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Old 01-09-2013, 11:37   #41
chucky2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arc Angel View Post
Why do ALL newbies think and talk the same way! "Power, range, accuracy, modularity, etc." Of course someone with this mentality IS NOT going to understand; but, ....... first things first: Learn how to, 'work a pistol'. Learn your grip; learn your trigger; learn how to quickly find your ideal front sight picture, and, 'How' to anchor all of your shot inside it.

Then you can start screwing around with all of the, 'awesome calibers'! How will you know when you're ready? Draw and fire multiple shots into a 6 inch circle at and inside 10 yards WITHOUT any misses. If you can do that ....... you're ready.

Here's my lowly G-21 (45 ACP) at 16 yards, and just as fast as I could make the pistol go, 'Bang!' (Very hot, 'top of the chart' ammo) Until you can do this, too, you're not going to be ready for: "power, range, and accuracy". In my experience, unless they're hunters, guys who are really good with their pistols simply don't think that way.
The problem is, I really don't want or need multiple firearms - for my purposes, I just need one. If I can get a G20 that can shoot 4 different calibers, and can convert with a full upper assembly to .45 (easily, so someone inexperienced like me can do it), then that is a huge plus.

If the gun can run all the way down to weak .40 and all the way up to hot 10mm, giving me a huge range for pretty much any use I could possibly need it for, then that's even all the better.

It's not that I can't afford it (while not rich, I've got quite a bit of savings...I could buy any combo of guns, accessories, etc. I want), I'm just a frugal type of guy. The G20 seems to be a 'do it all' type of gun, save for the aforementioned 'get a .22 to learn with'. (and even then, isn't there a 10->22 conversion?)

What made me even go down this road in the first place was when I took my gun safety class, we practiced with 6" .22 target pistols. We then shot two .38 and one .357 Mag out of a .357 revolver. And finally, two .45 out of a G21. Out of all the guns there, including the .22, the G21 was by far the nicest to shoot.

Depending on how bad I initially shoot the .40 w/ the .40 conversion barrel, I'm open to the .22 practice pistol. It'd certainly be cheap on ammo!

What .22 practice pistol would you guys recommend?

Chuck
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Old 01-09-2013, 18:19   #42
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Old 01-09-2013, 19:50   #43
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Have you looked at Advantage Arms 22 conversion kit for your G20? More expensive than a 40 conversion barrel but will pay back pretty fast if you shoot a lot.
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Old 01-09-2013, 21:12   #44
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Yes there is a conversion for a G20/21 to shoot .22lr. I believe Advantage Arms makes one.
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Old 01-10-2013, 08:07   #45
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Back to the original title..

My 14 year old son shot my G20SF loaded with full power Underwood 200 grain XTP. He didn't have a problem controlling it, though he did have a malfunction which I would attribute to limpwristing.

He had fired 9mm Makarov, 9mm Luger, and .40 S&W previously.

With the wide range of loadings out there in 10mm, plus the availability of .40, .357, and 9x21 barrels, my advice would be to go for it and Enjoy!
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Old 01-10-2013, 08:34   #46
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If you are serous about learning to shoot You can not go wrong with a g20 or G20sf 10mm, It does not have the recoil many say it does, Yes with ful power load you will know you have a powerful pistol. There are like you said many options for these pistol that no other pistol offers.
I love my G20 once you get use to it anything other than full power round will seem watered down. I will say I shoot a lot of watered down round for practice though but even watered down with 180gr 1250fps is very accurate and fun to shoot.

You will not be disappointed BUT a proud 10mm Glock owner

ALL the way
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Old 01-10-2013, 10:18   #47
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It's not my intention to speak against getting a 10mm, but if you're not really going to shoot 10mm, like you said, then why are you thinking about getting one? Why buy a G20, then buy a .40 barrel just to shoot .40 when you could buy a .40 to begin with? Sounds to me like that would make more sense. The .40 can be converted to 9mm (low recoil, low cost), 357 Sig and they make .22 conversion units all day long for the .40 models.

Or what about a G21 .45, which has just as many (if not more) options as the G20? .45 ammo is easier to come by locally, and they make 10mm conversion barrels for the G21, or you can put a G20 upper on a G21.

