Home Forums Classifieds Blogs Today's Posts Search Social Groups



  
SIGN-UP
Notices

Glock Talk
Welcome To The Glock Talk Forums.

 
  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-20-2011, 20:59   #1
Ship A'Hoy
Trigger Control
 
Ship A'Hoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Pa
Posts: 786
NRA Law Enforcement instructor certification

I'l be taking the instructor certification class for handgun/shotgun next month right here in Pittsburgh.

Anyone else here going to the same class?
__________________
"You won't rise to the occasion - you'll default to your level of training." Barrett Tillman
NRA LE Certified Handgun/Shotgun Instructor
Certified Glock Armorer
Speed is fine, accuracy is final.
Ship A'Hoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2011, 22:50   #2
Reyn
Times Up
 
Reyn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,669
No,but i did go through it over a year ago. Went to patrol rifle before that one.
Reyn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2011, 06:29   #3
Steve in PA
Senior Member
 
Steve in PA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 7,343
I did that course last year, just to keep up my other certifications.
__________________
"The Marines I have seen around the world have, the cleanest bodies, the filthiest minds, the highest morale, and the lowest morals of any group of animals I have ever seen. Thank God for the United States Marine Corps. Eleanor Roosevelt, 1945"
Steve in PA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2011, 08:57   #4
groovyash
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,584
It's a decent enough insturctor class. If you have the opportunity however I'd reccommend the PSP's (Free) Handgun/Shotgun Instructor course instead. It is a more thorough class and the certification is for life rather than the NRA course's which requires re taking the class every few years
groovyash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2011, 09:11   #5
DaBigBR
No Infidels!
 
DaBigBR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Circling the wagons.
Posts: 15,924
Quote:
Originally Posted by groovyash View Post
It's a decent enough insturctor class. If you have the opportunity however I'd reccommend the PSP's (Free) Handgun/Shotgun Instructor course instead. It is a more thorough class and the certification is for life rather than the NRA course's which requires re taking the class every few years
Didn't know you had to retake the NRA courses...they're not cheap! What's the interval?

To be an LE firearms instructor in my state we have to attend the state's school. We recertify on three year intervals, but the "recert" is basically requalification with handgun and shotgun to the instructor proficiency level, getting to shoot some drills, and a legal and tactical update from academy staff. It's done at their facility and ensures that the instructors still have a clue. Sometimes they don't.
__________________
"Logic is rarely the engine that propels a police department forward."

-David Simon in "Homicide"
DaBigBR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2011, 10:05   #6
groovyash
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,584
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaBigBR View Post
Didn't know you had to retake the NRA courses...they're not cheap! What's the interval?

To be an LE firearms instructor in my state we have to attend the state's school. We recertify on three year intervals, but the "recert" is basically requalification with handgun and shotgun to the instructor proficiency level, getting to shoot some drills, and a legal and tactical update from academy staff. It's done at their facility and ensures that the instructors still have a clue. Sometimes they don't.

It's every 3 years to recertify also. They don't actually require you take the entire basic handgun/shotgun course over rather you have to pay a fee, $50 I think, and take 24 hours worth of their approved firearms classes as ConEd over the period of your certification. It's fairly easy to meet that criteria but it's just one more set of things to remember to apply for that the PSPs certification does not require.

Last edited by groovyash; 03-21-2011 at 10:07..
groovyash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2011, 10:32   #7
Ship A'Hoy
Trigger Control
 
Ship A'Hoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Pa
Posts: 786
Quote:
Originally Posted by groovyash View Post
It's a decent enough insturctor class. If you have the opportunity however I'd reccommend the PSP's (Free) Handgun/Shotgun Instructor course instead. It is a more thorough class and the certification is for life rather than the NRA course's which requires re taking the class every few years
Yes I've seen the information about the PSP class.

http://www.portal.state.pa.us/portal...n-june2011_pdf

Not completely sure if they allow sworn reserves in the class or not. It is something I may pursue next year.

