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Old 03-11-2011, 15:58   #151
RussP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickD View Post
... turn out to be local media...

Wasn't that same "local mediaa=" source derided by the pro-anti-authority arguers ?
I have no idea what you are talking about.
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Old 03-11-2011, 16:08   #152
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickD View Post
After six pages of your nonsense, I thought it appropriate to try a different angle to get a response.
"My nonsense"? Okay, at least you are admitting to changing the rules in mid-discussion. That is progress.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RickD View Post
He was describing behaviors common and appropriate for attorneys. These same attorneys counsel American Citizens to do the same thing. So what's the problem with the comparison?
You're reaching real high, but still can't reach the top of the hole you're digging.

The problem is you did not respond in the same context Sam asked his question.
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Originally Posted by RickD View Post
Really?
Yes.
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Originally Posted by RickD View Post
The point is, why does TBO et al lump in a couple of drug-dog-article posters with that sub group?
Maybe TBO will comment on that, but to be honest, I doubt you will accept any response he might give.
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Old 03-11-2011, 16:16   #153
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Originally Posted by TheeBadOne View Post
"Intellectual Dishonesty".
Intellectual dishonesty
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Intellectual dishonesty is dishonesty in performing intellectual activities like thought or communication. Examples are:
  • the advocacy of a position which the advocate knows or believes to be false or misleading
  • the advocacy of a position which the advocate does not know to be true, and has not performed rigorous due diligence to ensure the truthfulness of the position
  • the conscious omission of aspects of the truth known or believed to be relevant in the particular context.
Rhetoric is used to advance an agenda or to reinforce one's deeply held beliefs in the face of overwhelming contrary evidence.[1] If a person is aware of the evidence and agrees with the conclusion it portends, yet advocates a contradictory view, they commit intellectual dishonesty. If the person is unaware of the evidence, their position is ignorance, even if in agreement with the scientific conclusion. If the person is knowingly aware that there may be additional evidence but purposefully fails to check, and then acts as though the position is confirmed, this is also intellectual dishonesty.

The terms intellectually dishonest and intellectual dishonesty are often used as rhetorical devices in a debate; the label invariably frames an opponent in a negative light.

The phrase is also frequently used by orators when a debate foe or audience reaches a conclusion varying from the speaker's on a given subject. This appears mostly in debates or discussions of speculative, non-scientific issues, such as morality or policy.
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Old 03-11-2011, 16:25   #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RussP View Post
"My nonsense"? Okay, at least you are admitting to changing the rules in mid-discussion.
"Changing the rules?" So sad that you're actually serious about that. So, no, I'll have to deny your hope.

Quote:
Maybe TBO will comment on that,
He might, but what would his comment be worth? He posts in short phrases designed to taunt, or he posts a jpeg. He also changes his text color to light blue.

I think I'm on the mark with TBO. He gave as much thought to his anti-authority taunt as he does to his others.
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Old 03-11-2011, 16:27   #155
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[QUOTE=RussP;17026905]Intellectual dishonesty
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Quote:
Intellectual dishonesty is dishonesty in performing intellectual activities like thought or communication. Examples are:

...the advocacy of a position which the advocate knows or believes to be false or misleading

etc, etc
You're onto something, Russ, This sounds like TBO's anti-authority taunt.

Quote:
...used as rhetorical devices in a debate; the label invariably frames an opponent in a negative light.
Yep, that's TBO purpose for the taunt, fer sure !!

Thanks...
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Old 03-11-2011, 16:29   #156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RussP View Post
I have no idea what you are talking about.
Yes you dooooooo.
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Old 03-11-2011, 16:36   #157
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Yes you dooooooo.
Sorry, I do not. How about a link to what you are talking about.
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Old 03-12-2011, 14:25   #158
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If you're considering today's movements of zero tolerance, safety, random searches without cause, etc., then the response of the average citizen could be more accurately described as anti-authoritarian.
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Old 03-12-2011, 14:38   #159
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthCarolinaLiberty View Post
If you're considering today's movements of zero tolerance, safety, random searches without cause, etc., then the response of the average citizen could be more accurately described as anti-authoritarian.
People are free to exercise their own personal bias, agenda, or interpretation.

