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Old 01-25-2013, 11:01   #101
njl
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Originally Posted by SARDG View Post
And what will become of my powder puff loads from fast powders and heavy bullets? I don't load to save money (though it's a wonderful byproduct); I load to develop competition ammo that is soft-shooting and just makes PF.
Have you tested your powder/charge to see what a double looks like? This is one of the reasons I got started reloading using 124gr 9mm and Universal Clays. A double charge will overflow the case. Even with the smaller charges suitable for 147gr, a double of Universal will pretty much fill the case such that it'd be hard not to notice.

I also agree with a previous poster, frequent interruptions (to weigh powder charges or for any other reason) are a great way to introduce human error and end up with a double charge or squib. The squibs I've had were, AFAIK, all due to stopping to deal with primer slide malfunctions, and screwing up when getting back to loading.
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Old 01-25-2013, 12:57   #102
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Go find a weepy pine tree. Get some sap and use it on your wound. It will extract any foreign objects from that finger. I don't want you to loose it, the glock is enough.

Honestly I have became complacent after reloading for eight months. Thank you for the reality check. Take care.

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Wow, only 8m! You do need a reality check if complacency is creeping in. I've been at it now for 35yrs. I still check & recheck. It's no big deal to look into the case before putting bullets on top. It's always about proper techniques. Crap happens, but being diligent will prevent most problems. Once you slip into being a handle puller, time to re evaluate.
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Old 01-25-2013, 20:57   #103
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Have you tested your powder/charge to see what a double looks like? This is one of the reasons I got started reloading using 124gr 9mm and Universal Clays. A double charge will overflow the case...
Of course... no possible way for a living breathing human being to double-charge my 9mil load unless they are sleep-loading. However, the powder load nearly totally disappears in a .45 case, as I use the same fast powder. But... the published load spread for my 9mil load is about .5gr so I don't need a double-charge to begin having problems.

I got started in reloading by buying and using the progressive press I needed for the quantity I shoot, and using the fast powder(s) I would need for the load that I wanted to develop in the first place.
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Old 01-25-2013, 21:04   #104
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Of course... no possible way for a living breathing human being to double-charge my 9mil load unless they are sleep-loading. However, the powder load nearly totally disappears in a .45 case, as I use the same fast powder. But... the published load spread for my 9mil load is about .5gr so I don't need a double-charge to begin having problems.

I got started in reloading by buying and using the progressive press I needed for the quantity I shoot, and using the fast powder(s) I would need for the load that I wanted to develop in the first place.
Oh, my first press was a Dillon progressive too...I'm not in the camp that thinks everyone should start slow with a single stage or turret press. I load slow as it is...I can't imagine the amount of time it would take to make ammo on a considerably slower press.

A starting load of Universal with 124gr bullets is noticeably mild compared to 115gr factory ammo...but not nearly as mild as a sub 900fps 147gr bullet.
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Old 01-26-2013, 17:17   #105
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glad is was not the "HOLE" finger
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Old 01-27-2013, 10:25   #106
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Originally Posted by fredj338 View Post
Well, only one of two things; a double, w/ BE, likely, or a squib followed by a full pwoer load. I would assume you would have known if there was a squib event & checked. My bet is double. Just another reason I like high loft powders that fill the case at least 1/2 full.


Well, anytime you get a double, it's operator error, regradless of press type. As always, be a handloader not a handle puller. Verify EVERY charge visually. If you can't tell the charge is a double or single, change powders, life is far too short.
Right on, Fred. I always look into the case before I place a bullet over the powder, even on the Dillon 550B. This is especially important with dense, fast burning pistol powders. I use 231 a lot and noticing a double charge takes a good look-see.

I usually weigh a powder charge on the scale and then keep that round in a loading block to refer to frequently during the loading process. Also, do your self a favor and weigh out a double charge so you know what it looks like. With a fast powder it really doesn't jump out at you, so you really need to pay attention.

To see a KKM barrel blown like that is something. Definitely over pressure event... almost thinking it could be both a squib and a double charge (as unlikely as that might be).
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:22   #107
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This thread is GOOD for a reloading newby like me.
I learned a few things and see how important some of the safety steps I do really are.
I selected my first powder partially because is is a bulkier powder than some other popular 45ACP powders.
I loaded a double charge to see what it looked like.
I do a powder only stage
Zero scale.
Measure powder into cases.
Recheck scale goes back to zero.
Look at all cases with two different forms of light.
Then in the press look at each case before I set a bullet on top.
A pic I took of normal and double.
The double would have to be highly compressed.
Reloading
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:40   #108
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Originally Posted by Steel Head View Post
This thread is GOOD for a reloading newby like me.
I learned a few things and see how important some of the safety steps I do really are.
I selected my first powder partially because is is a bulkier powder than some other popular 45ACP powders.
I loaded a double charge to see what it looked like.
I do a powder only stage
Zero scale.
Measure powder into cases.
Recheck scale goes back to zero.
Look at all cases with two different forms of light.
Then in the press look at each case before I set a bullet on top.
A pic I took of normal and double.
The double would have to be highly compressed.
Reloading
That's a wierd looking powder, what is it?
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Old 01-27-2013, 12:09   #109
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That's a wierd looking powder, what is it?
Winchester Super Target.
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Old 01-27-2013, 12:14   #110
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Winchester Super Target.
Is it actually white like that, or is it just the pic?
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Old 01-27-2013, 14:31   #111
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My WST has all been light grey. I think the white WST is just the lighting in the picture.
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Old 01-27-2013, 14:41   #112
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Is it actually white like that, or is it just the pic?
More of a light Sagebrush green/gray.
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Old 01-27-2013, 15:07   #113
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That barrel pic is called the reverse Elmer Fudd effect. You know, when Bugs Bunny sticks his finger in the end of Elmer's shotgun barrel, only in reverse?
Needless to say, I'm glad you came out of it relatively unscathed, albeit, a little shell schocked.
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Old 01-27-2013, 16:16   #114
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Originally Posted by njl View Post
My WST has all been light grey. I think the white WST is just the lighting in the picture.


