[Dragoon44]

A quick search says, probably not, since Zimmerman was the neighborhood watch and had never followed Trayvon before.

You can also add that Trayvon was not walking down a public street he was on private property.

Sanford PD released a notice to the press that they were barred from accessing the community by the HOA because it was private property. If the press ignored that they were subject to arrest for trespassing.

[kat1950]

You know there are some here on this board that will not let this thing die, you are as bad as the media, as for one that lives 8 miles from Sanford for over 53 years I am getting tired of this circus going on here, we live here in Florida, WE make our laws as Floridians, if the rest of you out of state people do not like our laws, too bad.

[OctoberRust]

Originally Posted by Bren

OK, I'll butt in. Michigan v. Chesternut, 486 U.S. 567 (1988) says the police can follow you in a public place, as do many other cases.

However, you have no constitutional protection against neighborhood watch following you, so it isn't even necessary to go that far and it isn't an issue for the Supreme Court. The only question is whether it violates a criminal law in Florida.

A quick search says, probably not, since Zimmerman was the neighborhood watch and had never followed Trayvon before.

STOP BUTTING IN BREN! You're making him look bad.

[merlynusn]

If anyone listened to the 911 tapes from the city's website. In Call 3 you can hear Zimmerman screaming for 45 seconds before the gunshot. I'm sure you all know that 45 seconds is an eternity when you're on the ground getting punched.

And for those who say Martin is the one screaming.... How many people who have been the subject on top in a ground and pound fight are screaming for help? I'd say zero. If they were on top, they'd punch once to disorient the guy on the ground, and then run away. Not scream for help for 45 seconds. It's obvious that Zimmerman is the one screaming for help.

[expatman]

merlynusn,
That would also fit in with what the two reported witnesses describe hearing and seeing.

The big question in this debate remains what led up to that point.

[msu_grad_121]

Originally Posted by expatman

The big question in this debate remains what led up to that point.

Well, yes and no. From what I've been taught (and I'm fairly sure it's pretty universal), as soon as Martin got on top of Zimmerman and began punching or bashing his head off the ground repeatedly, none of what happened before matters, at least with respect to Zimmerman shooting Martin. By mounting Zimmerman and continuously hitting him, Martin becomes the aggressor. If Zimmerman can or did articulate a reasonable fear of great bodily harm or death, he's fully justified in shooting Martin to stop the threat.

In the end, it sounds like Zimmerman was playing wannabe cop, and came upon some thug who decided to teach him a lesson, and had to shoot him to keep from having his head caved in. I could be wrong, but that's what it sounds like to me.

[expatman]

I agree but I was referenceing the people on this board still questioning the "lead up" events.

[wnr700]

My biggest fear has always been somebody like Zimmerman who thinks a CCW is a police badge.

This dope created the problem.

I'm not gonna allow anyone to stalk me.

There is a 50/50 chance he would have gotten a snout full of 9mm.

[whoflungdo]

Originally Posted by wnr700

My biggest fear has always been somebody like Zimmerman who thinks a CCW is a police badge.

This dope created the problem.

I'm not gonna allow anyone to stalk me.

There is a 50/50 chance he would have gotten a snout full of 9mm.

What proof do you have Zimmerman thinks a CCW is a police badge? It's already been stated numerous times in numerous threads Zimmerman was not stalking Martin...

But don't let facts get in the way of emotion..

[Ajon412]

http://www.officer.com/news/10683054...n=CPS120321002

Back in Sanford, city officials named a 23-year veteran of the police department as acting chief. The appointment of Capt. Darren Scott, who is African-American, came days after Chief Bill Lee, who is white, temporarily stepped down as the agency endured withering criticism over its handling of the case.

Yea, this will make all the difference in the world...

Also Monday, an attorney for Martin's mother confirmed that she filed trademark applications for two slogans containing her son's name: "Justice for Trayvon" and "I Am Trayvon." The applications said the trademarks could be used for such things as DVDs and CDs.

The trademark attorney, Kimra Major-Morris, said in an email that Fulton wants to protect intellectual property rights for "projects that will assist other families who experience similar tragedies."

Asked if Fulton had any profit motive, the attorney replied: "None."

Call me suspicious.....

[wnr700]

Originally Posted by whoflungdo

What proof do you have Zimmerman thinks a CCW is a police badge? It's already been stated numerous times in numerous threads Zimmerman was not stalking Martin...

But don't let facts get in the way of emotion..

So Martin just cold cocked him? Please...

Remove the details... If somebody white, black, asian, latino is following you... this would be a WWYD thread.

Latino from a distance, from closer, talking on a cell phone I will suspect you are setting me up to be mugged.

Stalk, watch, follow, approach... you choose.

Zimmerman had done his job and called 911... but self appointed Wannabe was playing Joe Friday and got his ass handed to him.

Not being emotional...

Two wrongs don't make a right, but Zimmerman caused this...

[whoflungdo]

Originally Posted by wnr700

So Martin just cold cocked him? Please...

Remove the details... If somebody white, black, asian, latino is following you... this would be a WWYD thread.

Latino from a distance, from closer, talking on a cell phone I will suspect you are setting me up to be mugged.

Stalk, watch, follow, approach... you choose.

Zimmerman had done his job and called 911... but self appointed Wannabe was playing Joe Friday and got his ass handed to him.

Not being emotional...

Two wrongs don't make a right, but Zimmerman caused this...

You still didn't answer my question about facts or proof you have of your claims.

And you have offered no evidence or proof of anything that would give Martin legal reason to attack Zimmerman.

