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Old 06-29-2012, 21:51   #26
_The_Shadow
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkShooter View Post
I like where this thread is going. Lots of great info from experienced 10mm/G20 shooters. What ive learned so far-

Im thinkin Longshot is the way to go, everyone seems to agree its a great powder for these velocities, and it was used to load Swampfox ammo. Sounds like a winner.

800X also does great, but each charge has to be weighed due to it being a poor shape for runnin thru a powder measure.

Blue Dot is the old standby, and Accurate #9 has some fans too.

Wow I got a lot of loads to work up!
Have fun, most of us have for years, since early 1990 for me with 10mm! Still learning too! I started with Blue Dot before published loads were out for this cartridge and there was as much internet back then!
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Old 06-29-2012, 22:44   #27
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Originally Posted by CanyonMan View Post
OK gentelman,

So any one put 9.4/9.5grs of LS under the 180gr XTP in a stock barrel G20/G29 and if you did what did you get ????

I am trying to pick some brains here as time is something I ain't got "right now," and save myself some bench time..


Mucho thanks !






CM
Hi CM,

Good to see you back roaming around GT again.

I have loaded up to 9.5 grains of Longshot under a 180 XTP. It only yields about 1190 fps from my G20. CCI 300 for that one. Hope that helps.

EDIT:

So far, I have not found any advantage with Longshot over Blue Dot with book data and XTPs - at leas in my setup. Sticking with Hornady load data for BD and 180 XTPs, they are running about 1215 fps at a couple tenths less than max. Nice clean burn and great groups too.

Last edited by Taterhead; 06-29-2012 at 22:49..
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Old 06-30-2012, 08:44   #28
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Originally Posted by Taterhead View Post
Hi CM,

Good to see you back roaming around GT again.

I have loaded up to 9.5 grains of Longshot under a 180 XTP. It only yields about 1190 fps from my G20. CCI 300 for that one. Hope that helps.

EDIT:

So far, I have not found any advantage with Longshot over Blue Dot with book data and XTPs - at leas in my setup. Sticking with Hornady load data for BD and 180 XTPs, they are running about 1215 fps at a couple tenths less than max. Nice clean burn and great groups too.


Hey amigo, just now having a tad of room to breathe, we had a ruff afternoon/evening/night around here yesterday.

Well I have had some good advice on LS from you guys, and Shadow was helpful as well with some load data.

Reading your post here, and "now" this morning having the time to "hit the books" and my load data notes, and all, I think I will stick with my beloved BD on these 180/200gr bullets and especially cast where I am getting 1300fps, old faithful saddle bag stand by... I may pop a few LS's and see, but I believe your right from what I am seeing (on paper at least) this morning about the BD.

I use 11.0grs BD with the 180gr, and 10.5 grs with the 200gr (BD) A tad over Hornady Max, but have had VERY good results with these for a long time out of stock and AM barrels. Getting plenty good enough vels with a XTP, (which is just a "in town" bullet, and really sweet with HC bullet which are my "main staple out here" any way..

Yep, you helped a great deal, and my thanks amigo and to Shadow and others as well....

Good to have friends !



THANKS ALL !



Y'all stay safe.
Gotta run again!







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Old 07-02-2012, 17:19   #29
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No time to handload this weekend, due to bein called out to my second job. But, a few boxes of Underwood 200gr XTP ammo came in, and I was able to spend a short time at a nearby range.

Wow this stuff is impressive! I really don't think I need to explain it to you veterans! Very accurate too. I policed the brass, and took some measurements after I got home.

First of all, the OAL of loaded cartridges is very consistent.
There was only .002 difference in an entire box of 50.
All measured between 1.256 - 1.258

The web on the unfired cartridges (Starline brass) measured between .4213 - .4215.
Hornady 4th Edition manual lists .423 as nominal diameter.

The web on the fired cartridges measured between .4325 -.4330. No visible bulging or smiles.

Two rounds did smile, and they measured .4349 and .4350.

30 rounds were fired total.

Just to be safe, I am gonna get an aftermarket barrel, probally KKM because im happy with the quality of my .40 barrel from them. I already got a Wolf 22lb spring/guide rod on the way. Im very impressed by this cartridge, and the quality of Underwood ammo. I will be getting more. I know all this is a lil off topic, but wanted to share what I found out.
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Old 09-20-2012, 18:16   #30
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So far I have shot 9.0 of Longshot and a 200XTP at max OAL with zero pressure signs... Loaded 9.2 and 9.5 tonight to try next...