I don't think the 10mm is too much at all, but for something that's going to get used very little, why bother with it? You're better off spending your money on something you will use. Get out of your head the notion of the .40 being weak, that's garbage. If it won't fall to a .40, it's likely not to fall to a 10mm either. It's not like a 38 Spcl compared to a .357 Mag, not even close.
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Old 01-10-2013, 10:23   #48
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MY 29sf less recoil than my 23...GO BIG OR GO HOME!!!!!
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Old 01-10-2013, 10:41   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SDGlock23 View Post
It's not my intention to speak against getting a 10mm, but if you're not really going to shoot 10mm, like you said, then why are you thinking about getting one? Why buy a G20, then buy a .40 barrel just to shoot .40 when you could buy a .40 to begin with? Sounds to me like that would make more sense. The .40 can be converted to 9mm (low recoil, low cost), 357 Sig and they make .22 conversion units all day long for the .40 models.
The purpose for that was twofold in my eyes: 1.) Should be much cheaper over the thousands of rounds to shoot .40 instead of 10mm, since I realistically won't be reloading, and, 2.) the larger size and mass of the G20 should soak up more recoil of the .40 round compared to say a fullsize G22, making it even nicer/easier to shoot.

Quote:
Or what about a G21 .45, which has just as many (if not more) options as the G20? .45 ammo is easier to come by locally, and they make 10mm conversion barrels for the G21, or you can put a G20 upper on a G21.
That was an option I'd seriously considered. The reason I went G20 over G21 was that the G20 mags can accept .40 with no problems, whereas the .45 - as far as I was able to tell - could accept .45. It is absolutely true I could have got a G21, and then a 10mm barrel, plus I think an extractor?, plus 3 10mm mags, and been able to do what I'm about to be doing. Just didn't seem worth it given I can just get a G21 upper assembly whenever I'm ready to shoot .45.

Quote:
I don't think the 10mm is too much at all, but for something that's going to get used very little, why bother with it? You're better off spending your money on something you will use. Get out of your head the notion of the .40 being weak, that's garbage. If it won't fall to a .40, it's likely not to fall to a 10mm either. It's not like a 38 Spcl compared to a .357 Mag, not even close.
I didn't mean weak in stopping power wise, I mean weak as in, I go find the weakest (which if I'm lucky will also be the cheapest) .40 ammo to learn on, that's going to be weaker in theory to the weakest 10mm ammo I could find to practice on. For sure it should be cheaper...

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Old 01-10-2013, 11:02   #50
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The 10mm is great but you'll learn the quickest with a .22, something cheap along the lines of maybe a 22/45 would be a great tool to have alongside that 10mm for getting your basics down.
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Old 01-10-2013, 11:19   #51
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So question on the .22 practice route:

I am not opposed to doing this. Here's two questions though:

What would be better, getting the conversion for the G20, or, just buying a dedicated .22 practice gun?

Depending on your answer, what would be a good option? (sounds like a couple have already said Advantage Arms for the G20 conversion)

Chuck
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Old 01-10-2013, 12:46   #52
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I have no experience with the Advantage Arms but if it is reliable and durable, that would be great. Otherwise, I can't recommend highly enough the 22/45 for a dedicated practice gun for getting your basics down pat. One thing you have to remember for new shooters is that recoil is a major distraction to getting the basics mastered. Starting out on .40 or 10mm is a real challenge for building skills.

Plus, it's always nice to have a cheap, dedicated plinker gun.
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Old 01-10-2013, 17:58   #53
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Conversion

Quote:
Originally Posted by arushus View Post
Yes there is a conversion for a G20/21 to shoot .22lr. I believe Advantage Arms makes one.
I purchased an Advantage Arms Glock LE 20-21 22LR Conversion Kit for my Glock G21SF. The first time I took it to the range, it really was disappointing. I was using Winchester .22 LR ammo. It would not cycle the first three rounds in each fully loaded mag. I loaded the mag with 3 fewer rounds thinking it was excessive spring pressure with a full mag....not the answer. I put the thing up and was considering sending it back. I then noticed some Blazer ammo in my cabinet and took it to the range. It functioned flawlessly, never a failure of any kind. I am pleased with conversion at this point. I can shoot the same gun, squeeze the same trigger, have the same feel ALL DAY LONG and spend so little for so much fun.

