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Old 02-21-2010, 23:24   #1
triehl27
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SOLVED!!! The rounds popping out of Spare mags when not loaded in gun PICS

I solved this problem tonight, I think.

Many of us suffer from rounds sliding forward and popping out of our spare mags.

Well tonight I got this brilliant Idea!. File a little grove on the inside of the feed lips, towards the very back of the feed lip that the rim would then fit into when the cartridge is fully inserted into the magazine. Mind you this is a very shallow groove. The grove is not so deep as to cause the round to raise higher in the mag. but gives a little more friction to the rim of the round at rest to prevent it from sliding forward solely under magazine spring pressure.

The grove is put right where the rim of the cartridge rests when fully inserted into the magazine. The grove can't be that deep or it will hinder the cartridge being push out of the mag by the slide.

This has been an ongoing battle for me with my Kahrs. Many of my mags suffer from it. In fact it is one reason why I rarely carry my MK9 as I don't have 100% faith that when I insert a 6 rnd spare mag, that the mag will have all 6 in it. Many times I find after carrying for a hour or more that I may only have 2 or 3 rounds in the spare mag and the rest in the bottom of the mag carrier. A couple of my mags are so bad at this they will push the mag up in the carrier as they dump rounds out.

I am not 100% sure that this is the end all fix, but it seems to be working all evening for me. So we will see. At least right now it is bringing me some rising confidence in the mag situation.
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Last edited by triehl27; 02-28-2010 at 13:00..
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Old 02-22-2010, 00:44   #2
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It might well help with losing rounds while carrying the extra mag.

The factory mags that came with my new EMP 9mm have a similar thing stamped into them. I mean, the rounds positively *click* into place when they are fully inserted. I noticed right away that it does absolutely no good when you do a quick chamber check- drop the mag and the top round is halfway down the feed lips. Same thing any time the slide has been racked or cycles during firing- top round in the mag is already on it's merry way out. Reason being, when the mag is seated in the gun the top round is not pushing up against the mag lips (if it were, it couldn't pop up to be stripped off when the slide goes back).
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Old 02-24-2010, 23:33   #3
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Thought about trying that myself. Very annoying when two rounds are loose in my pocket and the one in the mag is halfway out. Not condusive to a good reload.
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Old 02-25-2010, 09:06   #4
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I need a picture to visualize. Is the groove on the underside of the lip? How do you file there? Do you file from the top and cut a channel into the lip? Need help here.
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Old 02-25-2010, 14:01   #5
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Pics please. I just picked up a CW9 to replace my sold g26 and while I was pocket carrying the extra mag, I had several rounds pop out.
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Old 02-25-2010, 23:18   #6
Caver 60
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You may be on to something here. It will be interesting to see if any feeding issues develop from doing this. I really don't think there will be any problems because, as noted, when a mag is inserted in the pistol the ammo rim moves forward as the round is pushed down.

So far the mags that came with my new PM9 have not lost a single round while carrying them. They will have a problem when removing the mag from the pistol to check it as fastforty described.

I looked carefully at my new PM9 mags and they do appear to have a small grove machined into them just like you describe. The ammo also does 'click' into place as described above.

ETA It's going to take a small needle file to do this modification, if anyone wants to try it.

I have about 10 spare mags for my 7 year old MK9 and they all loose rounds like crazy. The older MK9 mags work great in the PM9, as long as you can keep them full of ammo while carrying them.

I think I'll risk a couple of mags and see what happens when I file on them. Sounds like a good idea. Thanks.

Last edited by Caver 60; 02-25-2010 at 23:20..
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Old 02-26-2010, 08:35   #7
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Originally Posted by Caver 60 View Post
You may be on to something here. It will be interesting to see if any feeding issues develop from doing this. I really don't think there will be any problems because, as noted, when a mag is inserted in the pistol the ammo rim moves forward as the round is pushed down.

So far the mags that came with my new PM9 have not lost a single round while carrying them. They will have a problem when removing the mag from the pistol to check it as fastforty described.

I looked carefully at my new PM9 mags and they do appear to have a small grove machined into them just like you describe. The ammo also does 'click' into place as described above.

ETA It's going to take a small needle file to do this modification, if anyone wants to try it.

I have about 10 spare mags for my 7 year old MK9 and they all loose rounds like crazy. The older MK9 mags work great in the PM9, as long as you can keep them full of ammo while carrying them.

I think I'll risk a couple of mags and see what happens when I file on them. Sounds like a good idea. Thanks.
Let us know how it goes. If you would post some pics that would be awesome! Thanks!
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Old 02-26-2010, 10:20   #8
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Someone just needs to market an aftermarket floor plate with the groove already in it.
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Old 02-27-2010, 19:12   #9
Caver 60
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Someone just needs to market an aftermarket floor plate with the groove already in it.
Not quite sure what you're getting at here.

The groves I'm talking about are in the magazine steel at the very back of the feed lips on my new PM9 mags. I'm going to try to duplicate it with a needle file on some of my old MK9 mags. I'll be a few days before I get around to it.
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Old 02-28-2010, 08:25   #10
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pics please
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Old 02-28-2010, 18:39   #11
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Thanks for the pics triehl27. Does it still seem to be working for you?
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Old 02-28-2010, 20:36   #12
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I had same problem with my Kahr mags and what I found that worked for me was replacing the mag springs with extra power mag springs and very rarely do the pop out in the holders.
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Old 03-01-2010, 20:59   #13
triehl27
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Yep

I am going on a week now and the mags are retaining bullets. I even pushed my luck today and put 3 mags in one packet loaded to see if banging together would loosen any rounds. Not one dropped out. I am satified that I have finally resolved my issue with this situation.
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Old 03-02-2010, 15:44   #14
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Have you ran a few rounds through the mags to insure they still feed reliably?

