[sdsnet]

[QUOTE=Baba Louie;17574350]1. Prayers
2. Counseling
3. CZ-82!!! and direct her to Kathy's site CorneredCat pronto (please)

http://corneredcat.com/

Nice site !

[cloudbuster]

I agree with the people who have said let her try out a few guns. Find a range that has loaner/rental guns and let her explore a range of guns.

A problem for new shooters is that the guns that are comfortable to shoot frequently don't overlap with the guns that are comfortable to carry. My daughter shoots my L-Frame much better and with more confidence than her J-Frame, but lugging around an L-Frame just isn't a serious option for her.

It's a given that DAO J-Frames are one of the most difficult pistols with which to become proficient, and they're fairly loud and snappy.

Some women are put off by semi-automatics. Some aren't. It's not like it's rocket science. She may take right to it. Don't pre-judge her.

However, I would avoid any semi-automatic with a manual safety -- it seems like a simple thing, but it's the first thing an inexperienced user forgets about (at both ends -- forgetting to put it on when it should be on, and to take it off when it should be off).

See how she reacts at the range. If she's timid, better she have a .32 Auto she's willing to shoot than a 9mm or .38 she's intimidated by.

Note that a lot of .380s are no "softer" or easier to shoot than 9mms because they use straight blowback actions instead of locked breaches. (hi-points, btw, are one of the few 9mms that are straight blowback, so it has recoil out of proportion to its enormous size -- but nothing against hi-points. They're cheap and reliable.).

One of the smallest, simplest, softest-shooting pistols is the KelTec P32 which is a .32 auto with a locked breach, so it has very little felt recoil despite its tiny size. It may not be much of a gun, but if it's all she'll carry, it's better than the one she left home "just this once" because it seemed too inconvenient.

It bears repeating that shot placement is much more important then caliber. Better she can hit him seven times with a small caliber gun than flinch-and-miss with a bigger gun. Let her make the call with what feels good to her.

ETA: OP, if your friend can't afford a gun that you and she feel comfortable with, but if you happen to have a spare of your own that's suitable, loan her yours. You'd hate for something to happen to her because she couldn't come up with the cash, or because she relied on a cheap PoS gun that wasn't reliable, right? You can get it back after she saves up more cash for her own.

[HotRoderX]

One thing she needs to do is figure out if she does plan to carry can she use it. No matter how serious she thinks she is, she needs to sit down and really think about what carrying entitles. The last thing she wants to do is be carrying and not willing to use it. Like my instructor told us the only thing worse then being unprepared is prepared and unwilling. If she falls into the prepared but unwilling she just gave her attacker a weapon. Once that is worked out then my guess would be look at the G26 like you said minimal recoil in a tight package. I would also take a look at the Rugers they tend to be a lot of bang for your buck. I would stay away from anything from Tarusus as they seem to be hit and miss. One thing for sure you and your wife need to make sure she gets plenty of range time in, not that you would need a reason to go tot he range.

[TN.Frank]

If(BIG, HUGE, HAIRY IF) she does end up getting a gun and IF she does end up pulling the trigger and sending this guy to hell where he belongs I'd hate to see how it'll all play out in court if they catch wind that you or anyone else helped her get the gun and taught her to use it.
I'm NOT saying that what you're doing is wrong in ANY WAY, I am saying that a smart Lawyer will totally take her apart in the Court room and make this jerks killing look totally premeditated to the point where she may even be brought up on 1st Deg. Murder Charges.

Yes, he's attacked her in the past and has threatened to do so again in the future but a good lawyer COULD say that after she got the gun SHE provoked him into attacking her so she could kill him and that's Premeditation.

I still think there's something that she can do other then picking up a gun even though I'll be the first one to say that a handgun in the right hands is a great equalizer. Just please, be very, very careful if you choose to walk down this path and please, let her get some professional firearms training so she'll be more "Court Proof" if push does come to shove and she off's the guy.

[WiskyT]

Originally Posted by unit1069

The woman isn't the OP's friend; she's a friend of the OP's fiance.

Regardless of their association or relationship the very last thing I'd recommend is becoming involved in a situation that's already resulted in the arrest of the perp. Let law enforcement/prosecution institutions deal with this alleged criminal. And do remember at this stage his criminality has not been adjudicated in a court of law.

