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Old 06-05-2011, 08:09   #51
Bruce M
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HAMMERHEAD View Post
With all those mod's, I would be more worried about it not firing when I wanted it to.

This ^ again
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Old 06-05-2011, 12:51   #52
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Originally Posted by CrackerKen View Post
Even if it has a 1 pound trigger pull, it won't fire unless the trigger is pulled. Mine are all stock, so I don't have that concern. I prefer to carry a loaded gun that will go bang when I pull the trigger, so I carry chambered. I went an entire career in law enforcement carrying revolvers of various types. They all had a full load in them, and there was no safety on them. The wouldn't go bang unless you pulled the trigger. Same for our Glocks.
You can't really compare revolvers to glocks though since revolvers are TRUE DAO

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Originally Posted by John Biltz View Post
A hair trigger is dangerous because it goes off unintentionally under stress. Under stress fine motor skills disapear. Fine for a range but there are reasons you never see a real light trigger on weapons made for combat.
It's a light trigger but I wouldn't say it's "hairy"...with the lone wolf UTS maybe but that isn't installed unless at the range.

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Originally Posted by bel970 View Post
AD is a ND, and if everything was installed properly I would be more worried about it not going bang when you needed it to (as previously mentioned), mainly because of the the 4lb striker spring, see plenty of those cause ignition issues.
Thousands of rounds of various ammunition including reloaded with 3 different primers I've never had any issues. Maybe those "issues" were caused by you or whoever you know that experienced them.

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Originally Posted by GSSF17 View Post
Yep. Weapon will only fire when the trigger is pulled.

There are no ADs, as said before. No such thing- plain and simple

Not to be a jerk, but if you felt the need to lighten your trigger and perform those mods, what was your ultimate goal? Pull trigger, gun goes bang. I have never understood the notion that a weapon can "go off".....
The "ultimate" goal was a crisper pull...not to put a controlled pair in someone. I'll let the ammo and my accuracy take care of that.

I believe you are misinterpreting my question, as are many of the responses, when you speak of the notion "weapon can go off." Personally I don't agree with the "safe action system" even though it is a time tested setup. I think John Biltz said it best about fine motor skills degrading. Because my firearm was some what modded more for the range than anything else perhaps it's best not to take the risk and get a revolver or shotgun for home defense. Because I have family in the house it is self evident that their safety is paramount. I might get flamed for it but glocks are not "perfect" and neither are the rules of owning a gun. They are guidelines not interpretations set in the stone of physics.

My assumptions are merely based off of simple mathematical probability and I am not degrading glocks. It seems to be an educated opinion that it CAN happen and HAS happened even by experienced handlers. As I'm sure many of you know experience breeds complacency. It is my honest opinion that glocks have not defined the rules of physics and "perfected" safety. But I forgot glocks are Gods gift to man kind. I never understood this backwoods thinking of probability doesn't exist.

Last edited by RatherNotSay; 06-05-2011 at 12:52..
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Old 06-05-2011, 13:05   #53
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I put the same package in my model 34, I had failures to fire with the 4 lb spring on ammo with hard primers. I changed back to the stock Glock striker spring no more FTF's. Tricked out is OK for a range, Or competition gun, I would not have one set up that way to defend my family.

P.S. Changing back to the heavier striker spring did not change the trigger that much. I had shot the gun for a while before changing back, and the linkage had worn in nicely.
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Old 06-05-2011, 13:24   #54
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Old 06-05-2011, 13:43   #55
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This gets talked about a lot and is a classic example of the masses focusing more on their gear than on their techniques (because gear is cool and technique takes, well...effort). We are talking about a pound or 2 of trigger pull here people, negligable in the big picture of a fight. The real issue is finger on/off the trigger. Your finger shouldn't be on the trigger if you don't intend to fire, so if your finger is on the trigger- you have a target, shoot! If you haven't decided to engage the threat, you finger shouldn't be on the trigger and if you finger isn't on the trigger then there should be no problem with it getting pulled no matter what the weight is.

I have no problem carrying a light triggered gun. If a trigger job is safe enough to own, its safe enough to carry IMO...but I have a disaplined finger. Not saying I rig up all my carry guns with competition triggers, but if a system is functioning properly, I have no problem carrying it no matter what the poundage.
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Old 06-05-2011, 14:21   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RatherNotSay View Post


The "ultimate" goal was a crisper pull...not to put a controlled pair in someone. I'll let the ammo and my accuracy take care of that.

