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Old 01-29-2010, 22:50   #1
PEC-Memphis
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Survey - RWR Magazine Stowage

For a reload with retention, where do you stow the partially loaded magazine?

1. Slash pocket in pants

2. Cargo pocket in pants

3. "Mexican"

4. Cover garment pocket

5. Other
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Old 01-30-2010, 00:08   #2
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Seems like "In the mag pouch" is a missing selection.

And if "Cargo Pants Pocket" means one of the leg pockets, then it isn't allowed. Where ever you stow it has to be roughly waist level.

I stow it in a front pants pocket.

kr
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Old 01-30-2010, 00:47   #3
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+1 for front pocket. I disagree with the idea of RWR though. Like Cooper said "there is no sufficient lull in a firefight to top off your gun". If the gun isn't empty you should be shooting, if it's jammed the mag should be considered useless and no time wasted saving it.
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Old 01-30-2010, 15:00   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freeidaho View Post
Seems like "In the mag pouch" is a missing selection.
That would be found under "5. Other"

In a typical RWR the magazine is first removed, stowed, then the fresh magazine is inserted. Unless you have a performed a SLR, or stowed a magazine in another location you probably will not have an empty magazine pouch. The rules say that you can only have two (2) spare magazines on the belt - it does not say that you couldn't have a spare magazine pouch - so I suppose you could carry a 3rd pouch just for RWR.

A "tac" reload is different in that the fresh magazine is first removed, so there will be a magazine pouch available.

Quote:
Originally Posted by freeidaho View Post
And if "Cargo Pants Pocket" means one of the leg pockets, then it isn't allowed. Where ever you stow it has to be roughly waist level.
A cargo pants pocket might not be the fastest, but it sure seems like it is a "legal" location. There is nothing in the rules about needing to be at waist level.

"Proper Magazine Retention: A place for a partially loaded
magazine to be stowed before firing the first shot after a reload.
These places include: pants pocket; vest pocket; jacket pocket;
waistband; magazine pouch. The use of specially designed
pockets, shirt pockets, upper vest pockets, hands or teeth is NOT
permitted."
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Old 01-30-2010, 22:33   #5
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vest pocket for me.
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Old 01-30-2010, 22:58   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PEC-Memphis View Post
That would be found under "5. Other"

In a typical RWR the magazine is first removed, stowed, then the fresh magazine is inserted. Unless you have a performed a SLR, or stowed a magazine in another location you probably will not have an empty magazine pouch. The rules say that you can only have two (2) spare magazines on the belt - it does not say that you couldn't have a spare magazine pouch - so I suppose you could carry a 3rd pouch just for RWR.

A "tac" reload is different in that the fresh magazine is first removed, so there will be a magazine pouch available.
You can put it under other if you like, it is your survey, but it is a common place to stow a RWR mag. People using this technique start with an empty mag pouch for just this reason. I have seen it at the Nationals and other Sanctioned matches many times. SSP and ESP shooters almost never go to the third mag, so they have no problem starting without it whan a RWR is required.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PEC-Memphis View Post
A cargo pants pocket might not be the fastest, but it sure seems like it is a "legal" location. There is nothing in the rules about needing to be at waist level.

"Proper Magazine Retention: A place for a partially loaded
magazine to be stowed before firing the first shot after a reload.
These places include: pants pocket; vest pocket; jacket pocket;
waistband; magazine pouch. The use of specially designed
pockets, shirt pockets, upper vest pockets, hands or teeth is NOT
permitted."
Actually there is, Chest Pockets are prohibited in the rule book, and I have had to give a procedureal for this at the Nationals for a person using it. And HQ has clarified that cargo pants pockets on the leg are not allowed. These pockets are very handy when kneeling, but they are prohibited.

kr
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Old 01-31-2010, 01:02   #7
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Pants pocket for me.

I'd like to read the ruling from Robert Ray about the cargo pocket being illegal. Reading the rulebook it would seem that they're completely legal. "pants pocket" seems to mean a pocket attached to pants, which cargo pockets are. Link please...
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Old 01-31-2010, 13:53   #8
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Remember it is a game and games must be played by the rules or there is always the failure to do right. In a fire fight you will react the way you have trained and if you need that mag again then you probably need to learn to shoot more accurately. After the bleeding is done is the time to go back and pick up equipment.
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Old 02-03-2010, 00:07   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freeidaho View Post
Actually there is, Chest Pockets are prohibited in the rule book, and I have had to give a procedural for this at the Nationals for a person using it.
Actually there is not (a rule stating stowage must be near the waist).... I never stated that an upper pocket on a vest or shirt is a legal location. In fact, I quoted the rule which specifically addressed this.

From my earlier post....

"Proper Magazine Retention: A place for a partially loaded
magazine to be stowed before firing the first shot after a reload.
These places include: pants pocket; vest pocket; jacket pocket;
waistband; magazine pouch. The use of specially designed
pockets, shirt pockets, upper vest pockets, hands or teeth is NOT
permitted
."

If you are taking this to mean that the stowage location must be near the waist - because the upper body is not "legal", that does not mean that "near the waist" is the only legal location.


Quote:
Originally Posted by freeidaho View Post
And HQ has clarified that cargo pants pockets on the leg are not allowed. These pockets are very handy when kneeling, but they are prohibited.

Not really. The clarification I got from Robert is that cargo/side pants pockets are acceptable as long as they have not been modified to "stay open" with a stiffener (wire, etc.)
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Old 02-03-2010, 19:42   #10
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Yer right, I stand corrected.

kr
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Old 02-03-2010, 20:32   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freeidaho View Post
Yer right, I stand corrected.

kr
KR,

Thanks for being a "stand up guy" - something that is in short supply on GT.

I usually say something wrong (unintentionally) every day.

Best Regards,

PEC...
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