What is the "friend" going to do when he initiates a confrontation with an alleged violent offender? What's the "friend" going to do if the perp escalates the confrontation that the "friend" initiated?

Your advice sound like a prescription for potentially very serious legal problems for the "friend" and it's not something I would ever recommend --- unless one is going out of his/her way to look for trouble.

None of which will be believed by the OP until he finds out that the victim has refused to testify in court.

[M&P15T]

Originally Posted by Just1More

Don't get a semi-automatic for someone who doesn't know anything about guns. Get a revolver.

Not by my experiences. I've taught multiple females that were completely new to firearms how to shoot with GLOCK pistols. Revolvers are harder to shoot, with more difficult to learn triggers, worse sights, and more recoil.

The best things about GLOCK pistols are no safety, easy to learn trigger, good sights, easy recoil in 9MM.

[TN.Frank]

Originally Posted by M&P15T

B.S., I've taught multiple females that were completely new to firearms how to shoot with GLOCK pistols. Revolvers are harder to shoot, with more difficult to learn triggers, worse sights, and more recoil.

But revolvers don't get Stove Pipe jams, Failure to Feed, Failure to Eject, you can't accidentally drop the mag out of a revolver under a high stress situation, you can't limp wrist a revolver, you can easily see if your revolver is loaded or unloaded.
For someone not "into" guns a revolver is a much better choice. Heck, my wife has shot for years, all kind of guns and she still feels more comfortable with a revolver. It just depends on the person and how willing they are to learn the manual of arm that goes along with the gun. A revolver has a much simpler manual of arms.

[WiskyT]

Originally Posted by M&P15T

B.S., I've taught multiple females that were completely new to firearms how to shoot with GLOCK pistols. Revolvers are harder to shoot, with more difficult to learn triggers, worse sights, and more recoil.

And did those women then buy and carry Glocks? Will they remember how to use them when they haven't shot them in a year and a half? Do they clean the dust bunnies out of them? Did the lipstick in their purse depress the trigger?

Yes, you can show a novice how to shoot an auto. You can show a female novice how to shoot and auto easier than a male novice. Unless they are going to move beyond the novice stage, and shoot once a month and stay trained, a revolver will be a better choice. It can get bounced around in her purse for a decade and all she has to do is point it at the bad guy and sweep the trigger.

[smokeross]

Originally Posted by BuckyP

She should shoot a few different guns and get a feel for how they are. Depending on how much she is going to practice, a revolver is not a bad option. How will she carry? If recoil is problem, an all steel revolver could be the answer.

Don't discount the used market either.

Yes, this. A double action .38 They never fail and are easy to learn. She can practice with loads that are comfortable to shoot and then keep it loaded with a good defensive round. If she has to use it, she won't notice the additional recoil.

[GAFinch]

If those 18 year old yahoos over in General Glocking can first learn to shoot using a Glock, so can a woman.

[glock2740]

Originally Posted by Just1More

Don't get a semi-automatic for someone who doesn't know anything about guns. Get a revolver.

I agree. And get them to the range to shoot ALOT. Also loan her the money, if need be, to get a CC permit ASAP. If she's gonna be carrying the gun and possibly be put in a SD situation and possibly have to shoot the guy, she will be in deep dodo if she's just packing "because she's scared".

[fnfalman]

I'd recommend to stay out of this volatile situation. It's "he said/she said" right now. Get in the middle of it will cause the OP nothing but headache. Unless you're there seeing the guy slapping her around and raping her, you don't know anything.

If she were to want to learn about shooting for self-defense, then recommend a local training school/instructor for her.

If the OP were to teach her to shoot and she went to buy a gun then blasted the ex, then it turned out that they both had personal issues instead of assault and rape. Now what?

That's my two cents about involvement.

For gun recommendation, it's hard to beat a Smith&Wesson K-frame in .38 Special. A Model 10 or similar models can be had for $300 or less. It's rugged and reliable. It will put six shots into somebody most ricky tick. Six shots of .38 Special in Gold Dot, HydraShok, FMJ, soft points, wadcutter, semiwadcutter, Nyclad, ad infinitum. It doesn't care. It will fire all .38 Special ammo.

