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Old 06-29-2012, 18:11   #21
Rancho_Nirvana
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Careful, he'll insist we are mad at him and that his work is done here.
Naw PW, a clod's work is never done...I think the evidence will bear me out here. ;-)

(Eeerr... Got me on the gnat thing tho...lol... frickin frackin...)
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Old 06-29-2012, 19:28   #22
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Coupla fags... TRY HARDER!
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Old 06-29-2012, 19:32   #23
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Naw PW, a clod's work is never done...I think the evidence will bear me out here. ;-)

(Eeerr... Got me on the gnat thing tho...lol... frickin frackin...)
I love how people using Firefox browsers become experts at spelling as well as grammar nazis.
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Old 06-29-2012, 21:13   #24
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Anyone who claims to be an architect and says that WTC 1&2 were controlled demolition is an idiot and should be kept to designing dog houses.

Ignoring the two large airplanes that hit the buildings, the fires, the point of failure (the point of impact on both buildings) is just dumb. The collapse looked NOTHING like a controlled demolition.

Thinking building 7 was controlled demolition? I can see why someone would think so but after checking the evidence you see again that t wasn't. Fire and a weak area in the structure is what brought the building down.

You don't have to melt steal. You just have to make it weak enough and it won't support that structure.

As for JFK. I live near Dallas and about 3 years ago I went to the 6th floor museum. You get to take a look from the window right next to the one Oswald took the shot from. It's a very easy shot. Very easy.
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Old 06-29-2012, 22:14   #25
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Anyone who claims to be an architect and says that WTC 1&2 were controlled demolition is an idiot and should be kept to designing dog houses.

Ignoring the two large airplanes that hit the buildings, the fires, the point of failure (the point of impact on both buildings) is just dumb. The collapse looked NOTHING like a controlled demolition.

Thinking building 7 was controlled demolition? I can see why someone would think so but after checking the evidence you see again that t wasn't. Fire and a weak area in the structure is what brought the building down.

You don't have to melt steal. You just have to make it weak enough and it won't support that structure.

As for JFK. I live near Dallas and about 3 years ago I went to the 6th floor museum. You get to take a look from the window right next to the one Oswald took the shot from. It's a very easy shot. Very easy.

Heat steel and it bends. no secret. heat steel with that much weight above it, you get a cascade failure.

Or you can belive that a group of exremist whack jobs were a key part of a complex scheme in which they had to hit exactly the right floors with hijacked airplanes to cover the detonation of all those explosives that nobody noticed being planted in the building

why don't you guys go back to eating the grapes off the wallpaper.
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Old 06-29-2012, 23:01   #26
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Careful, he'll insist we are mad at him and that his work is done here.
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Naw PW, a clod's work is never done...I think the evidence will bear me out here. ;-)

(Eeerr... Got me on the gnat thing tho...lol... frickin frackin...)
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Coupla fags... TRY HARDER!
Told ya so...

...lol!!!
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Old 06-29-2012, 23:35   #27
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Pragmatic, yes... Ignorant? Not only am I smarter than you, I've read more books, absorbed more philosophy, studied more discerning thought disciplines than you, I'm also taller, stronger, better looking, and have been with more women than you.

Further, I'm a better shot, have more friends, more guns, and drive a cooler/newer vehicle than you. I even make prettier babies than you can. But most importantly, I will never be even briefly considered as moonbat crazy as you. Know why? Because I'm not afraid to admit to how little I really know. ...
You forgot, "You stay drunker than me."
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... So let's dance, Thumbdick! Quote me and dissect my rhetoric.

No thanks, I don't dance with men.

"Thumbdick?" Wow, someone of your self described intellect could have come up with something better than that, OR, maybe you are projecting yet again.

BTW- I know you're good at pissing contest on the net, but do you care to address any of this thread's topics?
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Old 06-30-2012, 00:28   #28
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Anyone who claims to be an architect and says that WTC 1&2 were controlled demolition is an idiot and should be kept to designing dog houses. ...
Why? Oh wait, either you're an anti-conspiracy nut, or an architect? Which is it?
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... Ignoring the two large airplanes that hit the buildings, the fires, the point of failure (the point of impact on both buildings) is just dumb. The collapse looked NOTHING like a controlled demolition. ...
On the day of 9-11, dozens of people who were actually at ground zero and or who watched the buildings come down on monitors or TV described it exactly as if they were watching controlled demolitions.

IMO, with the evidence we have today, anyone who claims that 1, 2, & 7 WTC were not brought down by controlled demolitions doesn't know his/her head from a hole in the ground. Such a person ignores all the explosions captured on video, audio, and being described by eyewitnesses ON THE DAY of 9-11.

