Who Has A Krebs?

Wriggly · 11-16-2010, 11:59

Hello all. I have had a Saiga, and now currently own a Maadi. But I truly lust for a Krebs. I have thought about just getting the Vltor adapter and stock for my Maadi and calling it a day, but you know how the gun lust can set in.

If you have one, how about posting pics and your impressions.

BBJones · 11-16-2010, 14:57

I have thought about a Krebs myself, but am pretty dead set against them now. From everything I've heard they make a fine rifle. I just don't like how high the rail sits and the inability to co-witness with iron sights.

Here is what I am doing instead.
Ultimak gas tube rail with AimPoint Micro co-witnessed -$70 bought off forum
Aimpoint Micro H1/T1 - H1 $450 (I think that is what I paid for the H1) T1 $530
Ultimak lower tri-rail -$220 retail (don't have it yet)
SureFire M600a - $165
Magpul AFG2 - $35
VLTOR AK buffer tube adapter - $90 retail (don't have it yet)
Magpul CTR stock - $85
Magpul enhanced buttpad - $18
Magpul XTR rail covers - $30 probably (mostly to make the area where I grip the rail wider, so my hand doesn't contact the gas tube)
Vector Bulgarian AK - $600
_________
$1763 (w/ H1)

So for about $250 more than a Krebs, I have something that is fully outfitted the way I want it including weapons light, optics, fore-grip etc...

batoncolle · 11-16-2010, 18:08

Not a great pic, but here is mine.

Krebs makes a fine rifle, but I just do not shoot it as much as my other AKs. He has the best Beryl style rail mount on the market right now. This one has the Galil style safety, but I prefer the updated Krebs safety lever better. It is has also been threaded to 1/2 - 28 which I prefer because it gives me more suppressor options when I decide to get a 30 caliber can. I will probably replace the stock at some point with a VLTOR buffer tube and Magpul CTR.

As I said it is a fine firearm, but I just do not shoot it all that much. It is a little heavier than my other AKs, and I paid so much for it that it is mainly just a safe queen. If I end up making additional mods to it, then I will probably use it a little more, but for now it stays in the safe.

If you have any questions, let me know.

schild · 11-18-2010, 15:34

I think everyone on the internet must have seen my Krebs by now, I have 2 KTR-08's.

Wriggly · 11-19-2010, 12:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by schild

I think everyone on the internet must have seen my Krebs by now, I have 2 KTR-08's.

I dont think that I had seen yours yet. Looks like someone has an ample supply of ammo.......need a friend?

Where do you shoot? I go to Sycamore. Leaves a bit to be desired.

I was at R Guns yesterday, and got to fondle a KTR-09, and now I am seriously thinking about selling a Glock or two, and some other stuff, to get one. I like it a lot.

my762buzz · 11-19-2010, 13:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wriggly

Hello all. I have had a Saiga, and now currently own a Maadi. But I truly lust for a Krebs. I have thought about just getting the Vltor adapter and stock for my Maadi and calling it a day, but you know how the gun lust can set in.

If you have one, how about posting pics and your impressions.

The KTR09 is a saiga. Mark Krebbs takes a saiga and makes a few changes like furniture, sight/gas block, trigger, etc... Essentially it's a saiga receiver, barrel, carrier, bolt, trunions, and dust cover but with some enhancements.

Aceman · 11-19-2010, 17:31

*For the record - I have never owned or shot a Krebs gun.

Honestly, from everything I know (heard/read) they DO make a fine rifle. But honestly, is it worth the cost? What does Krebs REALLY do that can't be done just as effectively with far less expensive parts on your own?

An AK is only going to get so accurate, and rails and an Aimpoint? Come on - UTG and Leapers can do that...or you can do it yourself with Ultimak and Aimpoint. Or whatever.

Off-set front grip? Whoo hoo. Any yahoo with the intarweb can find whatever special little piece of rail they need.

Again - a fine gun - and pay whatever you can afford. But is it really any better than the average tacticooled Arsenal?

TheGrimReaper · 11-19-2010, 19:20

I have no experience with a Krebs, just what I have read. They are supposed to be the stuff though!

schild · 11-19-2010, 19:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aceman

*For the record - I have never owned or shot a Krebs gun.

