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Old 01-09-2010, 10:47   #1
Makoman
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Help with 220 decision

Hey guy's. I need your help in selection of a 220. I've always been partial to .45's and particularly to 1911's. I was contemplating a combat commander but that 220 just beckons, particularly a 220 Carry. I shot one once and the memory of it really stands out in my mind. It was extremely accurate, and very comfortable in my hands, and pointed very naturally, just like a 1911.

The only dilemma I have now is this. I come to find out they have a SAO model, which makes me want one even more dammit! I have DA pistols but I've always preferred the cocked and locked mode of carry like on a 1911. With practice, disengaging the safety while bringing the weapon to bear has become second nature for me so I'm thinking the transition to the SAO would be pretty easy as compared to going to the DA/SA.

Having a double action first shot with no safety isn't bad either, but guns like that (like the SIG) usually have really heavy double action triggers (to act as a "passive" type of safety I suppose), but that first shot usually ends up being a "throw-away".

I digress however. Here are my questions. Those of you that have the SAO, what do you like or dislike about it? Those of you that have both the SAO and the traditional DA/SA, which one do you like better/prefer and why?

Thanks guys.
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Old 01-09-2010, 16:00   #2
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Hey guy's. I need your help in selection of a 220. I've always been partial to .45's and particularly to 1911's. I was contemplating a combat commander but that 220 just beckons, particularly a 220 Carry. I shot one once and the memory of it really stands out in my mind. It was extremely accurate, and very comfortable in my hands, and pointed very naturally, just like a 1911.

The only dilemma I have now is this. I come to find out they have a SAO model, which makes me want one even more dammit! I have DA pistols but I've always preferred the cocked and locked mode of carry like on a 1911. With practice, disengaging the safety while bringing the weapon to bear has become second nature for me so I'm thinking the transition to the SAO would be pretty easy as compared to going to the DA/SA.

Having a double action first shot with no safety isn't bad either, but guns like that (like the SIG) usually have really heavy double action triggers (to act as a "passive" type of safety I suppose), but that first shot usually ends up being a "throw-away".

I digress however. Here are my questions. Those of you that have the SAO, what do you like or dislike about it? Those of you that have both the SAO and the traditional DA/SA, which one do you like better/prefer and why?

Thanks guys.
Great observations and a concern I addressed not too long ago.

All of my self defense pistols are DA/SA for the reason you mentioned regarding the "...heavy double action triggers (to act as a "passive" type of safety)..." and that is why I will not own a Glock or any other striker fired pistol. Every week there is a Glock thread, "How do you store your Glock on a nightstand in case I wake up and pull the trigger by accident?" I guess they forgot their own mantra about "the safety is between your ears." Anyway, my P220ST sits on my nightstand hammer down.

Learning how to operate the DA of a DA/SA takes practice to become proficient and accurate; and actually fun. Just as mag changes are fun and good excercize. (The G17s with 33 round mags miss out on this operation.)

As for my 1911s, I never carry one, nor is one on my nightstand. They are strictly for bullseye action fun.

My suggestion is to think through each gun's applications, and what you feel most comforatble doing.
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Old 01-09-2010, 16:36   #3
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Thanks for the reply Cobra. I'm really considering the double action now as well. In doing my research, I've come to find out that SIG offers a Short Reset Trigger kit for ther DA/SA guns. One of the things I liked about the SAO is that it's trigger really does "break like glass" as claimed on SIG's website. Besides reducing trigger reset by 60%, I'm guessing that the SRT setup might make the SA trigger pull on the standard DA/SA feel very similar to the SAO's.

Not having handled an SRT equipped gun myself I can't personally attest to this. I'd like to be able to get the SRT kit myself and install it, that way if I don't like it I can always go back to the original setup without having to fork out all that extra cash to have SIG do the work. I've detail stripped many a 1911 and some other guns so I don't have a problem doing the work myself, but it seems almost like getting an SRT kit is the equivalent to searching for the holy grail!
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Old 01-09-2010, 17:39   #4
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Thanks for the reply Cobra. I'm really considering the double action now as well. In doing my research, I've come to find out that SIG offers a Short Reset Trigger kit for ther DA/SA guns. One of the things I liked about the SAO is that it's trigger really does "break like glass" as claimed on SIG's website. Besides reducing trigger reset by 60%, I'm guessing that the SRT setup might make the SA trigger pull on the standard DA/SA feel very similar to the SAO's.

Not having handled an SRT equipped gun myself I can't personally attest to this. I'd like to be able to get the SRT kit myself and install it, that way if I don't like it I can always go back to the original setup without having to fork out all that extra cash to have SIG do the work. I've detail stripped many a 1911 and some other guns so I don't have a problem doing the work myself, but it seems almost like getting an SRT kit is the equivalent to searching for the holy grail!
Be carefull with your expectations with the Short Rest Trigger. It's not the magic trigger that many think it is. Some say that creep is longer than with the standard trigger action.

