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Old 07-02-2011, 15:49   #101
TN.Frank
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It's one thing to shoot a semi at the range where you're not under dire, life and death stress. It's quite another to try and clear a malfunction when someone is coming at you and you're adrenalin is sky high and you're shaking like a leaf in the breeze. Still think a revolver is more "idiot proof" for a Non-Shooter then a semi auto and no one will change my mind on that fact.

Also, you've been warned, if she does end up shooting and killing her ex-jerk of a boy friend and they drag her into court and ask her where she got the idea of getting a gun in the first place it's not going to be a cake walk. Lawyers can and do twist stuff around to win a case day in and day out. Just be ready, that's all I'm saying.
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Old 07-02-2011, 15:55   #102
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Old 07-02-2011, 16:10   #103
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I am sure my limited experience is to small to draw any valid statistical conclusions, but I have responded initially to a couple hundred rape/sexual battery calls. I have been to more plane crashes than I have been a call in which a total stranger actually raped the victim. (Not suggesting that a known person cannot commit a rape.) I have been to more plane crashes than I have been to court to testify in a sexual battery case.
That paragraph is literary gold.
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Old 07-02-2011, 16:12   #104
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First off I'd like to thank everyone for their recommendations =) I really appreciate it.

I actually think the whole new shooter + woman = revolver, period. is slightly offensive. As if they're too stupid to figure out the gun, yes a revolver is simple, if it fails to fire, pull the trigger again. But the downside is the capacity and the average heavy trigger pull, I think having a really heavy trigger to start off with is a discouraging thing, especially when learning accuracy and trigger control - I started off with a revolver and my accuracy jumped through the roof when I got my first glock. Capacity; If the average police officer hit rate is 25%, then what is the hit rate for a new shooter who has a 300 pound nutcase charging them. With that in mind, if she hits him, that's one shot - chances are hes not going to drop.

I think a semi-auto is an excellent choice for a new shooter/woman. I will do my best to drill the malfunction drills as best I can, but I think she will have absolutely no problem learning. I would prefer a glock for her as there are no safeties to mess with.

We are bringing out my fiance's ruger LCR, my glock26, and mossberg 590A1 (going to let her keep it at her house until she gets the pistol).

I think a revolver would be great if that's all she can afford, but ultimately I think they're best utilized as a BUG - I'm sure I'll get flamed but that's just my opinion.


What do you guys think about the Ruger LCP 380? I'm not a fan of 380, but it's tiny as hell, could be pocket carried and the recoil couldn't be that bad. I was thinking of getting one for my 8 year old for his first pistol, I noticed the price new was 285.00 which is great. How well do you think a 380 would do against a heavy set man? Don't forget we are in Tucson, Arizona and no one will be wearing leather coats or heavy clothing for the next 5-6 months. Everyone is in T-shirts.
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Old 07-02-2011, 16:26   #105
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Also I'd like to mention to those who said I'm putting myself in potential legal liability;
I will not sit idly if I can possibly help prevent the rape/death of another human being who ASKS for help.

Also - The officers who responded said to her "buy a gun immediately and be prepared to defend yourself, because he WILL come back, and we can only help after the fact."

Luckily for her Arizona does not require a CCW permit to carry concealed or open, and there are no waiting periods. I'm proud to live in a state where one can enjoy freedom.
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Old 07-02-2011, 16:40   #106
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Don't start at the end.

Mindset, knowledge, judgment, tactics, marksmanship, firearm. These are the basic six elements, in order of importance, that keep armed people alive, whether a police officer, store keeper or ordinary CCW. Any training she receives must go far beyond how to shoot so and so gun. Police officers who were members of their department's competitive shooting teams have died in shootouts, mainly as a result of problems with mindset and tactics.

