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Old 07-13-2011, 21:28   #151
_The_Shadow
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Be careful out there in the heat man! The heat here is rough as well...Like walkin' into an oven!
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Old 07-13-2011, 23:12   #152
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 21Carrier View Post
I'm gonna keep them at my normal COAL (1.255-1.260") for the test. I don't have enough yet to properly work them up if I changed the COAL. Plus, I do my testing with one round in the gun, so feeding isn't a concern. No need for a second round. I'm hoping to do the WFNGC test Friday.

Sorry I've been slacking lately. It is just ridiculously hot here. Me and GTRhino24 went shooting the day I did the tests on the Devastators, and both of us were showing symptoms of heat exhaustion/heat stroke. He was sick to his stomach, and I was extremely weak. I could barely get my gear back into my car. I got home, sat on the couch to just rest a minute before showering, and woke up 12 hours later. I felt like crap for almost 2 whole days.


Here -

Now get back out there and wow us!
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Old 07-14-2011, 05:43   #153
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Yep ... its WAYYYY hot out there. I was in Wichita this past weekend and it was 112 degrees two days in a row. New record, apparently. WOW. Humid AND high temps. Never thought I'd say I'm glad to be back in 98/humid.
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Old 07-14-2011, 06:18   #154
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Folks, you need to go have your cholesterol checked, seriously.

I mowed a half acre once a week here in Flaridah steam, and I feel fine after a half gallon of ice cold root beer + cold shower. I couldn't do that before Crestor.
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Old 07-14-2011, 06:30   #155
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Yep...I threw up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ModGlock17 View Post
Folks, you need to go have your cholesterol checked, seriously.

I mowed a half acre once a week here in Flaridah steam, and I feel fine after a half gallon of ice cold root beer + cold shower. I couldn't do that before Crestor.
Carrier21 wasn't kidding. The heat index was in the triple digits that day. I started getting all loopy picking up brass. NOT a good feeling when handling a weapon. A train passed by and smelled like it was dragging a dead cow under it. That was the final straw. I yacked.
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Old 07-14-2011, 07:48   #156
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Whoo hoo and here I was complaining that it was 70 - 75 degrees at the most and over cast with a little drizzle...
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Old 07-14-2011, 13:07   #157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ModGlock17 View Post
Folks, you need to go have your cholesterol checked, seriously.

I mowed a half acre once a week here in Flaridah steam, and I feel fine after a half gallon of ice cold root beer + cold shower. I couldn't do that before Crestor.
Our problem was a lack of cold beverages and we were wearing jeans. The bugs out there are savage. I'll wear shorts and Off from now on, and bring a jug of ice water. All I had was a 100* Powerade.
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Old 07-14-2011, 14:18   #158
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We have been complaining that summer would never get here. Coldest year so far in 27 years. I have just barely started using the pool.

A bit of electrolite in that ice water is good for hot days.

Be well. We look forward to that WFNGC test!!
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Old 07-14-2011, 21:19   #159
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We have been complaining that summer would never get here. Coldest year so far in 27 years. I have just barely started using the pool.

A bit of electrolite in that ice water is good for hot days.

Be well. We look forward to that WFNGC test!!
I am HOPING to do it tomorrow. I made the cardboard tube earlier (38" long), and I'm in the process of pouring the wax. It's all melted, and some is already in the tube. However, I just realized it might have to wait until Saturday. The tube is too long to fit in my refrigerator, so it is likely gonna take a long time to cool. I'll see how it goes, but I don't want to mess up the test, so I'm gonna make sure it's fully cooled and ready. I sure hope 38" will be long enough.
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Old 07-14-2011, 21:23   #160
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I think I'm more excited about this test than ANY before!! Oh yeaaaaa....
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Old 07-14-2011, 22:18   #161
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I think I'm more excited about this test than ANY before!! Oh yeaaaaa....
Me too - especially after seeing what they did to milk jugs.
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Old 07-15-2011, 15:57   #162
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It's about 100 here today. Saw a dog chasing a rabbit and they were both walking.
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Old 07-15-2011, 18:36   #163
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I went to Wal-Mart earlier to get some more wax and Vaseline. I have always thought people must wonder what the hell I'm doing while buying large quantities of wax and Vaseline. Well, today I found out. As I'm checking out, the old lady at the register said, "You got a drug test coming up?" I was like, "Huh?!" She said, "That's what people use this stuff for". She started explaining how one of the two ingredients can be used to fool drug tests. I'm not sure whether she was talking about the Vaseline or the wax because it was loud and I couldn't hear her.