It is up to ones morals and values to establish what path they take.
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Originally Posted by Rooster Rugburn:
Didn't the whole sheepdog thing actually start right here on Glock Talk? A bunch of wannabees bought a bunch of T-shirts and took an oath to defend those who won't defend themselves?
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Old 03-12-2011, 15:50   #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheeBadOne View Post
People are free to exercise their own personal bias, agenda, or interpretation.

It is up to ones morals and values to establish what path they take.

If you're talking about things beyond earthly, then there is a clear difference between authority and authoritarian. No one is above ultimate authority.
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Old 03-15-2011, 10:29   #161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickD View Post
Police arresting elementary students for violation of "Zero Tolerance" policies, like drawing stick figures...

http://www.kdvr.com/news/kdvr-arvada...,7099823.story
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/03/15...est=latestnews
Quote:
BURLINGTON, Colo. -- Documents released Monday in the case of a 12-year-old Colorado boy accused of fatally shooting his parents and wounding two siblings show prosecutors filed nine charges against him, including two counts of first-degree murder.
The documents released by a judge at the request of prosecutors also offer new details from investigators alleging the boy tried to hurt his 5-year-old sister with a knife and stabbed and shot his 9-year-old brother. The Denver Post and KUSA-TV report that the documents were released after a closed court hearing.


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/03/15...#ixzz1GgbTKJBP
Now, of course this 12 year old was home schooled, so there is no way to know if he exhibited any behavior that would have predicted to teachers and administrators the pending violence had he been in a public school.
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Old 03-19-2011, 20:32   #162
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I come back from vacation and find the status quo. I'd hoped for better, although I didn't really expect it.

In the end, no answer after all this time (yeah, I re-read Post #5... what sentence contained the "answer"? The one that wants us to believe that a lawyer's common advice not talk to LEO?). Meh.

So, as far as TBO's post is concerned, "anti-authority" has no deep contextual meaning, and is meant only to taunt and to suppress argumentation (like calling someone a racist, or, heck, anti-healthcare, for that matter). So I'll exercise my right not to take offense to his emptiness.
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Old 03-19-2011, 20:47   #163
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickD View Post
I come back from vacation and find the status quo. I'd hoped for better, although I didn't really expect it.

In the end, no answer after all this time (yeah, I re-read Post #5... what sentence contained the "answer"? The one that wants us to believe that a lawyer's common advice not talk to LEO?). Meh.

So, as far as TBO's post is concerned, "anti-authority" has no deep contextual meaning, and is meant only to taunt and to suppress argumentation (like calling someone a racist, or, heck, anti-healthcare, for that matter). So I'll exercise my right not to take offense to his emptiness.
I believe Sam's previous post is appropriate here, too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Spade View Post
Sorry, Rick, I don't think you're discussing this in good faith. You've been given answers and dismiss them summarily, with no attempt to explore what's involved. You set and insist on standards, using words you refuse to define. Until you change some of this, there's no way I can add to a conversation with you.
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Old 03-19-2011, 21:46   #164
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What am I rebelling against?

Whaddya got?



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4NkkAQllfo&NR=1


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Old 03-21-2011, 17:44   #165
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The answer, dear NCL, is in Post #5, eh, somewhere. Not sure what sentence brings it altogether, but I hear tell that a golden nugget of truth (all caps) exists in the dark regions of that brave post.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Spade
Sorry, Rick, I don't think you're discussing this in good faith. You've been given answers and dismiss them summarily, with no attempt to explore what's involved.
Quote:
summarily
–adverb
1.
in a prompt or direct manner; immediately; straightaway.
Well, I am both prompt and direct. However, I do explore. For example, I mentioned that what was being described as "anti-authority" is the common practice of defense attorneys. Seems odd for him to become angry when a person takes the time-proven advice of someone who graduated from law school and passed their state Bar exam.
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Old 04-17-2011, 15:53   #166
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Here is post #5

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Spade View Post
Kinda a complicated question; lots of facets to the same issue, not all of which connect to each other.

In very, very broad terms, authority is what imposes order in a community. That can be parental authority in a family or legal authority in society. A segment of the community chafes under that, wholly happy to cause friction--loss of order--for others as long as they get their way. You might remember the recent WI thread: when the protesters were told, "go ahead and stay" some left. They didn't want to stay in the Capitol as much as they wanted to disrupt order and tranquility. Yet the balance between order and freedom is vital to the health of a society. (Read that last again; the whole "balance" thing is key to my views and this discussion.)