On 9-11 a videographer, located on a pier directly across the river in New Jersey, started recording video with audio of the event shortly after it began. His video captured numerous explosions before and just prior to the buildings coming down. This same video also has in the background the audio of
WINS (1010 AM), in New York City, radio's broadcast on the morning of 9-11. This broadcast has numerous callers and an eyewitness on a roof top not far from the towers. her and others go on air live and describe what they see/hear at ground zero on 9-11.

With all the evidence we have today, anyone arguing that fire alone brought down the three buildings has his/her head firmly planted in their own "donkey."

--------------------------------

the first of several large explosions can be heard starting around the 0:01:53 mark, then another couple at around the 0:02:58 mark, and then a longer series of explosions going off around the 0:03:39 mark in the video. The explosions continue sporadically throughout this video. Before its conclusion, the maker of the video does some technical, but simple calculations to make it easier to match the actual video with audio heard by eliminating the sound travel time delay.

Fire alone did NOT bring down those buildings.
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Old 06-30-2012, 02:06   #29
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No. It definitely wasn't fire alone. It was two airplanes flying at 450mph and weighing hundreds of tons that did.

Tell me this, if you plan to do a controlled demolition and blame the Muslims then why bother with airplanes. Just put explosives and blame them. You can always say they did something similar to what they did in '93.

I'm sure that to the people that were there it looked like controlled demo and every explosion sounded like a bomb.

And I'm the nut.
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Old 06-30-2012, 02:15   #30
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Heat steel and it bends. no secret. heat steel with that much weight above it, you get a cascade failure.

Or you can belive that a group of exremist whack jobs were a key part of a complex scheme in which they had to hit exactly the right floors with hijacked airplanes to cover the detonation of all those explosives that nobody noticed being planted in the building

why don't you guys go back to eating the grapes off the wallpaper.
Common. Those floors above the impact area weigh nothing.
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Old 06-30-2012, 10:53   #31
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Common. Those floors above the impact area weigh nothing.

You see there is the real flaw behind the whole "conspiracy" circle-jerk. A rational person not only has to buy their whole complex theory, that as far as I can see would have to date to the building of the WTC to keep all those explosives hidden, but the rational person has to SUSPEND all of thier knowledge of reality and WILLFULLY DISMISS it and SUSPEND any belief in physics, thermodynamics, combustion, controlled demolition, human nature, the laws of chance, and a host of other things to swallow the kool-aid.

You have to suspend the knowledge that if a group of passengers had done what the brave passengers on one of the other flights did, the whole plot would have fallen apart and been exposed.

You have to ignore the fact that the plot would have literally involved hundreds of people and they would ALL have to keep the secret.

You have to set aside your knowledge that those buildings were not designed to be landing places for commercial airliners.

You have to ignore any knowledge about liquids seeking the lowest point they can find undr the influence of gravity.

You have to forget what you know about the flammability of jet fuel.

If you have ever watched controlled demolitions, or if you have even seen on of the TV shows about it, you have to dismiss what you have seen about pre-weakening a structure and drilling and planting the explosives properly, because you have to then dismiss the chance that somebody might notice this being done in the WTC.

If you have ever watched steel being forged by a blacksmith you have to completely deny that heat softens it.

If you have ever seen the remains of an industrial fire or large structure fire you must erase all evidence, in your mind, of metal being twisted by the heat and weight.

If you have ever built a house of cards you must ignore the fact that a misplaced card in the middle will cause the whole structure to collapse.

You cannot think about the effects of a heavy airplane slamming horizontally into a building, "across it's grain" as it were, and the destabilizing effect that would have on the upper floors.

Do not for a moment think about all of that weight being thrust in to the building and the stresses that alone would cause.

You cannot think to yourself "Gee, if someone had something to gain by "faking" such a thing to blame terrorist, there would have been a lot easier and less complicated ways to do it that had fewer chances of anything going wrong"

Nope, you over the "fringe" lunatics, the problem with your whole conspiracy theory is that it, well I don't know how you will take this,

better sit down,


It simply does not hold up unless one was determined to believe in it before they ever looked at the facts.

Get the dude that explains the 'Aliens" on the History Channel to be the front man for your "campaign" it could only improve your credibility, at least among those around the edge that haven't yet joined you in the " Inner Circle of the Supreme Cuckoo"
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Old 06-30-2012, 11:04   #32
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...And I'm the nut.
This thread makes a differentiation.