Also loaded 10.5 and 10.7 behind a 175g Silver tip again at max OAL.

6" KKM G20.

CW
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Old 09-21-2012, 11:51   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yondering View Post

Personally I'd skip 800X and get a powder that's easier to work with.
Knowing what alternatives exist, I would do the same thing. Longshot, Blue Dot and AA9 are FAR better choices for heavy loads if you ask me.
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Old 09-21-2012, 11:52   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cwlongshot View Post
So far I have shot 9.0 of Longshot and a 200XTP at max OAL with zero pressure signs... Loaded 9.2 and 9.5 tonight to try next...

Also loaded 10.5 and 10.7 behind a 175g Silver tip again at max OAL.

6" KKM G20.

CW
CW, just so you know ... I get 1325fps AVERAGE from a 6" KKM or 6" Fusion .... CCI300, 200gr XTP, new starline, 1.26" using 9.4gr Longshot. Be careful with this workup, as you know.

For readers who don't realize this, this load is more than 2 grains OVER Hornady max.... Its on YOU if something happens

I settled on 9.0gr LS as a safer alternative to wanting more power from a 200gr XTP.
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Old 09-21-2012, 18:45   #33
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Originally Posted by nickE10mm View Post
CW, just so you know ... I get 1325fps AVERAGE from a 6" KKM or 6" Fusion .... CCI300, 200gr XTP, new starline, 1.26" using 9.4gr Longshot. Be careful with this workup, as you know.

For readers who don't realize this, this load is more than 2 grains OVER Hornady max.... Its on YOU if something happens

I settled on 9.0gr LS as a safer alternative to wanting more power from a 200gr XTP.

ABSOLUTELY!! Its uncharted territory!

SO far ZERO pressure signs at 9.0g... BUT I am yet to chronograph these higher loadings. I was 1250 or so at 8.5 IIRC.
My "target" is 1300fps with good accuracy. For me that will be 2" at 50 yards. All loads so far are at least that good accuracy wise.

I also have a 5.5" ported LWD barrel. I'll back it down a grain or so and work back up in that one later if I dont get what I want here.

I also have #9, and 800X to try if needed. I'm hoping LongShot does what I expect it to...

Thanks for the tip!

CW
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Old 09-21-2012, 23:26   #34
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Originally Posted by Cwlongshot View Post
So far I have shot 9.0 of Longshot and a 200XTP at max OAL with zero pressure signs... Loaded 9.2 and 9.5 tonight to try next...

Also loaded 10.5 and 10.7 behind a 175g Silver tip again at max OAL.

6" KKM G20.

CW
CW, what is your velocity goal for the 175gr Silvertips? 10.5 and 10.7gr of Longshot is very very potent. I use 9.7 gr. of Longshot with CCI#300 at 1.255" to get a 180XTP to 1400fps from my 6" LWD barrel and 1300fps from the stock G20 barrel. Measuring case head expansion from this load indicates that this is a safe but full power loading in my gun. That means I retire the brass to light-moderate range loadings after 2 loads at this level.

Based on my results with Longshot, I would advise you to seriously consider loading a few lighter rounds, starting no higher than 9.5 - 9.8 gr. range and work up from there if you need to. I wouldn't expect to get much more than 1400fps safely from a 5.5" barrel with the 175gr Silvertips. For the sake of safety, it's wise to begin with a reasonable velocity goal and work up to that in 0.2gr increments.

Good luck and be safe!
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Old 09-22-2012, 09:36   #35
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I did not set a goal on the Silvertips, it was kinda a afterthought. But I know 1400 is pretty easy to attain with the longer barrel.

The chrono numbers I have gotten so far have been slow, but as I said, accuracy is there power is "enough".

CW
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Old 09-23-2012, 16:07   #36
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This thread is full of great info for someone just starting out, like me.

Mods, maybe sticky material since so many noob questions have been answered with sound advice?

Ive been busy with work all summer, but finally found time to work up & test a couple loads.

Ive settled on 200gr XTP, Winchester brass and WLP with 9.0gr Blue Dot and 12.6gr AA#9. OAL 1.260. Both these loads are from the Hornady 8th edition.