Last edited by jimfa440; 01-10-2013 at 18:04..
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Old 01-10-2013, 22:19   #54
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Holy lordy, .22LR ammo is cheap! (wait, let me add some more !!!)

The recommended ammo from Advantage Arms for their .22 conversion kit is CCI Mini-Mag 40gr, at CheaperThanDirt, prices range from 7.32 to 8.00 for 100 rounds! That's freakin insane cheap! Everything is basically sold out there, but still, I could buy 1000 rounds for $80 + shipping?

The only thing is, the conversion kit is like $265 suggested, seems sorta steep (that's like 1/2 another G20). I understand they need to make a quality setup, plus make money...just have to think now if I want to go that route; between the G20, the .40 KKM conversion barrel, and now the .22 conversion kit, starting to get up there.

I guess all 3 of those are one time purchases though (for me at least), so not too hard to justify it...just got to mull it over.

Quick, someone talk me out of it! Haha! (heerrre Visa card, where did you run off too...?)

Chuck

Last edited by chucky2; 01-10-2013 at 22:20..
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Old 01-10-2013, 23:07   #55
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Get it Chuck! Then your G20 will run .22' 10, .40, 9mm, and 9x25. It's truly the Do-Everything gun! Experts say when the SHTF, a .22 is one of the handiest calibers to have on hand. 1000 rounds will do you well!
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Old 01-10-2013, 23:21   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chucky2 View Post
What would be better, getting the conversion for the G20, or, just buying a dedicated .22 practice gun?
It's a tough call.
For years, I had a Ruger Mark II with a 6" bull barrel. I brought that to the range along with whatever centerfire pistol I was shooting that day. When I felt like I was starting to flinch with a centerfire pistol, I would switch to the .22. When I felt I had cured the flinch, I'd switch back to centerfire.

If you had, a separate .22, it would be easier to switch back and forth. I recently got a 1911 .22 conversion slide, so I am starting to appreciate the advantages of practicing with the same pistol in .22.

.... coin toss .... if the conversion kit is reliable, you might go for it...... then again, a dedicated .22 might be able to digest economy .22 ammo
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Old 01-11-2013, 11:56   #57
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From what I can tell from the forum users here on my searching last night (All forums, Advantage AND Arms), all the comments were positive providing they used the recommended ammo (which I would do).

I like the idea of practicing using the same exact frame and sights as what would be the stock gun. I like even better practicing for so little cost!

Oh man, never going to stop hearing it from the parents...this is turning into an expensive hobby and I don't even have the G20 yet! :D

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Old 01-11-2013, 12:59   #58
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jimfa440 thanks for that report. I was thinking of posting a question about this but I was looking at this site:

http://www.22lrconversions.com/

They are selling theirs for $199 for the G19. I wonder which kit is superior
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Old 01-11-2013, 13:09   #59
chucky2
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Originally Posted by G29SFWTF View Post
jimfa440 thanks for that report. I was thinking of posting a question about this but I was looking at this site:

http://www.22lrconversions.com/

They are selling theirs for $199 for the G19. I wonder which kit is superior
I did no search on Ciener, I'll do that tonight and see what it turns up. One thing I like about this one would be 15 round mags instead of just 10 with the AA kit, along with the reduced price.

The AA homepage compares itself against Ciener, given they're competitors, not sure how much is worthwhile/trustable.

Here's the problem though: Unless the Ciener website has not been updated (a definite possibility), there is no mention of supporting 10mm or .45, while that is explicitly called out on the AA site, along with calling out for Gen4 owners a specific AA Gen4 kit. Contacting Ciener via the info on their website is a joke the way they have it setup, as there is no way to actually contact them except via mail????

Chuck
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Old 01-11-2013, 13:43   #60
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Yeah their site is pretty 1996 and the contact us link doesn't even work. I was primarily looking for the G19 conversion myself since I only have a G29 in 10mm.
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