I believe you are misinterpreting my question, as are many of the responses, when you speak of the notion "weapon can go off." Personally I don't agree with the "safe action system" even though it is a time tested setup. I think John Biltz said it best about fine motor skills degrading. Because my firearm was some what modded more for the range than anything else perhaps it's best not to take the risk and get a revolver or shotgun for home defense. It is my honest opinion that glocks have not defined the rules of physics and "perfected" safety. But I forgot glocks are Gods gift to man kind. I never understood this backwoods thinking of probability doesn't exist.
You asked if it was safe to leave a round chambered. The answer is yes. That being said, you created a thread seeking a "solution" to a "problem" you created. That's the real issue here.

I did not misunderstand you at any point, either.

I am not a Glock Kool-aid drinker. If you don't have faith in the safe action system of your modified Glock pistol, then as you said, get a revolver or a shottie. I don't have 100% confidence in the brakes on my truck under all conditions, either. But by the same token, they are something upon which I regularly rely.

A weapon is a piece of machinery. It will lay there until you do something with it. Its functionality, or lack thereof, is contolled by who or what is manipulating it. Period. That's all I was saying.

In light of your response, I am going to revert back to the "if you have to ask, then you probably should not."
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Old 06-14-2011, 19:45   #57
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Originally Posted by RatherNotSay View Post
I've done a couple of modifications to my Glock 21 since I bought it. It has a 3.5lbs trigger connector, 4lbs firing pin spring, lighter firing pin safety spring, heavier trigger pull spring and I polished the entire trigger system. So my question is is it safe to leave a round chambered? I'm aware of the 4 cardinal rules and follow them religiously and I'm well aware of how the "safe action system" works. However, would the firing pin safety spring, firing pin safety polish job and lighter firing pin spring become a concern for an AD? Not a ND...but a AD. I also have a lone wolf ultimate trigger stop however it is not installed as it is recommended for competition/plinking only.

Hi RatherNotSay,

My thinking is that the plaintiffs attorney will have a field day with the defendant (you) in wrongful death or injury case.
Ask yourself how all those mods will sound in court.

Cheers, VegasPier
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Old 06-14-2011, 19:56   #58
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Old 06-15-2011, 01:51   #59
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To me that gun is way to modded to be a carry gun. I agree that an attorney will eat you alive if you ever use it. Should it matter, no. Will it, depends on the jury. If your gun needs that amount of work for you to be able to shoot it well enough for an SD gun, you need to look into a different gun.
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Old 06-15-2011, 09:08   #60
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Thank you. I think I have found a new example to use in class of how to misuse research data and statistics to prove a predetermined position.
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Old 06-15-2011, 13:35   #61
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Thank you. I think I have found a new example to use in class of how to misuse research data and statistics to prove a predetermined position.
glad i can help. have fun with your stock glock and i'll have fun with mine the way its set up.
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Old 06-15-2011, 14:15   #62
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glad i can help. have fun with your stock glock and i'll have fun with mine the way its set up.
Thanks. Been having fun and winning matches with stock glocks since 1993.
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Old 06-15-2011, 14:31   #63
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I have a ONE OUNCE trigger in my carry glock 10mm with extra powerful rounds in it and I ran 10 miles with a round in the chamber the other day.



(well not really, but I'm sure it wouldn't be a problem if I did)
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Old 06-15-2011, 14:34   #64
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Originally Posted by HAMMERHEAD View Post
With all those mod's, I would be more worried about it not firing when I wanted it to.
I have modded 3 of mine(3# trigger pull)without issue.
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Old 06-15-2011, 14:36   #65
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Thanks. Been having fun and winning matches with stock glocks since 1993.
i'm extremely happy for you. sounds like you have pretty good control over the stock glock trigger. i've heard only the absolute best shooters in the world can accurately shoot with one.
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Old 06-15-2011, 14:45   #66
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Originally Posted by GSSF17 View Post
Yep. Weapon will only fire when the trigger is pulled.

There are no ADs, as said before. No such thing- plain and simple

Not to be a jerk, but if you felt the need to lighten your trigger and perform those mods, what was your ultimate goal? Pull trigger, gun goes bang. I have never understood the notion that a weapon can "go off".....
Actually, there are such things as AD's, plain and simple. Any weapon with a free floating firing pin can accidentally discharge if the weapon is impacted in a certain way, OR chambering a round in a free floating pin system can result in an AD, commonly called a slamfire, OR a weapon that fires from an open bolt position can have a mechanical failure, OR.. you get the point.