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Originally Posted by Steel Head View Post
More of a light Sagebrush green/gray.
Got it. I'm used to the graphite color. And then there is the hard for me to discern red of Red Dot, and the blue of Blue Dot.
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Old 01-30-2013, 14:45   #115
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Originally Posted by alank2 View Post
Hi,


Do you have more rounds that haven't been fired? One thing you can do (other than pulling them) is post weigh rounds to catch any that fall outside a certain range. For example, you might find that all your rounds fall between 240.4 and 241.9 grains except for one that might be 236.4 (possible squib) or 245.2 (possible double), etc.

Good luck,

Alan
I have tried that. The variation in brass and bullet weight will conceal a double charge.
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Old 01-30-2013, 18:35   #116
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I have tried that. The variation in brass and bullet weight will conceal a double charge.
^THIS^ Unless you are talking charge wts over about 8gr, you can't find a small charge cariation, even 5gr isn't reliable using mixed brass.
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Old 01-30-2013, 18:41   #117
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I have tried that. The variation in brass and bullet weight will conceal a double charge.
Agreed. When I had multiple squibs from a batch of 230gr JHP 3.8gr Clays, I weighed all the remaining loaded rounds, found a couple that were well under the avg weight and was sure they were undercharged. I pulled them first and found 3.8gr of Clays in each of them. I then pulled the 100+ other remaining from the batch and found 3.8gr Clays in every one of them.
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Old 01-30-2013, 19:58   #118
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My buddy and i did some test loads of various poweders for some precision delta bullets we ordered. I have the chrono and he had the time to load them up. We shot them and recorded the data for future loading. He loaded about 1k 40s&w and a few weeks later I was going to load the same. Being that it had been a few weeks I reviewd the data and double checked the data with a few manuals before I begain the process. Our favored load didn't seem right. It was way above any book by a gr. so I called hime up to see if he had the orginals, (he had typed up copies of the test). He called me back and said "don't load those bullets", he went and shot a few and the third one blew off his extractor. The cases were mushroomed. He didn't have a copy of the orginal test and we are guessing that he copied them down wrong. Oh and he has 997 rounds to pull bullets on. Thankfully he didn't get hurt and about $36 in parts he was going again. I am so glad I double check the load data and questioned it.
BE CAREFUL.

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Old 01-30-2013, 23:24   #119
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He didn't have a copy of the orginal test and we are guessing that he copied them down wrong. Oh and he has 997 rounds to pull bullets on. Thankfully he didn't get hurt and about $36 in parts he was going again. I am so glad I double check the load data and questioned it.[/SIZE][/FONT]
BE CAREFUL.
Darwin project, you are obviously the smart one. You check your data 4,5 or 10 times before loading JUST test rounds only. Load !0rds, that's it, test those. Then BEFORE you load 1000rds, check the data again, as many times as it takes to be 100% sure it is correct. The ONLY way you get in trouble reloading is lack of attention to detail. IT's why handle pullers need not apply, stick to factory ammo.
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Old 01-31-2013, 14:12   #120
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Darwin project, you are obviously the smart one. You check your data 4,5 or 10 times before loading JUST test rounds only. Load !0rds, that's it, test those. Then BEFORE you load 1000rds, check the data again, as many times as it takes to be 100% sure it is correct. The ONLY way you get in trouble reloading is lack of attention to detail. IT's why handle pullers need not apply, stick to factory ammo.
I wouldn't go as far as to put darwin in it. We did some pretty intensive testing on these loads with various powders, chrono everything, standing and bench rest, etc. The mistake was a simple transfer of data error. My buddy hasn't loaded very long and didn't catch it. It stood out to me, (thus the 5.5 years of reloading coming into play). Actually I have reloaded this weight bullet alot, it was just a new company and I wanted to test it and help teach him. Point was a simple mistake in reloading can have bad outcomes.
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Old 01-31-2013, 14:26   #121
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My point exaclty. Trying to remember stuff & transfvering data canbe very dangerous. Verify the data, write down, double check that, Then when you actually reload, duible check that. You ca never be careful enough. I read stories all the time of really stupid reloading accidents that are 100% preventable. Like a recent one of a guy loading PP instead of some stick powder into 223 rounds. KB is AR & his buddies in a 3 gun match. How, the powder look nothing alike. Read the lable, verify everything 2, 3, 4 or as many times as needed to NOT make the mistake. Anything else is a Darwin project IMO. Harsh yes, but I may be standing next to you when your gun self destructs. I hate that.
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Old 01-31-2013, 16:34   #122
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[QUOTE= Anything else is a Darwin project IMO. Harsh yes, but I may be standing next to you when your gun self destructs. I hate that.[/QUOTE]

Lol, I very much doubt you will ever see me in So Cal

I know what you mean.
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Old 01-31-2013, 17:03   #123
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Lol, I very much doubt you will ever see me in So Cal

I know what you mean.
HEy, I travel to shoot. I was out that way last year @ the GA & Tenn state IDPA matches & So in Tenn. So anything is possible.
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Old 01-31-2013, 22:15   #124
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Glad that you're o.k.

yeah, powder check die, weight, some sort of confirmation every 25 rounds or so to be sure nothing weird is going on.
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Old 02-01-2013, 17:49   #125
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I agree with BMiracletx. I use a Hornady LNL progressive with the Power Cop die. It really helps you see if you have a double charge. Definitely weigh your loads that are complete. You can do it in batches, and if a batch is out of whack, you can check individual loads.
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