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Old 01-29-2013, 22:28   #21
PM720
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What is a USPSA reload?

Scott
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Old 01-30-2013, 00:01   #22
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Originally Posted by PM720 View Post
What is a USPSA reload?

Scott
I was afraid that someone would ask that...

Would perhaps been better referred to as USPSA-type reload.

GSSF Rule 130.70 states (emphasis mine):
Make sure you keep the firearm pointed in a safe
direction (towards the targets) at all times especially
when reloading and unloading.
Failure
to do so will disqualify you from the match.

USPSA Rule 8.4.1 states (emphasis mine):
When loading, reloading or unloading during a course of fire, the competitor’s fingers must be visibly outside the trigger guard and the handgun must be pointed safely down range or in another safe direction authorized by a Range Officer (see Section 10.5).

I'm an IDPA SO, and admittedly don't shoot USPSA - but I always seem to recognize USPSA shooters who reload with their muzzle pointing well over the impact berm. IDPA shooters... not so much.

GSSF Rule 130.70 above says "towards the targets".
USPSA Rule 8.4.1 above says "must be pointed safely down range or in another safe direction authorized by a Range Officer"

GSSF is now allowing the muzzle to be in "another safe direction authorized by the Range Officer" - which will not specifically be "towards the targets" and may in fact be over the impact berm.

Keeping the muzzle pointed below the berm will only be required if the specific venue/club has that as a normal club rule.

Last edited by SARDG; 01-30-2013 at 00:07..
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Old 01-30-2013, 06:01   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SARDG View Post
Although Mike's a wonderful guy, he is the CFRPC GSSF Match Coordinator - not a Glock employee who can dictate rules. However, if he has heard the same thing, I'm sure he would tell you.

There are a lot of things that GSSF allows that are not in the rules - or that the rules seem to contradict at times.

Allowed (last I heard... but "tomorrow is another day".):
  • Plastic magwells
  • Plastic beavertails
  • Aftermarket slide cover plates
  • Decorative embossing/engraving on slide
  • Reshoots for absolutely anything including brain freezes
  • USPSA reloads unless specifically forbidden by local venue

There may be more that I am not remembering right now. I try to put these changes in my memory bank as they come along and spit them out when and if necessary at a match.
You mentioned that grip plugs were also legal some time ago... Not sure where all these verbal rules addendums come from, but you might want to add it to your list.
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Old 01-30-2013, 06:48   #24
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You mentioned that grip plugs were also legal some time ago... Not sure where all these verbal rules addendums come from, but you might want to add it to your list.
Thanks John - absolutely correct; unweighted plastic grip plugs are allowed and now added above. Knew I had to be forgetting something.

These come from GSSF Rangemasters over the last couple of years. I ask a lot of questions and don't hesitate to ask for clarification or rulings when necessary. I'm not going to bust somebody for something that other ROs are letting slide - either because they miss it, or are unsure of the rules.

Although the printed rules haven't kept pace, the tendency at matches has been to allow plastic, unweighted aftermarket parts that, in the minds of GSSF RMs, provide no competitive advantage. If an RO is in doubt, they can notify the shooter and then should clearly write the alleged infraction on the scoresheet and let GSSF sort it out. A competitor could be moved to unlimited if the accessory is judged to be illegal for stock.
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Old 01-30-2013, 07:25   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SARDG View Post
I was afraid that someone would ask that...

Would perhaps been better referred to as USPSA-type reload.

GSSF Rule 130.70 states (emphasis mine):
Make sure you keep the firearm pointed in a safe
direction (towards the targets) at all times especially
when reloading and unloading.
Failure
to do so will disqualify you from the match.

USPSA Rule 8.4.1 states (emphasis mine):
When loading, reloading or unloading during a course of fire, the competitorís fingers must be visibly outside the trigger guard and the handgun must be pointed safely down range or in another safe direction authorized by a Range Officer (see Section 10.5).

I'm an IDPA SO, and admittedly don't shoot USPSA - but I always seem to recognize USPSA shooters who reload with their muzzle pointing well over the impact berm. IDPA shooters... not so much.

GSSF Rule 130.70 above says "towards the targets".
USPSA Rule 8.4.1 above says "must be pointed safely down range or in another safe direction authorized by a Range Officer"

GSSF is now allowing the muzzle to be in "another safe direction authorized by the Range Officer" - which will not specifically be "towards the targets" and may in fact be over the impact berm.