Im getting an honest 1100 fps average with the stock rsa/barrel, and a bit higher with 22lb spring/kkm barrel. I know these are not remarkable loads, but they are accurate and 100% reliable, and more powerful than the FBI loads im used to.

I plan on working up to book max (9.4gr BD/13.2 AA#9) when I get more time, but I am pretty happy with what I got now.
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Old 11-15-2012, 14:20   #37
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The Glockmeister captive 22lb spring kit was mentioned on page 1 of this thread ...

Question:
Since there's a screw that is used in the assembly of the rod and the spring, did you guys have an encounters where the screw gets loosened after a certain number of discharges?
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Old 11-15-2012, 22:17   #38
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The Glockmeister captive 22lb spring kit was mentioned on page 1 of this thread ...

Question:
Since there's a screw that is used in the assembly of the rod and the spring, did you guys have an encounters where the screw gets loosened after a certain number of discharges?
Blue Loc-Tite. 10K rounds, not loose.
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Old 11-16-2012, 10:59   #39
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I've run 9.7 of Longshot with the 180XTP and Nosler HP 180 and 9.3 of Longshot with the 200 XTP.
Starline brass
CCI 300 primer
STORM LAKE barrel with tight chamber
Wolf rod and 22# spring.
These loads were worked up to SLOWLY and cases measured at the pressure ring for expansion. I wouldnt run them in my factory barrel just to be on the safe side.
The 10mm seems to be a very adaptable to load for as long as you use some restraint and dont go stupid.
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Old 11-20-2012, 09:13   #40
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When I loaded for the 10mm I would often use 9.5gr Longshot w/180gr bullets. I tried some at 9.7gr and it actually reduced velocity instead of increasing it. However, that could just be my batch of powder. I would get about 1260-1270 fps from the stock G20sf with the 9.5gr load using jacketed 180gr bullets.

As for the guy loading 10.5-10.7gr Longshot with the 175gr Silvertip....be very careful with that. The KKM barrel will give you the extra support you need, but in my option, the 175gr is essentially 180gr so if you increase powder, do so very slightly. 10.0gr sounds a little more safe, and that's still probably a little high pressure wise. Just exercise caution and work up starting at maybe 9.7gr. I've ran 9.7gr Longshot w/175gr Silvertip and I think it got me close to, if not over 1300 fps from the stock G20sf.
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Old 11-27-2012, 17:38   #41
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...
I've ran 9.7gr Longshot w/175gr Silvertip and I think it got me close to, if not over 1300 fps from the stock G20sf.
I saw diminishing return with LS between 9.0 - 9.3gr for 180gr, using CCI 350. I'd target 9.0gr essentially reserving 0.3gr for error which is unlikely to be > 0.1 gr.




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Old 11-27-2012, 21:29   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ModGlock17 View Post
I saw diminishing return with LS between 9.0 - 9.3gr for 180gr, using CCI 350. I'd target 9.0gr essentially reserving 0.3gr for error which is unlikely to be > 0.1 gr.




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In my experience with LS, there is a point of diminishing returns at 9.2-9.5gr when working up 180gr bullets ... and at 8.2gr-8.6gr with 200gr workups... You can get over the "hump" but none of us have pressure equipment so make your own deductions.
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Old 11-29-2012, 17:22   #43
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Beyond published peak

One thing to bear in mind when exploring loads beyond the published max in manuals is to go back to the concept of the Pressure/Time curve; whereby the y-axis is the pressure and the x-axis is the time.

The curve of the powder with respect to a cartridge should be pretty similar under the same dimensions. Beyond the known peak pressure, things tend to be non-linear.

