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Old 01-13-2010, 14:19   #1
Kicking bird
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Squib

Well last night at a persoanl defence shoot i had a squib load. My springfield 45 Champion won't return to battery and i tried four or five times but the slide refused to move forward. The ranger officer running the drill reallized the problem and pushed the bullet out with a brass rod. The RO and I both agreed that we didin't hear a pop of just the primer.

I quit shooting because I was concerned about it happening again and having the bullet lodged further down the barrel and then a round fired on top of the stuck bullet.

I am very careful about my reloading habits and have a single stage press and i don't understand how I missed the uncharged case.

Now i have rough 500-600 loaded rounds to weigh to make sure theres powder in them. PITA!!!

I had other RO's state that it happens and not to sweat it. This SUCKS !!
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Old 01-13-2010, 14:23   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kicking bird View Post
Well last night at a persoanl defence shoot i had a squib load. My springfield 45 Champion won't return to battery and i tried four or five times but the slide refused to move forward. The ranger officer running the drill reallized the problem and pushed the bullet out with a brass rod. The RO and I both agreed that we didin't hear a pop of just the primer.

I quit shooting because I was concerned about it happening again and having the bullet lodged further down the barrel and then a round fired on top of the stuck bullet.

I am very careful about my reloading habits and have a single stage press and i don't understand how I missed the uncharged case.

Now i have rough 500-600 loaded rounds to weigh to make sure theres powder in them. PITA!!!

I had other RO's state that it happens and not to sweat it. This SUCKS !!

You can drop them in a funnel and shake them and hear the powder ratttle around inside. Tells you nothing about a double charge.
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Old 01-13-2010, 14:25   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kicking bird View Post
Well last night at a persoanl defence shoot i had a squib load. My springfield 45 Champion won't return to battery and i tried four or five times but the slide refused to move forward. The ranger officer running the drill reallized the problem and pushed the bullet out with a brass rod. The RO and I both agreed that we didin't hear a pop of just the primer.

I quit shooting because I was concerned about it happening again and having the bullet lodged further down the barrel and then a round fired on top of the stuck bullet.

I am very careful about my reloading habits and have a single stage press and i don't understand how I missed the uncharged case.

Now i have rough 500-600 loaded rounds to weigh to make sure theres powder in them. PITA!!!

I had other RO's state that it happens and not to sweat it. This SUCKS !!
What powder & charge? With some powders, it's not impossible to miss the charge by visual inspection if you are in a hurry. It's one reason I like full power or near full power loads & powders that fill more of the case (ie, TG is NOT my choice). FWIW, you will probably not have much luck finding an underloaded round by weighing it. Between the powder, bullet & case variations, unless you are looking for 8-10gr diff, it's tough to find 3-4gr.
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Old 01-13-2010, 14:28   #4
Sierra9
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[quote=Kicking bird;14537952
I had other RO's state that it happens and not to sweat it. This SUCKS !![/quote]


IMO, don't sweat it as long as this is range ammo and not for self defense. If you hear an uncharacteristic pop instead of a bang, don't feel the expected recoil, and don't see the target being hit, just stop right there and clear the weapon. No harm done. This why it's so important to concentrate when reloading, even though it can become monotonous.
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Old 01-13-2010, 14:30   #5
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Weighing each round really isn't going to set your mind at ease. You're going to get a variation in each round even with a powder charge.

Each case will have a slight variation in weight, each bullet will vary in weight and if you're shooting lead not only will there be a variation in the actual bullet but lube will also reflect variation if each grease groove is not completely filled.

You'd probably be better off just setting those rounds aside and using them for slow fire practice or target shooting.

If this is the first squib you've ever had in your loading career rest assured that it won't be your last. Any thing a human does comes with a certain degree of potential mistakes... we've all done it, and we'll all do it again.

Good luck.

Jack
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Old 01-13-2010, 14:41   #6
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To me, the bigger worry is

"did you put that cases charge into another case, creating a double charge?

I would put a double charge in a case and see if it's a compressed load. If it is a compressed load I would shake every case and discard any case that did not have he "woosh" of powder. If it's not a compressed load I would consider seriously the potential for a double charge and decide if it's worth shooting these rounds or not.
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Old 01-13-2010, 14:44   #7
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is frustating . but not a big deal. just weight the other bullets . you should be able to tell wich is not loaded.
this has happened to me . someone said . " this things happen once in a million. and if you reload a million bullets this is bound to happen to you."
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Old 01-13-2010, 14:44   #8
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Glad you caught it.
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Old 01-13-2010, 14:47   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kicking bird View Post
Well last night at a persoanl defence shoot i had a squib load. My springfield 45 Champion won't return to battery and i tried four or five times but the slide refused to move forward. The ranger officer running the drill reallized the problem and pushed the bullet out with a brass rod. The RO and I both agreed that we didin't hear a pop of just the primer.

I quit shooting because I was concerned about it happening again and having the bullet lodged further down the barrel and then a round fired on top of the stuck bullet.