Honestly, from everything I know (heard/read) they DO make a fine rifle. But honestly, is it worth the cost? What does Krebs REALLY do that can't be done just as effectively with far less expensive parts on your own?

An AK is only going to get so accurate, and rails and an Aimpoint? Come on - UTG and Leapers can do that...or you can do it yourself with Ultimak and Aimpoint. Or whatever.

Off-set front grip? Whoo hoo. Any yahoo with the intarweb can find whatever special little piece of rail they need.

Again - a fine gun - and pay whatever you can afford. But is it really any better than the average tacticooled Arsenal?

You've never owned or shot a Krebs, but you know that it really can't be better than a "tacticooled Arsenal". You're kind of a know it all smart ass aren't you?

And as far as being worth the cost, if you don't like it don't buy it.

my762buzz · 11-20-2010, 00:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aceman

Honestly, from everything I know (heard/read) they DO make a fine rifle. But honestly, is it worth the cost? What does Krebs REALLY do that can't be done just as effectively with far less expensive parts on your own?

The rear sight rail system is amazing. I bought one and absolutely love it.
All of the custom parts seem very well made.

I wish they made a custom version of the AK107 counter balanced
gas piston system. I would buy one right away.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QR8G9SdykAk

Kahrguy330 · 11-20-2010, 00:38

I'd like to try their KCI speed load tactical rifle. I like the idea of the KCI magazine flange, and the modified mag release. Its on my short list.

batoncolle · 11-20-2010, 07:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kahrguy330

I'd like to try their KCI speed load tactical rifle. I like the idea of the KCI magazine flange, and the modified mag release. Its on my short list.

This is the one I wished I would have bought. I think it would be a great rifle for training.

Another Miller · 11-24-2010, 11:38

I shot one of their krinks awhile back at a friends' range.I sure wish I could afford one.Fun little gun,I noticed they took the time to do them right.

As far as a full sized ak,I like to keep my ak rifles stock.Im not much for add-ons but Im sure they have their place.

WP Glocks · 11-24-2010, 15:13

Krebs' rifles are not only top-notch, but Marc is one hell of a guy to do business with. I have a 103K that I didn't even buy directly from him, but when I brought it around to talk about some upgrades he stopped what he was doing and talked to me for a LONG time about what I was looking to do. I had bought one of his newer style speed safeties and did I did a crap job fitting it. When he sold me an East German side folding stock, he offered to install it at no charge, SAME DAY! When I came back to get it, not only was the folder was installed, but a new safety (I had somehow screwed up the one I bought royally) was fitted into it at no charge! You may pay a little more, but Marc stands behind his rifles and his parts (even though I ******ed it up).
BTW-if you've never shot a 7.62x39 AK with a 74-type flash-hider/muzzle brake, you don't know what you're missing. I'm not a fan of standing NEXT to the guy firing one, but it does a number on the recoil.

schild · 11-24-2010, 20:27

+1

I've been in Marc's shop several time, He doesn't think twice to offer you a cup of coffee and sit down and talk for an hour.

Aceman · 11-24-2010, 23:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by schild

You've never owned or shot a Krebs, but you know that it really can't be better than a "tacticooled Arsenal". You're kind of a know it all smart ass aren't you?

And as far as being worth the cost, if you don't like it don't buy it.

No I'm not a smart ass. I'm also not a dumb ass. I'm asking a serious question:

When it comes to raw flat out performance - hoiw much better in measurable terms (MOA, shots to failure, comfort rated from 1-10) is the gun. His work is expensive. What is the PRACTICAL ROI on the weapon?

It's a simple question. Just because it is expensive/mil-spec/the best doesn't mean it is worth the cost. Kind of like gourmet popcorn. let's get real - it's popcorn...

Wriggly · 11-24-2010, 23:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aceman

No I'm not a smart ass. I'm also not a dumb ass. I'm asking a serious question:

When it comes to raw flat out performance - hoiw much better in measurable terms (MOA, shots to failure, comfort rated from 1-10) is the gun. His work is expensive. What is the PRACTICAL ROI on the weapon?

It's a simple question. Just because it is expensive/mil-spec/the best doesn't mean it is worth the cost. Kind of like gourmet popcorn. let's get real - it's popcorn...