Not wanting all the other people in line (who were at this point staring at me, and almost backing up) to think I was some meth-head on a court appointed drug testing schedule, I said, "Actually, I use it to test bullets." This didn't seem to make me any more appealing. Now EVERYONE, including the old lady cashier, who apparently cheats drug tests, were looking at me like I'm a meth-head serial killer psycho. Plus, the drug test beating 90 year old wanted details. So, now I'm standing at the Wal-Mart checkout counter explaining how wax and Vaseline can be used to test bullets, why anyone would want to do this, and why anyone cares.

Next time I think I'll just say I do a lot of canning jelly, and I get lonely. Perhaps those would be more common, more socially acceptable uses for wax and Vaseline.


EDIT: By the way, I'll be doing the WFNGC test tomorrow morning. This 3 foot plus wax tube has taken nearly two days to pour and harden. I'm about to pour the last 8 inches, and it will be ready by morning. I'll post the results as soon as I get home. I am starting to have fears that the bullet will exit the side. I guess I shouldn't worry, as all of the tests have proven bullets don't curve or deflect in the wax. I just better make the shot count. I have to go with my girlfriend and her new kitty to the vet at 2 tomorrow, so if I don't have the time to post it before then, it will be up by about 5-6pm at the latest. Wish me luck. I can't wait.

Last edited by 21Carrier; 07-15-2011 at 18:41..
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Old 07-15-2011, 19:26   #164
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That's awesome! Not sure I would care too much about what Walmart people thought of me though. That old lady probably has seen it all. I'd have just told her my wife was kinky. If you had bought an industrial sized bottle of allergy medicine, some razor blades, and ziplock bags, she probably wouldn't have uttered a peep. That's standard equipment here in Bama.
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Old 07-15-2011, 22:32   #165
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I figured I would hit you guys with a little bit of a teaser. Here are some pics of the super-long WFNGC test tube. It measures 37" x 4.5" in diameter. It's over 2.5 times longer than my usual tube, and 3 times longer than my first few that were about 12" long. Also, as you can see in the first picture, I figured a way to cool the tube quickly outside of a fridge. I realized I had an old window A/C unit, so I hooked it up, and put the tube right in front of it. I honestly think it might work better than the fridge. My house is like 11 degrees, though.

I decided anything so glorious needs a name, so you will see that I named her. It's the first thing that popped into my mind. Plus, I wanted to be able to tell everyone, "I busted a cap in Yo' Mammy!" without lying.

Notice the resemblance to the Saturn V rocket:
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Here's a pic of the second to last pour before it hardened. I'll top it off in about an hour. This is uncolored, new wax, so it's clearish/white. I mixed the previous two tubes, and, oddly enough, pink + blue = white. Who knew? But seriously though, the old wax turned white/light grey when I mixed the colors.

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Last edited by 21Carrier; 07-15-2011 at 22:41..
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Old 07-15-2011, 23:42   #166
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I'll keep my fingers crossed for ya that the shot ends up being straight and true! Long tube without much room for error.

Maybe you should take the shot at point blank range.
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Old 07-16-2011, 00:11   #167
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Originally Posted by glock20c10mm View Post
I'll keep my fingers crossed for ya that the shot ends up being straight and true! Long tube without much room for error.

Maybe you should take the shot at point blank range.
It will be close. Since this tube is so tall, I'm guessing the tube will be about 1-2 feet from the muzzle.
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Old 07-16-2011, 09:35   #168
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ven with your shot placed well, all you can hope for is that the bullet travels straight enough to stay inside! Looking great though...
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Old 07-16-2011, 19:03   #169
21Carrier
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Ok guys, sorry it took so long, but the 200gn WFNGC test has been done, and it all went to plan. I was up all night loading and finishing the tube so I overslept and had to wait until this afternoon. Here's the data:

200gn WFNGC

Again, thanks to NickE10mm for the bullets, this test would have been delayed without his help. The shot was perfectly centered, and the bullet went straight. It stopped right near the cardboard at the edge of the tube. Here are the metrics:

Load used: 9.3gn 800-X, CCI 300, new Starline nickel, COAL 1.253"

Update: this load chronographed a single shot velocity (that's all I had) of 1166fps on 8/4/11. I also chronographed the same bullet with 9.0gr 800-X, which had a single shot velocity of 1168fps, so it should be ballpark.