I am very careful about my reloading habits and have a single stage press and i don't understand how I missed the uncharged case.

Now i have rough 500-600 loaded rounds to weigh to make sure theres powder in them. PITA!!!

I had other RO's state that it happens and not to sweat it. This SUCKS !!
Do you weight the completed rounds to make sure they areall the same after completion?
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Old 01-13-2010, 14:47   #10
owtlaw
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I had a squib in some factory reloaded (HSM) ammo in my 45-70 last week.
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Old 01-13-2010, 14:57   #11
Kicking bird
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The RO and I didn't notice anything different as far as the rounds being fired and the the pop of a primer. That's what puzzled both of us.

I always test a double charge in a case to make a mental note of the capacity of the case. i then immediately dump the charge out.

I didn't weigh each case after loading them. I will probably just use the ammo for slow fire range work.

i will be doing some testing tonite of case weights , loaded rounds and rounds loaded with bullets and no powder.
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Old 01-13-2010, 15:12   #12
MSgt Dotson
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Cases of different headstamps very by sometimes 2-3 grains, and bullets easily vary by 4-5 grains...

It can sometimes be very difficult to catch a load missing it's 4-5 grains of powder by weight alone.
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Old 01-13-2010, 15:54   #13
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I think loading on a progressive easier for me to pay attention .

Look for a charge and place a bullet. ONe at a time. Intead of looking at a while trey of charged cases.
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Old 01-13-2010, 17:57   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MSgt Dotson View Post
Cases of different headstamps very by sometimes 2-3 grains, and bullets easily vary by 4-5 grains...

It can sometimes be very difficult to catch a load missing it's 4-5 grains of powder by weight alone.
+1. Not only that, what if it's a partial charge?

Sorry to say, the safest way will be to pull the bullets. It's a major PITA, but the only way to know for sure. It'll take you a bunch of time; but you may be able to reuse all the components (if you use a kinetic puller and not a collet puller).

You were really pretty lucky (as was your gun!) There's a lesson there if you choose to learn it. Take a lead from C4W and rig up a light like he uses to check that powder was dumped. A small mirror angled to look into the case works well also. Use a powder that gives you a good fill in the case (makes it easier to detect a short load).

Out of curiosity, was this on a single stage, or a progressive? What else was going on while you were reloading? Do you mix headstamps (different case weights)? How were you dumping powder? How often did you weigh charges to ensure the dump had not drifted?

HTH

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Old 01-13-2010, 18:18   #15
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I have not used this myself but on another thread a person knew he had 50 cases without powder in a ammo can of 1k rounds. He used a stethoscope pressed against the brass and shook it and was able to find the 50 rounds. Just an idea I heard but have not used myself. I also don't know how much a stethoscope costs.

Good luck. Unless you have consistent brass weighing the rounds for pistol if not going to help much. I get swings in pistol brass of + or - 5 grains as my brass is whatever I get my hands on all mixed head stamps brass nickle whatever.
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Old 01-14-2010, 09:26   #16
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Super bummer! as others have said weighing will not sort out your oopsie.
I have loaded tens of thousands of rounds and only had one single oopsie, but it was a doozie. I double charged a .38spl case, thank god they were low pressure wadcutter target loads so nothing got hurt!
My father a some what troubled soul use to like to come and attack me at my loading bench (where I was vulnerable to his ranting) after my double charge debacle the next time he showed up I marched him to his car and sent him on his way...
When I am at the bench my wife makes sure I am not bothered by calls or visitors! or kids. that bench is no place for drama/distraction...
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Old 01-14-2010, 09:39   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kicking bird
I am very careful about my reloading habits and have a single stage press and i don't understand how I missed the uncharged case.
If you are loading with your single stage and reloading tray, use a little led flashlight to check all 50 cases after charging. That little doublecheck avoids headaches down the road.

No help here checking your loaded rounds, too many variables.

Last edited by PBKing; 01-14-2010 at 09:43..
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Old 01-14-2010, 09:43   #18
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Originally Posted by Jon_R View Post
I have not used this myself but on another thread a person knew he had 50 cases without powder in a ammo can of 1k rounds. He used a stethoscope pressed against the brass and shook it and was able to find the 50 rounds. Just an idea I heard but have not used myself. I also don't know how much a stethoscope costs.
As already stated, drop the case in a plastic funnel. Shake the case. Plastic funnel is like a stethoscope. You can hear the powder easily. The Lee Red Plastic Funnel is perfect for this as it's hard plastic and very loud when you shake the case compared to some plastics.
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Old 01-14-2010, 09:58   #19
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When you drop the hammer on a Loaded round, And it does't go BANG. First you Look for a WHOLE Bullet, IF you find only the Case, IT's time to check for a SQUIB..ALWAYS. NO BIG DEAL.. Part of owning a gun..
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Old 01-14-2010, 10:02   #20
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Shaking the bullet to hear powder doesnt tell you much. Undercharge? overcharge?
I like the arsenal policy...if you run into QC problems , the whole lot is in question. Analise and improve you process to inlcude measures to avoid problems later.
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