There are ANTI-conspiracy nuts out there. Simply stated, when the evidence is so overwhelming that the planes alone did not bring down the three buildings in the fashion that they came down, and one still refuses to believe that more was afoot, that one is an ANTI-conspiracy nut, or kook, or whatever the current, ad hominem phrase de jour may be.
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No. It definitely wasn't fire alone. It was two airplanes flying at 450mph and weighing hundreds of tons that did. ...
The two buildings hit by planes were each built to withstand MULTIPLE IMPACTS of modern, commercial airplanes. Both buildings returned to their original positions shortly after the impacts.

Even so, knowing they were designed for such impacts, do you think the engineers didn't take into account the planes having fuel on board? C'mon!?!
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... Tell me this, if you plan to do a controlled demolition and blame the Muslims then why bother with airplanes. Just put explosives and blame them. You can always say they did something similar to what they did in '93. ...
I agree, you COULD do that, but since the truth came out about the first try in 1993, which the FBI supplied the actual explosives used in that attempt, how could the gubmint explain 19 terrorists having the unlimited access to plant all the charges to cause it to come down by implosion? No, it was an inside job with all the involved parties and actors making out like bandits.
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Old 06-30-2012, 11:31   #33
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Common. Those floors above the impact area weigh nothing.
Are you intimating that you support the "pancake theory?"

You may want to consider that 2-WTC's structure above the impact sight, due to the way the plane hit closer to the corner of the building itself, began to fall off of the remaining, uninvolved structure, which means the lower floors would have no "pile driver" to collapse the floors by "pancaking."

This knowledge of the 2-WTC collapse, coupled the observed debris piles of both 1 & 2 WTC on the morning of 09-12-2001, indicate that 1-WTC's floors, BELOW the impact sight, came down in the same fashion as 2-WTC's floors that were below the impact sight.

The way 2-WTC came down, considering that the top was falling off of the remaining structure at the time of collapse, completely, wholly, and totally destroys the pancake theory. The fact that both the debris piles were strikingly similar indicates that 1-WTC came down in the same manner 2-WTC. The two buildings were imploded and brought down on purpose.
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Old 06-30-2012, 11:38   #34
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You see there is the real flaw behind the whole "conspiracy" circle-jerk. A rational person not only has to buy their whole complex theory, that as far as I can see would have to date to the building of the WTC to keep all those explosives hidden, ...
You state, "...as far as I can see..."

Such personal perceptions or presuppositions may be steering you away from the truth. Open your mind to evidence you NEVER knew existed and was revealed on or after 9-11 and your perceptions may change.
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Old 06-30-2012, 11:43   #35
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... but the rational person has to SUSPEND all of thier knowledge of reality and WILLFULLY DISMISS it and SUSPEND any belief in physics, thermodynamics, combustion, controlled demolition, human nature, the laws of chance, and a host of other things to swallow the kool-aid. ...
Two points of fact:
  • 1) You are not a learned or trained professional in the areas of physics, thermodynamics, combustion, controlled demolition, human nature and or the laws of chance. In the interest of full disclosure neither am I. We can however make use of others' education or experience in forming our positions.


  • 2) There are thousands of learned and trained professionals in the areas of physics, thermodynamics, combustion and or controlled demolition that utilize both their individual and corporate expertise and knowledge base to state unequivocally that 1, 2, & 7 WTC buildings came down by way of controlled demolitions on 9-11.
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Last edited by Peace Warrior; 06-30-2012 at 11:47..
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Old 06-30-2012, 12:08   #36
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Two points of fact:
  • 1) You are not a learned or trained professional in the areas of physics, thermodynamics, combustion, controlled demolition, human nature and or the laws of chance. In the interest of full disclosure neither am I. We can however make use of others' education or experience in forming our positions.
  • How do you know who I am and what I know. Bad assumptions. It doesn't take a great knowledge of chemistry for the layman to know that jet fuel burns and when jet fuel burns it gets hot.


  • 2) There are thousands of learned and trained professionals in the areas of physics, thermodynamics, combustion and or controlled demolition that utilize both their individual and corporate expertise and knowledge base to state unequivocally that 1, 2, & 7 WTC buildings came down by way of controlled demolitions on 9-11.
And there are "experts" who say "we never landed on the moon" , 'Kennedy was shot from two different direction" Yadda-yadda. There are experts, whose conclusions jive with my experience, and they and I (in my laymans fashion) concluded that "what we saw was what we got".