Penetration: 25.5"
Max wound diameter: 1"
Max bullet dia: .397"
Min bullet dia: .393"
Retained mass: 196.9gn
Pre-fired mass: 200.0gn

Well, from this test it seems clear that this bullet has one purpose: penetration. I was a bit surprised that the wound tract was not wider. The entrance hole was 1" in diameter, and the wound tract got narrower as the bullet penetrated and velocity was lost. Wound diameter equalled bullet diameter around 9" of penetration. Beyond that, the wound tract diameter was actually LESS than bullet diameter due to the medium rebounding. I cross-sectioned the tube at the 22" mark, and the hole was about .2" in diameter (see picture). I still think this bullet will do more damage than a truncated cone FMJ (due to the wider flat nose), but I feel a similarly weighted FMJ would penetrate a few inches more (I will test it). I expected a larger diameter wound tract, but this would likely be the ideal bullet for large game hunting/large animal SD. I think a heavy XTP would be better for medium game. Given my previous calculations, I would estimate this bullet/load would penetrate about 47" in water/gelatin.

Pictures:

Here's the bullet that made the mess:
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The first part of the tube:
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This is what it looked like when I opened the tube:
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Here's a cross-section of the tube at the 22" mark. Notice the small diameter of the hole:
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I forgot to take pictures of the bullet, and I'm about to eat, so I'll add them soon. I also tested a 180gn Ranier Plated HP that Nick sent me in the tube, and a 165gn Golden Saber in water. I'll post all of that in a little bit.

Last edited by 21Carrier; 08-05-2011 at 07:13..
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Old 07-16-2011, 19:53   #170
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Exactly as predicted. Nicely done.

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Originally Posted by 21Carrier View Post
Max wound diameter: 1"
Chalk up one point for http://www.beartoothbullets.com/resc.../php/wound.htm which predicted: "Wound channel diameter of 1" with a bullet with a meplat diameter of .32", and a striking velocity of 1250 fps."

I can't think of anything that wouldn't kill.
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Old 07-16-2011, 20:10   #171
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hypnagogue View Post
Chalk up one point for http://www.beartoothbullets.com/resc.../php/wound.htm which predicted: "Wound channel diameter of 1" with a bullet with a meplat diameter of .32", and a striking velocity of 1250 fps."

I can't think of anything that wouldn't kill.
I went back to take measurements of the wound tract at 3" intervals. Here's the data:

Penetration Depth------Wound Tract Diameter
0"-------------------------------------1.000"
3"--------------------------------------.543"
6"--------------------------------------.502"
9"--------------------------------------.415"
12"-------------------------------------.294"
15"-------------------------------------.230"
18"-------------------------------------.216"
21"-------------------------------------.229"
24"-------------------------------------.220"
Average---------------------------------.405"

So, it seems the ENTRANCE hole is 1", but the wound diameter quickly narrows. However, I'm sure it would still be a good bit larger than an FMJ's tract. I would guess an average of .275-.325" for an FMJ.

Pictures of bullet:

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Last edited by 21Carrier; 07-16-2011 at 20:12..
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Old 07-16-2011, 20:26   #172
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Another At-a-Boy to Carrier21 for yet another great test. The Gas Check remained on the bullet so it seems, many say they fly off, I have seen many of my 357's & 44's with check remaining with the bullet!

Thanks again!
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Old 07-16-2011, 20:36   #173
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Great experiment.

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So, it seems the ENTRANCE hole is 1", but the wound diameter quickly narrows.
Yes, that's what you would expect: the wound channel narrows as the bullet loses velocity.
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Old 07-16-2011, 21:18   #174
21Carrier
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _The_Shadow View Post
Another At-a-Boy to Carrier21 for yet another great test. The Gas Check remained on the bullet so it seems, many say they fly off, I have seen many of my 357's & 44's with check remaining with the bullet!

Thanks again!
No problem! Yeah, the gas check stayed on, but I shot two at water jugs before the test to test the load, and one of them lost a gas check. I didn't recover the bullets, but I found a gas check on the ground.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hypnagogue View Post
Yes, that's what you would expect: the wound channel narrows as the bullet loses velocity.
Yeah, that's what I was expecting. As long as the shape of the bullet doesn't change, that's just physics.
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Old 07-17-2011, 11:16   #175
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Great work, Carrier. Although the wound channel is not very impressive, penetration definitely is, and that recovered bullet is about perfect except for the rifling engrained on it. The true benefit of these bullets is their ability to smash through thick bones and continue on their path through tissue with relatively little deformation. Even if they lose stability inside tissue and tumble, they still are going to stay together. I don't know if that would be true 100% of the time with an FMJ that could (and probably would be) filled with a softer lead alloy.

On the 200gr WFNGC bullets. They'll do the job they were intended for.

Thanks for doing the hard work, Carrier.
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