[M&P15T]

Originally Posted by TN.Frank

If(BIG, HUGE, HAIRY IF) she does end up getting a gun and IF she does end up pulling the trigger and sending this guy to hell where he belongs I'd hate to see how it'll all play out in court if they catch wind that you or anyone else helped her get the gun and taught her to use it.
I'm NOT saying that what you're doing is wrong in ANY WAY, I am saying that a smart Lawyer will totally take her apart in the Court room and make this jerks killing look totally premeditated to the point where she may even be brought up on 1st Deg. Murder Charges.

Yes, he's attacked her in the past and has threatened to do so again in the future but a good lawyer COULD say that after she got the gun SHE provoked him into attacking her so she could kill him and that's Premeditation.

I still think there's something that she can do other then picking up a gun even though I'll be the first one to say that a handgun in the right hands is a great equalizer. Just please, be very, very careful if you choose to walk down this path and please, let her get some professional firearms training so she'll be more "Court Proof" if push does come to shove and she off's the guy.

If you could provide one actual adjudicated case where a previously assaulted and raped female got charged with murder defending herself, I'd be shocked. Me thinks you have a twisted sense of the legal system.

And if this woman lives in Texas, she might actually get a medal for offing this d-bag. I know of a 1st hand account of a shooting, where the perp was shot and wounded by a friend of a female, who was days later abducted by the B.G. (after the perp got out of the hospital), driven across state lines, and then released a few days later. The cops told the person that shot the guy, that he should have killed the perp when he had the chance.

She also doesn't need to get "professional" training, that's just more fear creeping out of your view of the legal system. In fact, looking at it from your point of view, said spawn of satan prosecuter could then say that she sought the best training available to be best able to kill the guy.

See how paranoia works? It can go both ways.

At this point, despite the fact that the perp hasn't been convicted yet, there are police and medical reports, pictures of the woman black, blue and bleeding, rape kit results, etc. The bad guy is already toast, he knows it, and he may just decide to kill her for no good reason other than to do it before he gets thrown into prison.

[fnfalman]

Originally Posted by M&P15T

I
She also doesn't need to get "professional" training, that's just more fear creeping out of your view of the legal system. In fact, looking at it from your point of view, said spawn of satan prosecuter could then say that she sought the best training available to be best able to kill the guy.

At least it ain't you that got involved in it. The "professional training" place has insurance and lawyers to deal with that sort of thing. Unless you like getting involved in personal business of other people that you don't know much about.

At this point, despite the fact that the perp hasn't been convicted yet, there are police and medical reports, pictures of the woman black, blue and bleeding, rape kit results, etc. The bad guy is already toast, he knows it, and he may just decide to kill her for no good reason other than to do it before he gets thrown into prison.

Did you see all these evidences in this case?

It couldn't have been maybe they were into rough sex and then he told her, "Ciao baby" and she got pissed off, calling the cops faking rape?

You were there? You saw everything happened with your own eyes?

[M&P15T]

Originally Posted by TN.Frank

But revolvers don't get Stove Pipe jams, Failure to Feed, Failure to Eject, you can't accidentally drop the mag out of a revolver under a high stress situation, you can't limp wrist a revolver, you can easily see if your revolver is loaded or unloaded.
For someone not "into" guns a revolver is a much better choice. Heck, my wife has shot for years, all kind of guns and she still feels more comfortable with a revolver. It just depends on the person and how willing they are to learn the manual of arm that goes along with the gun. A revolver has a much simpler manual of arms.

.

Neither have any of the 12 GLOCK pistols I've owned. Ever. Not in tens of thousands of rounds. Not with me shooting them, or any of the females I've taught to use them. And never have I either witnessed or heard of anyone accidently dropping a magazine out of an auto. And I don't agree that a revolver has a simpler manual of arms. Slap a mag in, cycle the action, done. Simple. One trigger to learn, less recoil, better sights, higher capacity, etc., etc.

You like revolvers, and you'll go to any imaginative lengths to support your position. All I have to do is point out that autos have eclipsed revolvers in sales to civilians, and 100% with Military and LEOs, for decades. That's it.