Cops see this every day. They are the visible manifestation of the state's authority and they bear the brunt of the juvenile "what about meeeee" rants. We're the ones telling you to turn down the music, the street is closed, those guys have a right to protest, you've had too much to drink---tons of stuff where you don't get it your way because society has a voice, too.

Remember our thread "Reason on consent searches"? The people, including you, who wanted to curtail LE authority (ability is a better word) to ask permission to search people's stuff? Classic example of what we're discussing here. Another example is the myriad of the "Don't ever talk to the police" threads: obstruction for the sake of obstruction, rationalized as exercising rights. Same thing with the dozens of posters in CI who won't respect a property owner's authority to ban guns because the sign wasn't just so, or they weren't told or concealed means concealed: pure rationalization of their disregard for authority in favor of their personal desires.

I now await the accusations of statism, sure to come from those who don't understand the two-sided nature of any contract, including social contracts. Or maybe they skipped over the part where I said how important balance is.
.....
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Old 04-17-2011, 17:52   #167
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So is it your assertion that there isn't a streak of anti-authoritarianism to be found on these boards? Or are you just asking what constitutes that streak?
There is a streak of anti-authoritarianism in the majority of the progeny of those who came to this country to get away from it in other countries. That makes it in a majority of the population.

Me included. I am a LAC, but don't mess with me. I have no problem talking to the LEO's when I have something pertinent to say, but don't start questioning me for no legal or apparent reason. If I am not in custody and one starts that I will just walk away. If one lays hands on me without justification, look for assault charges. I am not out there crossing the line, don't cross mine.
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Old 04-18-2011, 12:21   #168
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Originally Posted by OldCurlyWolf View Post
There is a streak of anti-authoritarianism in the majority of the progeny of those who came to this country to get away from it in other countries. That makes it in a majority of the population.

Me included. I am a LAC, but don't mess with me. I have no problem talking to the LEO's when I have something pertinent to say, but don't start questioning me for no legal or apparent reason. If I am not in custody and one starts that I will just walk away. If one lays hands on me without justification, look for assault charges. I am not out there crossing the line, don't cross mine.
Hoven't you learned yet? Sit down. Shut up. Do as you are told. We won't have any problems then.

-Dana
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Twice a week? 14 times a month?
Quote:
2x4=8, not 14.
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Old 04-25-2011, 07:37   #169
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All things, in balance.
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"If you have integrity, nothing else matters. If you don't have integrity, nothing else matters".

"A person who won't reason has no advantage over one who can't reason."

"Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored."

“Ignorance is a lot like alcohol: the more you have of it, the less you are able to see its effect on you.”


Originally Posted by Rooster Rugburn:
Didn't the whole sheepdog thing actually start right here on Glock Talk? A bunch of wannabees bought a bunch of T-shirts and took an oath to defend those who won't defend themselves?
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Old 04-25-2011, 08:54   #170
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Originally Posted by TheeBadOne View Post
All things, in balance.
Isn't that the question? Where is the balance point between indivual liberties and society's interets?

-Dana
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Quote:
Twice a week? 14 times a month?
Quote:
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Many of the truths that we cling to depend on our point of view.

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Old 04-29-2011, 19:11   #171
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In the courts.
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"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened."

"If you have integrity, nothing else matters. If you don't have integrity, nothing else matters".

"A person who won't reason has no advantage over one who can't reason."

"Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored."

“Ignorance is a lot like alcohol: the more you have of it, the less you are able to see its effect on you.”


Originally Posted by Rooster Rugburn:
Didn't the whole sheepdog thing actually start right here on Glock Talk? A bunch of wannabees bought a bunch of T-shirts and took an oath to defend those who won't defend themselves?
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Old 04-30-2012, 11:35   #172
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http://www.cscja-acjcs.ca/role_of_courts-en.asp?l=4
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Old 02-06-2013, 20:46   #173
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http://www.cscja-acjcs.ca/sources_of_law-en.asp?l=4
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Old 02-08-2013, 00:21   #174
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never been to civil liberties . not much here
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Old 04-28-2013, 03:22   #175
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Might be a good time to reintroduce this thread...

Some in current threads didn't participate when this first came out...
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