ETA: and you cannot remove the details. They are what you base your actions on.

[glockaviator]

This case is ready made for a jury. The case hinges on how the fight got started. Martin following him and getting out of the car does put some liability in his corner. But then what happened?

Of course there could be a plea to a lesser charge.

It also seems ready made for both state AND Federal charges (which has always seemed like double jepordy to me, but....).

So if Florida doesnt get him, the Feds will.

Can I have the movie rights?

[RussP]

Originally Posted by glockaviator

Can I have the movie rights?

Hurry, Mom's atty will beat you to it...

[expatman]

Wasn't Zimmerman attacked and crying for help as he was on the phone with 911? If that is so then doesn't that sort of back up his story of being attacked by Martin? It also seems to be backed up by the two witnesses who saw Martin on top of Zimmerman as Zimmerman continued to call for help.

[owl6roll]

I don't know anything about it! I'm gonna wait and see what the Grand Jury has to say.

[whoflungdo]

Originally Posted by expatman

Wasn't Zimmerman attacked and crying for help as he was on the phone with 911? If that is so then doesn't that sort of back up his story of being attacked by Martin? It also seems to be backed up by the two witnesses who saw Martin on top of Zimmerman as Zimmerman continued to call for help.

I believe the cries for help were heard on the calls to 911 by others living in the area. I don't think Zimmerman ever made it to his phone to call 911 after he and Martin exchanged whatever words they exchanged.

[expatman]

I heard a 911 tape on TV where there was a scuffle and then some cries out for help. It was reported that the father said it was not his sons voice. This left me under the impression that it was Zimmerman being attacked while on the phone.

On another note here is another link from Yahoo regarding the situation.
http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/cutline/...180103647.html

[FL-obiwan]

I'm with OWL. We've got a news media that reports only part of the story. We have selective leaks. We've got parties involved with an agenda. We have reports of "someone" on top of the other. We've got 911 tapes of screaming.

Bottom line - I can guess what happened, but I don't KNOW and won't speculate. I'll wait for the Grand Jury.

[whoflungdo]

Originally Posted by expatman

I heard a 911 tape on TV where there was a scuffle and then some cries out for help. It was reported that the father said it was not his sons voice. This left me under the impression that it was Zimmerman being attacked while on the phone.

On another note here is another link from Yahoo regarding the situation.
http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/cutline/...180103647.html

I've listened to several 911 tapes of the altercation. I have not seen nor heard of one that came from Zimmerman's phone. It may be out there, but I haven't seen or heard it yet.

[expatman]

Fair enough. I am having a hard time searching for and listening to recorded tapes with the bandwidth I have here in the desert.

[whoflungdo]

Originally Posted by expatman

Fair enough. I am having a hard time searching for and listening to recorded tapes with the bandwidth I have here in the desert.

Stay safe and thank you for your service....

[Morris]

The more the profile of this so called "angel" develops, the more we (as LE and the general public) see that all is NOT as was initially reported.

Nothing says real concern about the actual (supposed) issue that ransacking a store in memory of this wayward youth. Or trying to trademark your son's name.

This is interesting: http://dailycaller.com/2012/03/26/th...#ixzz1qGztV3LT

Is this the person people like Sharpton and Jackson wish to wrap themselves around?

What does this mean for officers in Florida or for the citizens in general? Nothing. The family can try to do the deep pockets routine with the city but that won't hold traction as the investigation will likely be deemed appropriate.

I watch this with morbid curiosity because it happens time and time again in which the GDP somehow believes what they want, damn the actual reports, damn the actual investigation, damn the actual facts. As cops, our BS meters are pretty finely tuned and for many of us, they twigged almost from the start of this nonsense. The GDP response has been on par with the burning of Korans in Afghanistan (never mind the Korans were defaced by the prisoners and had coded messages in them being passed around between the prisoners . . . those pesky facts again).

Perhaps the only winners in this will be hoodie makers. And the race hustlers.

[vkscott]

Originally Posted by seanmac45

I'm probably going to be in the minority on the LE forum on this one;

I think that the shooter is the absolute aggressor in this case.

He had no right to be following anyone, and the whole incident stemmed from his actions.

Might be overly simplistic, but that is my opinion from what I have seen at this point, and yes, I am ignoring the blatant attempts at racially blowing it out of proportion. My litmus test is take the exact same fact pattern and make both participants white.

It stinks to high heavens both ways.

This argument has been beaten to death. Reports state (albeit it from Zimmerman) that Trayvon attacked him from behind. What law can you state that says Zimmerman had "no right to be following" Martin? Don't look because there isn't one. I do agree that the incident could (most likely) have been avoided if Zimmerman had not followed (not chased as some will lead you to believe) Trayvon.

[vkscott]

Originally Posted by WarCry

But at the point Zimmerman is on the ground getting pummeled (assuming the witness account is accurate), does that change anything?

Not sure what you mean? I believe the fact that he was on the bottom getting his nose broken and head pounded into the sidewalk justifies his actions. Many people believe (BELIEVE) that IF Zimmerman instigated the fight, that he waives his right to protect himself if he suddenly fears for his life. Example from another post, suppose you are carrying and at the gas station and an individual comes up to you and bumps into you. Then for some reason he says something or gives you a go to hell look and you punch him in the nose. Then he pulls a knife out of his pocket and comes towards you. Are you justified in pulling your HG out and defending your life? Of course you are. Not saying you won't be cited for starting the fight, but you will be protected under the law. A few posts above lists some (but not all) of the FLA statutes.