That's where things become hairy and unpredictable. So, be careful.
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Old 12-02-2012, 16:29   #44
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Im finally gonna work up some full power 10mm handloads for my stock Gen3 20. Ive previously only done FBI loads and 40's for my KKM Precision barrel.
Id like to get 1300fps with 180gr Gold Dots and XTP, and 1200fps with 200gr XTP and FMJ. These are max or near max loads from Speer #12 and Hornady #4 manuals.
Would I be ok with the stock barrel / recoil spring assembly, or should I get an aftermarket barrel/rsa right from the start? Im concerned about the brass smiles and havin a strong enough spring to prevent battering.
Im asking because these are max loads from the manuals, but milder than some loads ive seen suggested. Thx for the help.
For max loads get a good aftermarket barrel. I went through two glock barrels on my g 20. Finally got a Barstow and never had smiley since. Do not like Glock barrels or would use one. Better barrels out there
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Old 12-18-2012, 17:46   #45
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I load Blue Dot with standard CCI primers and 180 grain Golden Sabers for my PD load. With the Glock barrel, they average 1260 fps, with the 6" LW barrel they average 1350 fps. I will not say how much Blue Dot because there's not a book in the country that's going to show a load with as much as I'm using. I also use a 22 lb spring with them. I've shot approx 100 of these loads, spread out over different temps and weather conditions and feel pretty confident they are good for a full clip if needed but it's not a load I would pratice with. I only load these in new brass and not sure how much the gun could handle it over the long term. Primer's and brass still look good after firing but they do have a little recoil.

180 is as heavy as I've loaded, so can't say for
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Old 12-18-2012, 19:16   #46
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Quote:
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I load Blue Dot with standard CCI primers and 180 grain Golden Sabers for my PD load. With the Glock barrel, they average 1260 fps, with the 6" LW barrel they average 1350 fps. I will not say how much Blue Dot because there's not a book in the country that's going to show a load with as much as I'm using. I also use a 22 lb spring with them. I've shot approx 100 of these loads, spread out over different temps and weather conditions and feel pretty confident they are good for a full clip if needed but it's not a load I would pratice with. I only load these in new brass and not sure how much the gun could handle it over the long term. Primer's and brass still look good after firing but they do have a little recoil.

180 is as heavy as I've loaded, so can't say for
I'd say 11.2-11.5gr would make your stated vels... nice load.
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Old 12-18-2012, 19:22   #47
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I load Blue Dot with standard CCI primers and 180 grain Golden Sabers for my PD load. With the Glock barrel, they average 1260 fps, with the 6" LW barrel they average 1350 fps. I will not say how much Blue Dot because there's not a book in the country that's going to show a load with as much as I'm using. I also use a 22 lb spring with them. I've shot approx 100 of these loads, spread out over different temps and weather conditions and feel pretty confident they are good for a full clip if needed but it's not a load I would pratice with. I only load these in new brass and not sure how much the gun could handle it over the long term. Primer's and brass still look good after firing but they do have a little recoil.

180 is as heavy as I've loaded, so can't say for
Just a guess, but I imagine that those loads burn pretty clean at those pressures. Blue Dot cleans up nicely the more you stoke the furnace. Pretty loud report too, I would bet!

I haven't quite worked up to your velocities, but I have fed my G20 quite a few 180 XTPs @ 1215 fps with Blue Dot. My loads were "on book" though. Nick is probably correct with his charge weight prognostication.
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Old 12-19-2012, 20:02   #48
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You're good, ll.4. Going by pressure signs, or lack of, I might could go a little more, but why push it and beat the crap out of the gun. It that load won't stop em, I need a lot bigger gun, not just a hotter load.

Yes, they burn extremely clean. When I first started loading for it, I was told Blue Dot was a very dirty powder. I was actually suprised how clean it burns after reading all the comments about BD.

Last edited by BenKeith; 12-19-2012 at 20:07..
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Old 12-19-2012, 20:08   #49
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Quote:
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You're good, ll.4. Going by pressure signs, or lack of, I might could go a little more, but why push it and beat the crap out of the gun. It that load won't stop em, I need a lot bigger gun, not just a hotter load.

Yes, they burn extremely clean. When I first started loading for it, I was told Blue Dot was a very dirty powder. I was actually suprised how clean it burns after reading all the comments about BD.
Agreed, find a load in your power range preference then re-work up the load for ACCURACY .. :-)
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Old 12-23-2012, 00:28   #50
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Hi i have a question i have a new gen3 g20 (completely stock) i went to the range the other day with some reloads
180g xtp's
9.2g longshot
Win brass
Wlp primers
They were moving at 1340fps through my crony 9.4g longshot gave about the same. 9.2 had no over pressure signs at all 9.4 had some scratches on the case and burr on the head were the extractor goes.
Does this velocity sound right to you guys? Overpressure?
I checked my chony with a known load and all was good.
Thanks
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