[M&P15T]

Originally Posted by fnfalman

At least it ain't you that got involved in it. The "professional training" place has insurance and lawyers to deal with that sort of thing. Unless you like getting involved in personal business of other people that you don't know much about?

The "Professional Training" place costs money. She doesn't have it. And since there is almost a 0% chance that where she learned to use a pistol will ever come up, who cares.

[M&P15T]

Originally Posted by GAFinch

If those 18 year old yahoos over in General Glocking can first learn to shoot using a Glock, so can a woman.

Right.

And everyone that goes into the Military or a Police Academy learn with automatics. There's a reason....they're better in several crucial ways.

[fnfalman]

Originally Posted by M&P15T

The "Professional Training" place costs money. She doesn't have it. And since there is almost a 0% chance that where she learned to use a pistol will ever come up, who cares.

Then why don't you volunteer to train her then?

[WiskyT]

Originally Posted by fnfalman

Did you see all these evidences in this case?

It couldn't have been maybe they were into rough sex and then he told her, "Ciao baby" and she got pissed off, calling the cops faking rape?

You were there? You saw everything happened with your own eyes?

It could have been carried live on TV and if she doesn't testify, the state won't prosecute. More than likely she will be fetching him a turkey pot-pie and Milwaukee's Best in a few weeks.

[WiskyT]

Originally Posted by M&P15T

The "Professional Training" place costs money. She doesn't have it. And since there is almost a 0% chance that where she learned to use a pistol will ever come up, who cares.

If she invites him in and ends up killing him, you can bet your ass that the OP will be spending long hours being interviewed, deposed, and testifying.

[M&P15T]

Originally Posted by WiskyT

And did those women then buy and carry Glocks? Will they remember how to use them when they haven't shot them in a year and a half? Do they clean the dust bunnies out of them? Did the lipstick in their purse depress the trigger?

Yes, you can show a novice how to shoot an auto. You can show a female novice how to shoot and auto easier than a male novice. Unless they are going to move beyond the novice stage, and shoot once a month and stay trained, a revolver will be a better choice. It can get bounced around in her purse for a decade and all she has to do is point it at the bad guy and sweep the trigger.

So can a G26, no problem.

However....

We're not talking about someone that is going to get a CCW and carry a pistol. We're talking about someone with a very clear and present (immediate) threat to their life. This is someone that needs a pistol right now, needs to become proficient with it quickly, and has a very real threat against her, probably more than any one currently on GT.

CCWs take months to get, we're not talking about CCWing at this point, maybe down the road a bit.

[M&P15T]

Originally Posted by fnfalman

Then why don't you volunteer to train her then?

I certainly would. No problem. But I'm in Virginia, that's a bit of a drive.

If a female I was close to was beaten and raped by an ex that is a future threat, and she came to me to learn about shooting, I would. Would you not?

[bmylesk]

kel tec PF9. got mine for 234. shoots reliable, cant go wrong. ive put just over 100 rounds flawlessly. don't let anyone else tell you the PF9 is BS. (do make sure to get the newer models though)

[M&P15T]

Originally Posted by WiskyT

If she invites him in and ends up killing him, you can bet your ass that the OP will be spending long hours being interviewed, deposed, and testifying.

You're making so many negative assumptions, I can't count them all.

You're assuming the woman is lying.
You're assuming she will not testify.
You're assuming she will get back with him in the future.
You're assuming she is going to invite the guy over so she can kill him.

Why don't we wait until the OP clears things up a bit about the people involved?

[WiskyT]

Originally Posted by M&P15T

So can a G26, no problem.

However....

We're not talking about someone that is going to get a CCW and carry a pistol. We're talking about someone with a very clear and present (immediate) threat to their life. This is someone that needs a pistol right now, needs to become proficient with it quickly, and has a very real threat against her, probably more than any one currently on GT.

CCWs take months to get, we're not talking about CCWing at this point, maybe down the road a bit.

So you have figured out that she's not going to carry this gun? Is there some kind of unwritten rule that violent ex's won't attack someone unless they are in the home? She doesn't need to wait months to get a CHP in AZ. Regardless, the gun should be carried and 99% of the gun enthusiasts I know aren't proficient enough with their guns to use a semi, let alone a novice who likely will never do more than shoot half a box through it if she shoots it at all.