[MadeInAmerica]

Originally Posted by eagle359

I have never seen the average beat cop as my enemy. Most of them are just trying to make a living and provide for their family doing a very difficult job. But I do know what happened in and around New Orleans after Katrina. Cops were taking guns from citizens who were on there own property and in some cases inside their own homes. They were told to disarm citizens and they did. Afterwards the guns were allowed to rust in a storage locker. The city only agreed to return the guns after a lawsuit from the NRA. That is the fear that I have. When I was on active duty we were told that you did not have to obey an unlawful order. But when your rank is telling you to do something I would think that most cops will obey their rank.

Don't blame a few bad cops for following bad orders. Blame the citizens ( sheeple ) for not having the guts to tell the cops no. It's easy to talk tough.

[poikilotrm]

Originally Posted by Kingarthurhk

Please give us some examples.

Well, there was that time that Sheriff Mark McClure broke into my home and manufactured an SBR, then charged me with having a dangerous weapon under Georgia law. He also tried to get the ATF to charge me, but they refused because he told them what he did. He later admitted having manufactured the SBR while under oath and on the stand.

He was never arrested, never charged, yada yada yada.

If you are serious, please start a thread asking me to list where cops have enforced unConstitutional laws. I will be happy to provide numerous links. We can start with that troop busted for having standard capacity AR mags in NY if you like.

[poikilotrm]

Originally Posted by MadeInAmerica

Don't blame a few bad cops for following bad orders. Blame the citizens ( sheeple ) for not having the guts to tell the cops no. It's easy to talk tough.

Really? You're going Nuremburg on this? Wow.

[certifiedfunds]

Originally Posted by tous

With all due respect, sir.

No despotic power has ever found a shortage of government employees willing to enforce whatever oppressive policies such a government deems desirable to retain and increase their rule.

I understand that you feel the need to defend your fraternity as composed of individuals of character, but exhortation and fine speeches do little to ease the fear of those of us potentially under your symbolic jack boot.

Originally Posted by tous

Thank you for the insulting rebuttal.

Do you disagee that when governments, any government, seeks to oppress that they cannot find those in their society willing to enforce their policies with whatever level of violence is required?

When was the last time that a revolt against a despotic regime was created and led by the regime's law enforcement employees?

Do I suggest that you or your friends will be the ones kicking in doors at midnight? I do not. I suggest that someone with a badge will be willing and eager to do so.

Most excellent, tous.

Letters or no letters, what the American people deserve is to have their public servants publicly refuse to enforce unconstitutional laws that seek to destroy the People's natural rights. Period.

[certifiedfunds]

Originally Posted by wprebeck

This story contains the following:

Evil union employees
Law enforcement officers
Guns


So, read at your own risk.






Well, the event that I was told would never happen (even though it is happening more and more frequently across the country), occurred last night.

I was at our monthly FOP (Fraternal Order of Police) meeting, when the subject of the pending AWB legislation was broached. It seems that, in 1994, the National Lodge supported the ban. Oops.

We were informed last night that a number of lodges from around the country are now sending letters to the National President, urging him to support the 2nd Amendment, and the right of people to bear arms - and to NOT support any further gun control laws. We were also asked to decide, as a group, whether or not to join in this practice.

Not a single person disagreed with supporting citizens. Hell, the President of my lodge is a CCDW instructor, and many of the board members are "gun nuts" (I am, as well - just not a board member).

So, the third largest FOP lodge in the state of Kentucky just voted to send a letter to the National President urging him to NOT SUPPORT gun control laws.

Yep. We, the evil union members who wear jackboots, are on your side. And, the numbers of us who are speaking out publicly are growing, as evidenced by numerous threads in this very forum.

So, please keep this in mind before going off on a hate filled spree against LE, mmkay? We really "are" on your side - and pensions don't much matter to most of us, when it comes time to do the right thing. I have been repeatedly assured that is NOT the case, but the odd thing is: none of those doing the mouth running are cops - and ALL of the ones I've talked to who say they will NOT take guns...are cops.

Hmm...who to believe?

I don't know what remedies you have at your legal disposal, but, if your FOP leadership ignores your request what will you do? Will you leave the union? Vote to dissolve it? Will you resign or refuse to enforce gun control laws if ordered to do so?

[certifiedfunds]

Originally Posted by Patchman

Kudos, sir.

You'd be disappointed as to how many people really don't know (or don't want to acknowledge) that cops don't make the laws.

Laws are made by lawmakers (sounds obvious), who are the Legislative branch of our .gov. They are answerable to their constituents (that's you and me) who can elect them into, and out of, office. True, it might take 2 to 4 years before election time, but it comes.

Make or enforce.....doesn't really matter. That's too often a copout. It takes two hands to shake. Laws are meaningless without willing enforcers.

[ilgunguygt]

Originally Posted by RussP

Yes, you are correct. Those in LE do not make the the laws.

Let me ask you this. Whenever Obama, Bloomberg, Feinstein, Cuomo, those people have press conferences promoting gun control, who generally, beyond their current fondness for children, can be found in the background demonstrating support for their agenda?

And when legislation is introduced at both the Federal and State level, during committee hearings, who testifies, or offers letters of agreement and support for those gun control measures?

Aren't those people the Chiefs and Sheriffs of major jurisdictions and representatives of major law enforcement associations?

Yes, they do not make the law, but their presence indicates, falsely, that they represent all of law enforcement. The politicians who do make the law want everyone to believe that lie. They want people to believe that every officer, deputy, agent they see wants the gun control they, the politicians are proposing.

How do you counter that? It's simple. Have more police and sheriffs organizations come out publicly against gun control.

How do you do that? You contact them. You ask for their support. You ask them to stand beside you. You ask them stand up for they Constitution.

Now, when the politicians call on them to appear as decorations on their agenda cake, they'll say, "No. your legislation will not deter gun violence by the criminals making the headlines on which you feed. It will undermine the Right of self defense of the very citizens, law abiding citizens, you represent..."

Yes, politicians do value support from LE. Our job is to have the overwhelming support on our side, behind politicians against gun control, not Obama's side, not Feinstein's side, not Bloomberg's side, not Cuomo's side.

See why it is important to seek that support from cops?

You can take this however you want, but you place way too much importance on yourself and other people in law enforcements opinion.

If you think for one minute that the powers that be give a damn what you think you would be mistaken.

[ilgunguygt]

Originally Posted by poikilotrm

Well, there was that time that Sheriff Mark McClure broke into my home and manufactured an SBR, then charged me with having a dangerous weapon under Georgia law. He also tried to get the ATF to charge me, but they refused because he told them what he did. He later admitted having manufactured the SBR while under oath and on the stand.

He was never arrested, never charged, yada yada yada.

If you are serious, please start a thread asking me to list where cops have enforced unConstitutional laws. I will be happy to provide numerous links. We can start with that troop busted for having standard capacity AR mags in NY if you like.

I would love to hear that story.

[wprebeck]

Well, all too often, people in elected positions that go against the majority opinion of the voters fins themselves ousted. Plus, unlike the Congress - the FOP does what the rank and file want. Its one of several reasons we didn't endorse anyone for the Presidential race. Both choices sucked equally.