Very difficult to take a novice and instill a sufficient degree of skill in a short period of time. Needless to say, she must insure that her residence is fortified within reason. She must know how to enter and leave her residence without finding an arm around her neck and a knife in her ribs. She must enlist neighbors willing to inform her or call the police if anyone is loitering near her residence. She must be a sufficient wheel-woman that she can't be easily forced off the road. She must be suspicious of all solicitations so as not to venture into a trap. She must carry a gun (if legal in your area) as though she might actually need it. I might add I hate when women put guns in purses. She must vary her schedule. Also, the trap she anticipates at her residence might occur where you does her shopping or dry cleaning etc. Heck, could write a book here.
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Old 07-02-2011, 16:41   #107
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On a serious note, what about an H&K P7?
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Old 07-02-2011, 16:42   #108
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I would suggest you direct the other gal to a professional introductory handgun class, and leave it at that. She will figure out the rest if she's for real. Anybody can figure out on their own how to get a gun if they "need" one. You can suggest your favorites all you want. Proceed with caution, both your wife and you.

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Old 07-02-2011, 16:47   #109
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So sorry to hear this, I hope he stays in jail and she is able to get whatever help she needs. Setting the gun issue aside, make sure she has training and the mental preparedness of what defending oneself means. Until then, I'd be a bit nervous of her having a handgun and the chance that it might be used against her.
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Old 07-02-2011, 16:59   #110
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If you decide on a J Frame, there is a laser available for it that's not too steep.

http://www.laserlyte.com/Laser_Gun_S...-SW/CK-SW.html

It's may not be pretty up close, but it's got all metal construction, and it's very solid on the gun.
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Old 07-02-2011, 17:00   #111
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Don't get a semi-automatic for someone who doesn't know anything about guns. Get a revolver.
I couldn't agree more. I would get her the .32 caliber Pink Lady:

http://www.charterfirearms.com/produ...y32_53230.html

I know, it's a bit much. But if you can prove the story, I'm happy to chip in $20 towards the gun. I have two sisters, and the thought of either of them being attacked makes my blood boil.

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Old 07-02-2011, 17:15   #112
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Also I'd like to mention to those who said I'm putting myself in potential legal liability;
I will not sit idly if I can possibly help prevent the rape/death of another human being who ASKS for help.

Also - The officers who responded said to her "buy a gun immediately and be prepared to defend yourself, because he WILL come back, and we can only help after the fact."

Luckily for her Arizona does not require a CCW permit to carry concealed or open, and there are no waiting periods. I'm proud to live in a state where one can enjoy freedom.
Ask her to show you a copy of her final restraining order. If she doesn't have one of those, she hasn't been serious about keeping him away from her.
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Old 07-02-2011, 18:00   #113
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Also I'd like to mention to those who said I'm putting myself in potential legal liability;
I will not sit idly if I can possibly help prevent the rape/death of another human being who ASKS for help...

.
Potentially highly commendable. And I wish you nothing but the best in this. Still, I would be passively curious as to any history of domestic violence and the history of what she did (or did not do) after previous incidents.
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Old 07-02-2011, 18:02   #114
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Potentially highly commendable. And I wish you nothing but the best in this. Still, I would be passively curious as to any history of domestic violence and the history of what she did (or did not do) after previous incidents.
Good point. She could be one of the certain persons not allowed to have a firearm.
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Old 07-02-2011, 18:45   #115
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You should not be offended is a someone recommends a revolver for a new shooter, especially one who is female. Smaller and easier to conceal automatics are hard to rack, even for some men. Most women tend to be weaker; not all, but most. You can pack more power in a small revolver and they can be easier to use in awkward positions, such as one may be in while being attacked and terrified. Slmall revolvers are not wimpy girly guns. You can get a Ruger LCR in 357 Magnum and it will be the size of a J frame Smith & Wesson. The J frame is the best bet along with laser grips, such as from Crimson Trace. It is often the one I carry.

Small automatics are often very picky about the ammo they will reliably feed and the shooter must maintain a firm grip. Also, the revolver can be fired when covered by a coat pocket or a blanket. The revolver should have a fully enclosed hammer (double action only) and something that will not rust easily. I carry two or three speed loaders, but reloading is not at all fast with a J frame, since ejection is hampered by the shorter stroke.

To deploy weapons in combat, get the appropriate training and conceal carry permits. Also, be prepared to be committed to carrying even when you do not think you are in danger. The person who attacks may not be the same person and attackers rarely announce their criminal intentions. Training is important as is situational awareness.

