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Old 02-19-2012, 11:44   #1
john31125
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hk...LEM vs da/sa for carry

i just got a hk45c considering converting it to lem iam a glock boy so figured it woud apply better. also iam a lefty so ied have to go to lem or put an ambi lever on it wanna know how other hk ppl carry theres thanks
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Old 02-19-2012, 13:12   #2
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LEM is HORRIBLE gummy system. It works and I am sure you would get used to it but if you had a choice you may want to try another configuration.
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Old 02-19-2012, 13:15   #3
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I shot the LEM V1 recently and I think I would prefer the traditional DA version.
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Old 02-19-2012, 14:00   #4
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If you don't have trouble with the DA-to-SA transition and will always remember to decock then stick with that. Myself, I prefer a consistent trigger due to mainly shooting Glocks and M&Ps.
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Old 02-19-2012, 14:11   #5
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I prefer the DA/SA system only due to the fact I actually want the harder pull for my first shot under pressure.

When my heart is racing I don't want any 2 lb. trigger.

I'm pretty well adapted to the hard pull to begin with.
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Old 02-19-2012, 18:41   #6
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If you are coming from a Glock and don't want to devote the time to learn to shoot DA/SA proficiently, I would suggest the LEM. I like DA/SA and it's the trigger configuration that I carry.

IMHO, the LEM system is the best DAO trigger on the market and is the only one that I would carry if I ever went back to a DAO trigger system.

I would recommend that you try a gun equipped with the LEM before you convert or purchase a gun in this configuration to see if you like it.

Good luck.
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Old 02-19-2012, 20:08   #7
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LEM stinks. It especially stinks in .45 ACP models like the HK45. Check out this guy struggling with it. Also notice the super weak ejection from H&K pistols and the uncontrollable muzzle rise from having a high bore axis. You will also note that the paddle style magazine release on H&K pistols totally confuses him during his attempts to reload.







LEM isn't a 2lb trigger. It's about two pounds during take up and then a break point about 6-7 pounds depending on model pistol, variant, spring combos, etc. (you can have lighter) Then it has a relatively short reset or you can choose to let it all the way out if you like.

Detailed Info: http://pistol-training.com/articles/hk-lem-vs-sig-dak

Obviously I am a LEM fan-boi. Most of my H&Ks have LEM. I like DA/SA too but LEM better.

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Last edited by HKLovingIT; 02-19-2012 at 21:55..
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Old 02-19-2012, 20:18   #8
sns3guppy
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The LEM is an excellent trigger system. I use it on a P2000SK I carry, and love it.

The V1 trigger is fine as trigger arrangements go, although the double action pull of any of the HK handguns leaves a lot to be desired. The single action pull is crisp and clean, but the first double action shot isn't very smooth. The handguns are reliable and still easy to shoot, but the trigger is poor. The LEM arrangements fixes that, although you do lose the flexibility that comes with the double action/single action arrangements, as well as a manual safety (if that's a consideration for you).

With my P2000SK, I like having no safety in the way or to handle under pressure, a light trigger pull, the short reset, and the easy shooting of the LEM trigger.

Put a few rounds downrange either way, you'll easily adapt. I've had the argument with some here before about HK trigger quality, and in my opinion it's very poor on other standard configurations like the V1 on my USP 45 Compact. The pistol is still a great pistol, and I haven't changed away from those trigger configurations despite their unevenness and grittiness. Without good reason, I don't vary much from factory configurations and whereas they're reliable, I'm not inclined to worry enough about the trigger to want to change it. Reliability is the single most important factor; everything else I can handle through training. One of these days, I'll send one off the Grey Guns to see what Bruce can do with them, but for now, they work as they come from the box.
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Old 02-20-2012, 07:31   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sns3guppy View Post
... The LEM arrangements fixes that, although you do lose the flexibility that comes with the double action/single action arrangements, as well as a manual safety (if that's a consideration for you)...
The P30LS is available in LEM with a safety. I have a V1 (LEM light) P30LS and it is my favorite handgun for tactical shooting and IDPA matches.
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Old 02-20-2012, 08:59   #10
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I simply do not like LEM. After years of shooting the Beretta 92fs and then SIG Sauer pistols, I am at home with traditional DA/SA. All my HKs are DA/SA. Well worth taking the time to master. Bill
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Old 02-20-2012, 12:48   #11
sns3guppy
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The P30LS is available in LEM with a safety. I have a V1 (LEM light) P30LS and it is my favorite handgun for tactical shooting and IDPA matches.
Interesting. I haven't seen those. I suppose there are applications, but for me part of the appeal of the LEM is no safety.
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Old 02-20-2012, 13:59   #12
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All LEM is is a lighter DA pull on every shot, 5.5 pounds on mine. On a traditional DA/SA the first pull is more like 10 pounds. If anyone can master the DA pull on a DA/SA it will be far easier to master the LEM. Without having to master the DA-to-SA transition or remembering to decock. It's an ideal cop trigger for hammer fired guns.

If I never shoot Glocks or M&Ps I might switch to DA/SA, but I do, so here I am.

Last edited by cowboy1964; 02-20-2012 at 14:06..
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Old 02-20-2012, 19:07   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HKLovingIT View Post
LEM stinks. It especially stinks in .45 ACP models like the HK45. Check out this guy struggling with it. Also notice the super weak ejection from H&K pistols and the uncontrollable muzzle rise from having a high bore axis. You will also note that the paddle style magazine release on H&K pistols totally confuses him during his attempts to reload.

Only think that scares me about that is how fast he reholsters in AIWB........ I'm in the camp of "no speed race to re holster".


I converted my USP to LEM and I love it.
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Old 02-20-2012, 19:19   #14
HKLovingIT
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Originally Posted by Spiffums View Post
Only think that scares me about that is how fast he reholsters in AIWB........ I'm in the camp of "no speed race to re holster".


I converted my USP to LEM and I love it.

Yep I agree on the slow to re-holster. You'll notice that Todd puts his thumb over the hammer each time before holstering though.
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Old 02-20-2012, 19:26   #15
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I love the LEM trigger.
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Old 02-20-2012, 19:48   #16
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Each shooter has preferences, and without trying each I would imagine it would be hard for you to make a decision. I have tried both, and each can have some advantages. I prefer my HK's (two P30's, an HK 45, and a 45c) have the DA/SA. I rarely use the double action, and prefer to carry and shoot from the cocked and locked mode, but like the option of having DA for some applications. Whatever you get - practice, practice, practice. Good luck.
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Old 03-07-2012, 21:43   #17
john31125
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i did a light lem i like it but its diffrent
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Old 03-07-2012, 21:47   #18
Javelin
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I prefer the DA/SA from Hk but for carry the LEM is also a very good option.

I guess I like both styles... but I don't care for Hk triggers much at all.
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Old 03-07-2012, 22:04   #19
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I'm a huge fan of the DA/SA trigger. I pretty much look at it like this. I buy the gun with a DA/SA trigger, it's going to stay that way. If I buy a gun with a DAO trigger, then it's going to stay that way.

There are many options out there, and I typically buy it as is because I want it that way.
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Old 03-08-2012, 02:04   #20
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Personally, I would go with the LEM. I am not a fan of DA/SA, and as a lefty, find my P2000 LEM an excellent choice for a lefty.
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