I have no problem with the continuing education required by the NRA. IMHO, I think it's good to have continuing education for every firearms instructor. Gotta stay sharp.
__________________
"You won't rise to the occasion - you'll default to your level of training." Barrett Tillman
NRA LE Certified Handgun/Shotgun Instructor
Certified Glock Armorer
Speed is fine, accuracy is final.
Ship A'Hoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2011, 17:15   #8
Steve in PA
Senior Member
 
Steve in PA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 7,343
You don't have to re-take the NRA courses, you just have to have 24 hours of firearms education in those 3 years in order to keep your certifications. Take a course by S&W, Sig, Glock or other instructor courses and you are covered.

Usually I attend a regional IALEFI seminar in NJ which gives me 16+ hours in one year. I've taken armorer courses which account for another 8 hours.

I've taken the PSP handgun/shotgun instructor course and while the certification never expires, it is no where near as good as the NRA courses. The problem with the PSP certification, is that it allows for instructors to become stagnant. With the NRA certifications, they require you to meet the 24 hours of continuing education in order to prevent being stagnant.
__________________
"The Marines I have seen around the world have, the cleanest bodies, the filthiest minds, the highest morale, and the lowest morals of any group of animals I have ever seen. Thank God for the United States Marine Corps. Eleanor Roosevelt, 1945"
Steve in PA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2011, 18:21   #9
groovyash
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,584
Steve, I guess I would say I agree with you in theory but not in practice. You are correct an instructor SHOULD do ConEd, just like all LE should. And It's really a moot point for people like myself who work in large departments and have the ability to go to training. Unfortunately that model doesn't work for the majority of this screwed up state we live in. Many departments with 5 officers working for them simply can't or won't send their people to any more training than they have to, and some won't pay for dime one of the costs. $500 and $600 training classes are a pretty hefty expense for a part time officer making $10.50/hr. And unfortunately here in PA that represents more departments across the state than the metro p.d. model.

Again, I like to occasionally reflect on how lucky I am, I get more training in a month or two than most officers in this state get in 5 years, I am the exception to the rule however.

As for the course, I have also taken both and have to disagree with you, the PSP course I felt was a much more intense and complete instructor class than the NRA's but i guess YMMV.

Last edited by groovyash; 03-21-2011 at 18:22..
groovyash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2011, 06:29   #10
Steve in PA
Senior Member
 
Steve in PA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 7,343
Slide a stack of liability lawsuits across the desk of a small town chief and let him know that it's his ass that is on the block and see how fast they allow one of their officers to go to a decent instructor class.

The PSP class is okay, but that's as far as I'll go with it. Not bad, not great, but okay. I would not want to be an instructor with only that certification under my belt. There are far better and more widely recognized training schools out there.
__________________
"The Marines I have seen around the world have, the cleanest bodies, the filthiest minds, the highest morale, and the lowest morals of any group of animals I have ever seen. Thank God for the United States Marine Corps. Eleanor Roosevelt, 1945"
Steve in PA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2011, 14:30   #11
Ship A'Hoy
Trigger Control
 
Ship A'Hoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Pa
Posts: 786
Well class is over and I passed. It was an outstanding class! Learned some new drills that really challenge me.

We had 27 students. Ten police officers, one from the Bahamas, three Navy personnel, some private security, Brinks, Corrections Officers and County Probation Officers. The lone female was a probation officer and a real good shot. She won the handgun competition.

I scored 100% on the handgun course. Still some guys had to re-shoot it.

Failed my first attempt with the shotgun. I pulled one shot high at 25 yards and had to re-shoot. Gotta remember to use the sights! Shot a perfect score the second time.

After qualifying, we had a shotgun competition. We started with five rounds in the gun, one in the chamber and four in the magazine, safety on, and at the shoulder ready. Then we shot the five rounds as fast as we could and the last five shots were combat reloads. My time was 15.70 seconds for all ten rounds. A lot of luck and a few lessons learned from our instructors helped me win. The instructors gave me a firearms instructor pin as an award.

They took our applications for certification so, that should be coming in the next few weeks.