Lots to read here:

http://sigforum.com/eve/forums/a/tpc...4462#953104462

http://sigforum.com/eve/forums/a/tpc...3971095361/p/1

http://sigforum.com/eve/forums/a/tpc...9741#203109741



Alll of my work is done by Grayguns who not only did the sight and cometic work, but also put in his proprietary Competition Action Package that includes his SRT design. Bruce Gray is, or was, a contractor for Sig in Exeter. He's actually fixed some of their engineering and design SNAFUS.
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Old 01-09-2010, 18:39   #5
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Thanks for those links Cobra, that's a lot of great info!
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Old 01-10-2010, 01:51   #6
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If you want to give DA/SA a try, don't worry about the trigger. The DA is just good practice. You can always send it to GrayGuns and get your trigger woes fixed. My 220 is my most accurate .45. Right up there with both of my father's Series 70 Colts.
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Old 01-10-2010, 02:08   #7
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That's what I'm leaning toward Red Tape. Prolly a 220R Carry. I like the Beavertail Grip of the Elite but living in Commiefornia, it's not on the DOJ's "approved" list.. The regular grip frame feels just fine though don't know if that beavertail would end up being worth the added cost. I really like the 220 in that size though, I fondled one today and I liked it alot!
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Old 01-10-2010, 02:23   #8
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I hear ya. I'd love to get a 220 Carry to go with my fullsize. Since I haven't shot a Carry yet, I can't say whether the beavertail is needed or not, it certainly isn't on a regular 220, although they do look nice. Either way it'll be a sweet shooter.

If you haven't checked Bruce Gray's site out yet, take a look.

http://grayguns.com/

Lots of different options for the trigger.
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Old 01-10-2010, 02:35   #9
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Have you had any trigger work on your SIG's? What did you have done?
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Old 01-10-2010, 03:10   #10
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I'm waiting to get my 228 done with a reduced reset comprehensive duty package. I've shot a 229 with the RRCDP and a 226 with the competition short reset package.

The SA on every Sig I've shot has been excellent. The main thing I dislike about Sig triggers is the long reset. The RRCDP did a great job of shortening it while smoothing up the DA at the same time.

The CSR was a little too light for my taste as I'm not big into the games, although I'm considering using my 228 for IDPA this year.

In my opinion you get ALOT more for your money with GrayGuns rather than shipping your gun to Sig for the SRT. That being said, I've only dry fired the SRT once and it was new, no break-in, so you might check on Sigforum to get some info from people with more experience with that trigger system.
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Old 01-10-2010, 22:41   #11
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The decision is getting even tougher. I went and handled that 220 carry SAO again today. That single action trigger really does break like glass. It's so sweeeet! Plus, it's a consignment gun that's selling for 700 bucks that's hardly been fired. There's absolutely no wear on the feed ramp at all.

Everywhere else around me, these and the DA/SA are selling for mid to high 800's new. I think it's not too bad of a deal.
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Old 01-10-2010, 22:58   #12
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Have you had any trigger work on your SIG's? What did you have done?
I've known Bruce for almost four years and can say that he is the finest Sig pistolsmith in the United States. He's consulted with folks in Exeter and has taught at Sig Sauer Academy.

At a class last year I asked if he'd like to turn my six year old P226ST into an SL.

A year ago...

The Sig Sauer Club




Today with Competition Action Package with Grayguns proprietary short reset trigger, Dawson fiber optic front sight, Warren Tactical rear sight, tac rails removed, and Superblack finish:


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Old 01-10-2010, 23:03   #13
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You would have to show me that wouldn't you? That sig look mitghty fine, That sight setup is nice too. Gives me ideas, don't give me any more, you're tormenting me!
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Old 01-10-2010, 23:11   #14
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You would have to show me that wouldn't you? That sig look mitghty fine, That sight setup is nice too. Gives me ideas, don't give me any more, you're tormenting me!
Hey, I'm just tryin' to get you to spend yer money. It's good for the economy.

Seriously, call Bruce and explain to him what you want. He's really a nice guy, very patient, and knows more about guns (not just Sigs) than anyone you'll ever meet.
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Old 01-11-2010, 01:08   #15
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Ohhhh

Now I want a 226! I need a second job.
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Old 01-11-2010, 01:24   #16
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Ohhhh

Now I want a 226! I need a second job.
Me too! I've been out of work for over a year.

Anyway, the 220 is a fine piece, especially for HD use, but with mine having a DA/SA trigger, probably not as fun to shoot as the 220 SAO.


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Old 01-11-2010, 01:35   #17
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DAK trigger?
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Old 01-11-2010, 01:42   #18
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DAK trigger?
The de-cocking lever on the 220 indicates that it's DA/SA.
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Old 01-11-2010, 20:09   #19
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I bought a Sig 220 Carry right before Christmas and I am absolutely in love with the gun. Its DA/ SA and it shoots like a dream!!!! I all have a 226 and 229 in 40 with the same trigger and they are tack drivers. Can't go wrong with the 220
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Old 01-12-2010, 20:05   #20
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Is that so Larry? How 'bout some pics to tantalize us a bit?
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Old 01-12-2010, 21:21   #21
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Is that so Larry? How 'bout some pics to tantalize us a bit?
My Pleasure, Not the best pics but you get the idea

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Old 01-12-2010, 21:43   #22
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Sweet. 3 little pigs, or should I say sigs, in a blanket!
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Old 01-13-2010, 08:36   #23
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I have a Sig 220R SAO full size and love it. It is in many ways a modern 1911.
It feeds/extracts anything,the safty is in the right spot if you are used to a 1911, and the single action is great.

Really like this gun and have nothing but good things to say about it.
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Old 01-22-2010, 00:21   #24
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I have a Sig 220R SAO full size and love it. It is in many ways a modern 1911.
It feeds/extracts anything,the safty is in the right spot if you are used to a 1911, and the single action is great.

Really like this gun and have nothing but good things to say about it.
I've been wondering. Since I'm planning on the carry version which has a 4" bbl, would it be better to shoot a lighter weight bullet like a 180 grain, or would it be wiser to stick with 230's?
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Old 01-22-2010, 00:27   #25
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I own a 220 carry in stainless and love it. It is a tack driver and very concealable.
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