Those groves shown in your picture are much deeper, and much wider, and much more forward than the tiny little groves in the lips of my new PM9 Mags. Actually I looked at the rest of my mags again and several of them also have the little groves (actually they appear to be tiny stamped dimples made from the inside) and the rounds click positively into place.

I have purchased them at different times over the years so some must have had the upgrade. I found a few of the old mags that the rounds would just fall out of at a touch. I haven't tried a file on them yet, but when I do, I will use a very small triangle needle file and go very slow with lots of testing.
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Old 03-03-2010, 03:28   #15
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I had the same problem, so I just bought a Desantis pocket mag carrier (nemesis type) and problem solved. Rounds have been fully seated every time I take it out. If you order one get the small one for .380 and the PM9 mags fit perfect not tight at all.
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Old 03-04-2010, 23:07   #16
chris in va
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Haven't been to the range with it yet, but I roughed up the inside feed lips a bit and so far the rounds haven't popped out like they used to. I don't think it's enough to cause feeding problems, but will report back.
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Old 03-15-2010, 16:37   #17
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This might be off topic, but I carry a spare PM9 mag (7 rounder) in my pocket.
I have had no rounds come out after carrying it for more than 90 days.
At that point, its time to shoot them, but that is another matter.
I guess I need to get a mag carrier before I find out if my mags do what you say also.
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Old 03-16-2010, 18:31   #18
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Um, maybe it's just me, but I use a pocket spare mag holder and have never had a problem.

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Old 03-16-2010, 23:32   #19
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This might be off topic, but I carry a spare PM9 mag (7 rounder) in my pocket.
I have had no rounds come out after carrying it for more than 90 days.
At that point, its time to shoot them, but that is another matter.
I guess I need to get a mag carrier before I find out if my mags do what you say also.
The new mags seem to not have that problem. My new PM9 mags have never lost a round and I always keep a spare in my pocket.
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Old 03-20-2010, 09:14   #20
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Not quite sure what you're getting at here.

The groves I'm talking about are in the magazine steel at the very back of the feed lips on my new PM9 mags. I'm going to try to duplicate it with a needle file on some of my old MK9 mags. I'll be a few days before I get around to it.
I am having the same problem on my CW9 Mags, and would like to see a picture of your PM9 Mags, before I take a file to mine.
Thank you
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Old 03-20-2010, 10:34   #21
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I am having the same problem on my CW9 Mags, and would like to see a picture of your PM9 Mags, before I take a file to mine.
Thank you
I filed small notches in the very back of one of mine that are about the same width as the cartridge rim and it did not help. I am not going to file them any more. I did get the extra power wolff magazine springs and that helps quite a bit. I have only had a round pop out once in about 2 weeks.
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Old 03-20-2010, 13:45   #22
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I am having the same problem on my CW9 Mags, and would like to see a picture of your PM9 Mags, before I take a file to mine.
Thank you
I don't have the capability to post pictures. But todays a rainy day so I got my 10X loupe out and took a closer look. I'm not sure pictures would show much.

It seems more a matter of metal forming when the mag was stamped at the factory than actually cutting a 'grove' for the edge of the cartridge rim to 'hang' into.

There seems to be just a little more deformation of the metal at the very back edges of the top opening of the magazine on the newer magazines. But something definitely seems to make the cartridges 'snap in to place better with the newer magazines, especially when you get to the last couple of rounds when filling the magazine.

The rounds seems to be held at about the same 'up' angle, with about the same amount of the cartridge exposed to sight in either magazine. But when you push down on the bullet nose in the older magazines the cartridge nose doesn't seem to pop back up as well as it does with the newer magazines. The cartridge moves forward a bit in either magazine when it is pushed down, but it just seems to hold in place better in the newer magazines. And it comes back into a better position when down pressure is released.

Remember the 9mm case is tapered. My Speer reloading manual says the outside case diameter is .391 inch at the back end just before the grove, and the extraction rim diameter is .394 inch. At the mouth of the case, the outside diameter is .380 inch. So the case itself tapers wider .0055 of an inch on each side from the front to rear, and the extraction rim is only .0015 inch greater than the radius of the case at it's rear most point. That's not a lot of rim to hang onto and the taper of the case actually makes the rim position appear slightly below a straight edge laid on the side of the case.

Can't quite put my finger on where the difference is, but there is a definate difference in the way rounds 'snap' into place on the newer magazines, especially the last round or two.

To my finger, the amount of magazine spring pressure seems about the same for the different magazines.

I'm not going to try a file until I study it more.

Last edited by Caver 60; 03-20-2010 at 16:01.. Reason: clarify
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Old 03-20-2010, 16:03   #23
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So much effort for a next to non-existent problem. What's so hard about using a decent, fitted magazine carrier (see photo I posted earier) as I have for YEARS and you won't have a problem with loose rounds.
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Old 03-20-2010, 16:10   #24
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So much effort for a next to non-existent problem. What's so hard about using a decent, fitted magazine carrier (see photo I posted earier) as I have for YEARS and you won't have a problem with loose rounds.
My problem with the magazine is at time of loading rounds. They want to creep forward before the next round is loaded, and sometimes the last round pops out before I can get it pushed down/rearward. Never have this problem with a GLOCK.
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Old 03-20-2010, 16:18   #25
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So much effort for a next to non-existent problem. What's so hard about using a decent, fitted magazine carrier (see photo I posted earier) as I have for YEARS and you won't have a problem with loose rounds.
Some people, like myself, like carrying a loose magazine in their pocket. I don't want the added bulk of a magazine holster.
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