Only question left is what class do I want to attend next?
__________________
"You won't rise to the occasion - you'll default to your level of training." Barrett Tillman
NRA LE Certified Handgun/Shotgun Instructor
Certified Glock Armorer
Speed is fine, accuracy is final.
Ship A'Hoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2011, 18:11   #12
Steve in PA
Senior Member
 
Steve in PA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 7,343
Patrol rifle instructor, tactical shooting instructor.
__________________
"The Marines I have seen around the world have, the cleanest bodies, the filthiest minds, the highest morale, and the lowest morals of any group of animals I have ever seen. Thank God for the United States Marine Corps. Eleanor Roosevelt, 1945"
Steve in PA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2011, 20:10   #13
Dragoon44
Lifetime Membership
Unfair Facist
 
Dragoon44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 24,416
This must be something new, when I took the police instructors course 25+ years ago there was no re certification requirements.
__________________
“Right is still right, even if nobody is doing it. And wrong is still wrong, even if everybody is doing it.”—Texas Ranger saying.
Dragoon44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-14-2011, 20:43   #14
jdh31313
Senior Member
 
jdh31313's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: S.E. Georgia
Posts: 212
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ship A'Hoy View Post
Well class is over and I passed. It was an outstanding class! Learned some new drills that really challenge me.

We had 27 students. Ten police officers, one from the Bahamas, three Navy personnel, some private security, Brinks, Corrections Officers and County Probation Officers. The lone female was a probation officer and a real good shot. She won the handgun competition.

I scored 100% on the handgun course. Still some guys had to re-shoot it.

Failed my first attempt with the shotgun. I pulled one shot high at 25 yards and had to re-shoot. Gotta remember to use the sights! Shot a perfect score the second time.

After qualifying, we had a shotgun competition. We started with five rounds in the gun, one in the chamber and four in the magazine, safety on, and at the shoulder ready. Then we shot the five rounds as fast as we could and the last five shots were combat reloads. My time was 15.70 seconds for all ten rounds. A lot of luck and a few lessons learned from our instructors helped me win. The instructors gave me a firearms instructor pin as an award.

They took our applications for certification so, that should be coming in the next few weeks.

Only question left is what class do I want to attend next?
Who was your Instructor? I took the class in Panama City, FLA in Dec. 07 and had Roy Bergman & Mark Peters. Great class!
jdh31313 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-14-2011, 21:11   #15
Dragoon44
Lifetime Membership
Unfair Facist
 
Dragoon44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 24,416
The NRA instructor that taught my course was a complete dick, it was easy to tell he really didn't like cops and felt himself superior. He spent most the time glorifying himself and running down other firearms instructors.

IIRC he was actually the head of the NRA police firearms at the time. carried on and on about how educated he was and how he could run a city with the degrees he had. Comparing himself to some well known instructors of the time he actually referred to himself as "Superman" as compared to them.

Needless to say even as meek and mild as I am he and I did not hit it off, especially after I called him on some of the comments he made.

The final day of qualification he made a big todo about how the shooter with the highest score would be announced, blah blah blah but when that shooter turned out to be me with the only perfect score he announced scores didn't matter only if you passed or failed.

__________________
“Right is still right, even if nobody is doing it. And wrong is still wrong, even if everybody is doing it.”—Texas Ranger saying.

Last edited by Dragoon44; 05-14-2011 at 21:13..
Dragoon44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2011, 15:57   #16
Ship A'Hoy
Trigger Control
 
Ship A'Hoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Pa
Posts: 786
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdh31313 View Post
Who was your Instructor? I took the class in Panama City, FLA in Dec. 07 and had Roy Bergman & Mark Peters. Great class!
Instructors they were John Beehner from Monroeville PD Pa, Tim Lose from the NRA and Don Berich from Ithaca PD, NY.

All great instructors, very helpful!!!
__________________
"You won't rise to the occasion - you'll default to your level of training." Barrett Tillman
NRA LE Certified Handgun/Shotgun Instructor
Certified Glock Armorer
Speed is fine, accuracy is final.
Ship A'Hoy is offline   Reply With Quote

 
  
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:37.




Homepage
FAQ
Forums
Calendar
Advertise
Gallery
GT Wiki
GT Blogs
Social Groups
Classifieds


Users Currently Online: 1,185
265 Members
920 Guests

Most users ever online: 2,672
Aug 11, 2014 at 2:31