Point is most discharges are ND's but there are such things as AD's.
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Old 06-15-2011, 14:49   #67
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Considering the fact that the Glock was once believed to be "AD-Proof"...until the infamous "Frisbee Test" for the DEA...it is really almost impossible for anyone except you to know if your gun is "AD-Proof" with the mods you have done. So go and test the crap out of it....that is really the only way to "know". And even then you really don't know. All you know is that you have not yet figured out how to make the gun AD, not that the gun is incapable of an AD.
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Old 06-15-2011, 14:52   #68
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Originally Posted by JBarbaresi View Post
i'm extremely happy for you. sounds like you have pretty good control over the stock glock trigger. i've heard only the absolute best shooters in the world can accurately shoot with one.
You've apparently heard wrong. On a fairly regular basis there are hundreds of people who have never fired a handgun (or a Glock handgun) who pick one up and with minimal instruction find that they can easily control the trigger of the their Glock and accurately engage targets at various distances.
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Old 06-15-2011, 15:27   #69
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Originally Posted by David Armstrong View Post
You've apparently heard wrong. On a fairly regular basis there are hundreds of people who have never fired a handgun (or a Glock handgun) who pick one up and with minimal instruction find that they can easily control the trigger of the their Glock and accurately engage targets at various distances.
I had a 4inch group at 15 yards with my glock 21 first time out. Second time shooting a gun...
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Old 06-15-2011, 15:33   #70
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If you follow the safety rules,carry in a holster and perform and pass the three safety function checks,How could there be a problem?IT'S A MACHINE.
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Old 06-15-2011, 15:34   #71
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Considering the fact that the Glock was once believed to be "AD-Proof"...until the infamous "Frisbee Test" for the DEA...
Dosei,
I think you may be getting the DEA frisbee test confused with the Suffolk County case. The DEA Frisbee test resulted in the slide separating from the frame when thrown.

The Suffolk County case involved an officer getting ready for work while home, chambering a round an having an AD. When recreated at the range, a department armorer thinking the officer simply violated a safety rule chambered a round and the weapon AD'd. An additional three more times resulted in three more AD's and three final slamfires resulting in automatic fire.
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Old 06-15-2011, 16:01   #72
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Originally Posted by Walk Soft View Post
If you follow the safety rules,carry in a holster and perform and pass the three safety function checks,How could there be a problem?IT'S A MACHINE.
A loose nut behind the trigger?

Always carry a heavy bat instead of a light one, a light one might cause an accidental swing under the influence of adrenaline. Always drive a vehicle with manual steering, you might over steer from adrenaline, trying to avoid a wreck. Never carry a sharp knife that opens easily, you might cut someone by accident.

And remember, you never see weapons used in combat with light trigger pulls, like 1911's or M-16's.

What is it they say about a booger hook? Oh yeah, insert and rotate in an orifice of your choice.

ETA: Sorry, thought I was posting in the other thread, they're both running along the same lines of debate (triggers).
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Last edited by NDCent; 06-15-2011 at 16:12.. Reason: Posted in wrong thread.
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Old 06-15-2011, 16:30   #73
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I had a 4inch group at 15 yards with my glock 21 first time out. Second time shooting a gun...
Yep. Shooting well with a standard trigger on a Glock seems well within the abilites of so many folks that you just have to wonder about these folks who apparenlty cannot figure it out.
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Old 06-15-2011, 16:33   #74
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Originally Posted by NAC View Post
Actually, there are such things as AD's, plain and simple. Any weapon with a free floating firing pin can accidentally discharge if the weapon is impacted in a certain way, OR chambering a round in a free floating pin system can result in an AD, commonly called a slamfire, OR a weapon that fires from an open bolt position can have a mechanical failure, OR.. you get the point.

Point is most discharges are ND's but there are such things as AD's.
We were speaking of a Glock- Specifically a Glock 21 the OP modded and clearly does not know how to "handle".

We will have to agree to disagree, only because you are incorrect. A bullet that leaves a Glock's barrel does so because the trigger is pulled. That, sir, is what is plain and simple. If not intended, it is a negligent discharge, which is exactly that.

But thank you for the insight.
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Old 06-15-2011, 16:59   #75
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Actually, there are such things as AD's, plain and simple. Any weapon with a free floating firing pin can accidentally discharge if the weapon is impacted in a certain way, OR chambering a round in a free floating pin system can result in an AD, commonly called a slamfire, OR a weapon that fires from an open bolt position can have a mechanical failure, OR.. you get the point.

Point is most discharges are ND's but there are such things as AD's.
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