See help from crime victim support groups. While in the middle of the crisis, one is not the expert in survival. Talk to people who know what to expect and how to minimize the odds of being a victim again. As a victim of crime, many of us are not our own best friends and we can often undermine our own interests.

Also, crime victims should get counseling to deal with the emotional impact. It is way too easy to start on the right side of the law and end out on the wrong side. I personally understand the fear and anger; to survive, you must control your response.
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Old 07-02-2011, 18:46   #116
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I actually think the whole new shooter + woman = revolver, period. is slightly offensive. As if they're too stupid to figure out the gun, yes a revolver is simple, if it fails to fire, pull the trigger again.
Um, I consider myself to be a pretty gun savvy guy and I was into revolvers for years, I love em'. It has nothing to do with intelligence or gender, it's the fact that they go "bang" each and every time you pull the trigger. I'd still not feel under gunned with a good 4" K Frame .357Mag.
Just make sure if she does go semi you teach her the Immediate action drills and let her shoot enough to be totally comfortable with the gun.
Best of luck and hopefully things won't come to her having to take a human life in order to preserve her own.
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Old 07-02-2011, 19:01   #117
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Permit still a good idea is available

Quote:
Originally Posted by dwalker84 View Post
Also I'd like to mention to those who said I'm putting myself in potential legal liability;
I will not sit idly if I can possibly help prevent the rape/death of another human being who ASKS for help.

Also - The officers who responded said to her "buy a gun immediately and be prepared to defend yourself, because he WILL come back, and we can only help after the fact."

Luckily for her Arizona does not require a CCW permit to carry concealed or open, and there are no waiting periods. I'm proud to live in a state where one can enjoy freedom.
Though Arizona does not require a permit, I believe they still have the process to get one. I would get the permit in order to be able to travel to other states with reciprocity. Also, Florida offers non-resident permits that will add some more states. What good is a gun if you can not take it when you travel.

I agree with the police officer about the fact that the guy will come back. I would hope the victim support group would cover this too.

I do not know what the sentencing guidance is in Arizona, but when someone breaks into an occupied home, it tends to be a long time. I would not count on being notified when he gets out or if he escapes.

Work on dealing with the support group or groups. It will be difficult to move on if you fail to work on yourself, including the behaviors that lead into abusive relationships and the painful aftermath.
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Old 07-02-2011, 20:08   #118
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Ruger P-series autos are cheap and reliable, but not the size of a G26. S&W anything is good, and some are small (6906, 3913, 908). Most of these can be had for under $300 used. The S&W 908 is probably the cheapest good subcompact pistol you will be able to find. It is the economy 3913...around $250 or 300.
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Old 07-02-2011, 20:22   #119
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Quote:
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My fiance's friend from work has an abusive ex that's been stalking/harrassing her for months. Yesterday he came to her house, and beat her senseless, raped her, and threatened to kill her. The police arrested him and he is currently locked up, but no telling when/how quickly he will get out.

She's been asking us to take her to the range and teach her about guns and how to shoot - she knows absolutely nothing about firearms, but after speaking to her, she has made up her mind to carry and take this seriously. I'm taking her tomorrow first thing - but she needs to get a handgun. Her main problem is money - I told her the best bet would to be to pawn whatever she can, and get a new/used glock26 - I have a feeling she won't be able to get the money required to afford a glock.

My question is: What are a few affordable but RELIABLE pistols, that are smaller or around the size of a g26 - 9mm is preferred but 380 is as low as I think she should go. Her ex is 300+lb's, I'm concerned about a 380's ability to penetrate reliably.

Any suggestions?

The two magic words.....AFFORDABLE and RELIABLE

Your only choice....BERSA!!!

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=238411798

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=239450313

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=239193884

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=238915567



You can get 9mm Black Talons on GunBroker as well.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=239232165

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=238653054

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=239018884

I wish her all the best.

TGG
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Old 07-02-2011, 20:38   #120
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Sounds awful. Lend her one of yours if you have extras. Ruger p95 or p89 is an excellent semi auto gun. A used glock can be had in the same price range. At any rate, help her get something, and now.
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