Someone else pointed out that it is a Saiga. I saw the stamping on the receiver, and was aware of it.

The overall finish and fit of the components is something you would have to hold and see to appreciate. This is not your ordinary AK.

I might liken it to the Noveske of AK's.......yeah, i like that analogy.

schild · 11-25-2010, 06:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aceman

No I'm not a smart ass. I'm also not a dumb ass. I'm asking a serious question:

When it comes to raw flat out performance - hoiw much better in measurable terms (MOA, shots to failure, comfort rated from 1-10) is the gun. His work is expensive. What is the PRACTICAL ROI on the weapon?

It's a simple question. Just because it is expensive/mil-spec/the best doesn't mean it is worth the cost. Kind of like gourmet popcorn. let's get real - it's popcorn...

My Kreb's are more than worth the price of admission. Beside my two Kreb's I have a Maadi, so I know the difference between a high end and low end AK.

triggerjerk · 11-26-2010, 14:14

I have a KTR-03S.
It is pretty accurate.
It is the only firearm I have that has never failed in any manner.
That includes Glocks, BHPs, Benellis, CZs, etc.

Cons:
The AR type sights are worthless. I could never sight it in, even using an AR sight adjustment tool. I think it is probably due to the height over the bore. That necessitated adding an optic. The issue with that is that since it is so high, cheekweld suffers in order to acquire the reticle. Not that big of a deal as the recoil is mild.

If I had it to do again, I'd get the Speed Load Tactical model (http://www.krebscustom.com/Kalashnik...tml#speedload1) and add an Ultimak gastube/rail setup and mount an Aimpoint T1/H1. I believe Templar on M4carbine has figured out how to put an Aimpoint micro on an AK and get a cowitness with the AK sights . . .
See: http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=16457

my762buzz · 11-27-2010, 09:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by triggerjerk

I have a KTR-03S.
The AR type sights are worthless. I could never sight it in, even using an AR sight adjustment tool. I think it is probably due to the height over the bore.

Mark K. came up with a much better sight option than a dust cover type.
See pictures above. He claims it will survive a 6 ft drop test.
The dust cover type is not even shown as an option anymore or at least I can't see such an option.

triggerjerk · 11-27-2010, 13:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by my762buzz

Mark K. came up with a much better sight option than a dust cover type.
See pictures above. He claims it will survive a 6 ft drop test.
The dust cover type is not even shown as an option anymore or at least I can't see such an option.

Yes, the KTR-08 and up have the revised rail system.
However it appears they are still using AR-type sights. And the rail height still seems to be quite high.

I could not get enough elevation adjustment out of mine to even get on paper at 50yds. I'd be interested to know from schild or any others who have the new rail system whether or not the irons are serviceable.

I love my krebs and I think their product is excellent. Problem is, if my optic dies, the gun is worthless. Like I said, if I had it to do again, I'd still get a Krebs Speed Load Tactical and set it up as Templar's.

schild · 11-28-2010, 06:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by triggerjerk

Yes, the KTR-08 and up have the revised rail system.
However it appears they are still using AR-type sights. And the rail height still seems to be quite high.

I could not get enough elevation adjustment out of mine to even get on paper at 50yds. I'd be interested to know from schild or any others who have the new rail system whether or not the irons are serviceable.

I love my krebs and I think their product is excellent. Problem is, if my optic dies, the gun is worthless. Like I said, if I had it to do again, I'd still get a Krebs Speed Load Tactical and set it up as Templar's.

The iron sights on my 08's are right on and really only a little higher than standard AK sights.

triggerjerk · 11-28-2010, 10:17

Good to know!

my762buzz · 11-28-2010, 13:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by triggerjerk

Good to know!

The latest rail system has about 1 cm of vertical adjustment range and at least 2 cm of horizontal adjustment range. Notice the bolt below the rear sight position. That can be initially set during installation or when ever.
I never really considered this before but this is a huge advantage over the texas dog leg system that does not seem adjustable vertically. Unless another somehow exists, the krebbs rail/sight system offers the most range adjustment in the known universe besides being the most heavy duty one.

triggerjerk · 11-29-2010, 11:58

Great post.
Thanks for the detail pics on the new rail system.

Maybe I need to look into the Enhanced Speed Load Tactical. Hmm.