Posted by Roering

Isn't there an old saying about praying for peace but preparing for war?

Julius Caesar was a Christian?

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Originally Posted by Roering

Also, I think that not taking safety precautions is more like testing God than trusting Him.

If you believe you're going to heaven when you die, why do anything to forstall the trip?

Roering · 12-07-2012, 14:02

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Originally Posted by muscogee

Julius Caesar was a Christian?

If you believe you're going to heaven when you die, why do anything to forstall the trip?

You don't have to be Christian to give good advice.

There is still much work to be done in this life.

Roering · 12-07-2012, 14:04

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Originally Posted by Gunhaver

So there just aren't enough people selflessly asking god for world peace or a cure for cancer?

Although you make a valid point, you can't go around blaming atheists for everything.

Glock36shooter · 12-07-2012, 14:11

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Originally Posted by Roering

Also, I think that not taking safety precautions is more like testing God than trusting Him.

I want to hear your thoughts on Matthew 5:38-48

Seems like Christ was instructing his followers to not resist those that would harm you. To not fight back. To freely give that which someone would steal. Seems he taught absolute pacifism.

Seems like he felt you should love your enemy in order to be perfect like the father.

To take the "Grab a Sword" line as a call to defend one's self with weapons and violence seems to make Jesus a hypocrite.

muscogee · 12-07-2012, 14:11

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Originally Posted by Roering

You don't have to be Christian to give good advice.

There is still much work to be done in this life.

Good answer.

muscogee · 12-07-2012, 14:21

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Originally Posted by cowboywannabe

god might have your soul, but he wont protect your ass.

So the "consider the lilies of the field" thing is just BS?

Roering · 12-07-2012, 15:18

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Originally Posted by Glock36shooter

I want to hear your thoughts on Matthew 5:38-48

Seems like Christ was instructing his followers to not resist those that would harm you. To not fight back. To freely give that which someone would steal. Seems he taught absolute pacifism.

Seems like he felt you should love your enemy in order to be perfect like the father.

To take the "Grab a Sword" line as a call to defend one's self with weapons and violence seems to make Jesus a hypocrite.

It's a teaching not to retaliate or seek revenge, but to be patient to even those who harm you. Not to seek to get killed or lay down to be killed. Christ evaded stoning and encouraged his followers at one time to obtain a sword if they didn't already have one.

Glock36shooter · 12-07-2012, 18:30

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Originally Posted by Roering

It's a teaching not to retaliate or seek revenge, but to be patient to even those who harm you. Not to seek to get killed or lay down to be killed. Christ evaded stoning and encouraged his followers at one time to obtain a sword if they didn't already have one.

Others disagree that the "Get a sword" passage was about taking up a weapon to defend one's self. Jesus used non-violence to avoid injury but never self-defense via weapons or combat. What is your basis that he would approve of such actions?

Roering · 12-09-2012, 21:36

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Originally Posted by Glock36shooter

Others disagree that the "Get a sword" passage was about taking up a weapon to defend one's self. Jesus used non-violence to avoid injury but never self-defense via weapons or combat. What is your basis that he would approve of such actions?

My basis is that swords at that time were used for two things. To attack someone or two defend oneself when under attack. The latter is more passive than the former.