Keeping the muzzle pointed below the berm will only be required if the specific venue/club has that as a normal club rule.
Some folks will also refer to this as a "tactical" reload. Some of our USPSA and LEO shooters will reload in this manner. Also some will refer to muzzle not breaking the "180" which extends vertically and horizontally.
I too wish that the printed rules would "keep up" and be all inclusive.
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Old 01-31-2013, 15:42   #26
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Originally Posted by emtjr928 View Post
Some folks will also refer to this as a "tactical" reload. Some of our USPSA and LEO shooters will reload in this manner. Also some will refer to muzzle not breaking the "180" which extends vertically and horizontally.
I too wish that the printed rules would "keep up" and be all inclusive.
And interestingly, IDPA does not have a 180 rule, only "Muzzle Safe Points".
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Old 01-31-2013, 17:55   #27
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I guess I need to get a copy of the IDPA Rule Book and read that, too!
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Old 01-31-2013, 18:12   #28
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I guess I need to get a copy of the IDPA Rule Book and read that, too!
They're online... but all that matters in the end are the GSSF rules - whatever they may be on a given day.
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Old 01-31-2013, 18:18   #29
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They're online... but all that matters in the end are the GSSF rules - whatever they may be on a given day.
I know. I am just interested for personal enrichment.
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Old 02-01-2013, 01:49   #30
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For what it's worth, I was at an armorers class today, the rep did discuss the beavertail a bit. He stated it was due in a couple of months, but with everything so chaotic right now things could change.
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Old 02-04-2013, 15:42   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SARDG View Post
GSSF is now allowing the muzzle to be in "another safe direction authorized by the Range Officer" - which will not specifically be "towards the targets" and may in fact be over the impact berm.
GSSF is specifically designed for new, and thus ignorant, shooters.

I think the purpose of this rule is if someone shows up with a "hot" gun.

A Law Enforcement officer, someone with a CCW, or just some moron who carries a loaded gun in a gun bag.

The rule allows any RO to march them over to a handy berm and safely unload.
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Old 02-04-2013, 16:45   #32
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GSSF is specifically designed for new, and thus ignorant, shooters.

I think the purpose of this rule is if someone shows up with a "hot" gun...
Nope. Rule 130.70 is under 130.00-Stage Procedures and (naturally) follows 130.60-Start Position and has to do with addressing the targets. It's the unwritten rule that now allows competitors to "point" the firearm over the berm - unless specifically disallowed by the local venue.

At my club, it is not allowed as we have hunters out the fields in the National Wildlife Refuge that out club is located within. I don't think it's allowed in Orlando (CFRPC) either. What this means is that any competitor (or RO) who is not familiar with local club policy, will not know what the policy is at any given venue unless specifically covered in the RO briefing for the ROs. Competitors will have to find out the rule when/if they are called on it.
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Old 05-17-2013, 05:25   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emtjr928 View Post
I know. I am just interested for personal enrichment.
JFYI: The IDPA Rulebook is in a rewrite as of now. I believe the new will be out soon enough.
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Old 05-17-2013, 07:27   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glockrunner View Post
JFYI: The IDPA Rulebook is in a rewrite as of now. I believe the new will be out soon enough.
The new draft rule book was released on 5/7/13 and is available on the IDPA web page. There is a three week comment period by members where further changes or clarifications will be considered.

The new rules go into effect on 10/1/13.
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Old 05-18-2013, 14:10   #35
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but all that matters in the end are the GSSF rules - whatever they may be on a given day.

and that is a true observation!!
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Old 05-20-2013, 12:11   #36
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When I shoot GSSF, my old I-Shot gun bag is on the table in front of me. It does not bother me to have it there. I shoot from "tucked in". It might be more of an issue if I shot from "ready" but I don't.

The mags I am going to use are on the table beside it.

After a string, I just push the mag button and the (now partial) mag just drops into the bag.

After the last string, I drop the mag, then just rotate the gun, still pointed at the targets, counterclockwise & nearly upside down so the ejection port is now just over the bag, rack the slide, and the chamber round goes right in the bag as well.

Lock open, RO checks it is unloaded, slide down, striker down, then it goes in one of the bag side pockets as well.

Done.

It all happens faster than it took you to read this, the gun never points higher than the targets, and I am ready to clear the table so the next shooter can come up while I go out & witness my targets scored.

Last edited by Comrade Bork; 05-20-2013 at 12:12..
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