"Suspend what your common sense tells you, forget your knowledge, BELIEVE BROTHERS, BELIEVE IN THE HOLY CONSPIRACY. YOUR FAITH ALONE IS PROOF. '

Get yourselves some snazzy robes if you want to do it right.
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Old 06-30-2012, 12:25   #37
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... You have to suspend the knowledge that if a group of passengers had done what the brave passengers on one of the other flights did, the whole plot would have fallen apart and been exposed. ...
Biased conjecture at best and a horribly weak straw man argument at worst.

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... You have to ignore the fact that the plot would have literally involved hundreds of people and they would ALL have to keep the secret. ...
On the contrary as one must embrace, not ignore, the fact that even thousands of people can keep a secret. Our nations' military is a prime example of people keeping secrets, which is especially true in the area of covert operations.

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... You have to set aside your knowledge that those buildings were not designed to be landing places for commercial airliners. ...
On the contrary as one must embrace, not ignore, the fact that the engineers purposely envisioned that a plane or planes may collide with the towers after they were built. Due to this foresight, they engineered each tower to be able to withstand MULTIPLE impacts from commercial airliners.

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... You have to ignore any knowledge about liquids seeking the lowest point they can find undr the influence of gravity.

You have to forget what you know about the flammability of jet fuel. ...
Do you honestly believe or think that the engineers would forget that huge commercial airliners also carry large amounts of fuel when they are flying back and forth from airports. I'm sure, back in the late 60's and early 70's, the ALL the engineers of 1 & 2 WTC understood that commercial airliners were not mere gliders.

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... If you have ever watched controlled demolitions, or if you have even seen on of the TV shows about it, you have to dismiss what you have seen about pre-weakening a structure and drilling and planting the explosives properly, because you have to then dismiss the chance that somebody might notice this being done in the WTC. ...
Or, you have to ignore all the evidence and eyewitnesses on the day of 9-11 and or that have come forth since 9-11, which both detailed exactly what could be the faculty for secretly undermining 1 & 2 WTC while at the same time planting charges prior to 9-11.

Evidence shows that more than ample opportunity could have been given to a team of people that had experience with controlled demolitions.

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... If you have ever watched steel being forged by a blacksmith you have to completely deny that heat softens it.

If you have ever seen the remains of an industrial fire or large structure fire you must erase all evidence, in your mind, of metal being twisted by the heat and weight. ...
You're mixing apples with oranges.

I'll be the first to support the fact that a single story, steel framed building's ROOF may fail or collapse due to a fire, I've seen it happen myself; however, this has to do with what the engineers, designing the roof, considered before constructing the roof itself.

OTOH, when designing a multistory, steel framed building, the design itself plans construction to be done is such a way so as to avoid a global or partial collapse due to fire(s). This inability to fail due to fire is purposely built into the building itself.

Now for oranges to oranges: 1 & 2 WTC buildings were BOTH built to withstand impacts by planes and collapse due to fire.
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Old 06-30-2012, 13:06   #38
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How do you know who I am and what I know. Bad assumptions. ...
Assumptions? Not my style as I honestly try NOT to assume anything. I also get accused of asking unnecessary questions because of my tendency not to assume anything.

So knowing, I inquired as to your knowledge of subject material and you told me, here, so regardless of whether or not you left some pertinent information out, I was not making any assumptions as to your expertise or lack thereof.

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...It doesn't take a great knowledge of chemistry for the layman to know that jet fuel burns and when jet fuel burns it gets hot. ...
I agree 100%. However, understanding the effects of that jet fuel fire's heat on the steel, holding up a skyscraper, does require more than just a simple layman's knowledge.

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... And there are "experts" who say "we never landed on the moon" ...
Mentioning off topic rhetoric. Very typical of the anti-conspiracy kook crowd.

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... 'Kennedy was shot from two different direction" Yadda-yadda. There are experts, whose conclusions jive with my experience, and they and I (in my laymans fashion) concluded that "what we saw was what we got".
Refusing to look at the evidence is another typical ideal that anti-conspiracy kooks vehemently hold.

We briefly touched on the JFK murder already. There were at least 5 shots made, this is proven conclusively by the evidence coupled with the warren commission report.

I reiterate, knowing that there were at least five shots on 11-22-1963, does this change your views?

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"Suspend what your common sense tells you, forget your knowledge, BELIEVE BROTHERS, BELIEVE IN THE HOLY CONSPIRACY. YOUR FAITH ALONE IS PROOF. '

Get yourselves some snazzy robes if you want to do it right.
More rhetoric.

Of course, I could play along by responding in like fashion.

Such as:
"Suspend what your common sense tells you, forget your knowledge, BELIEVE BROTHERS, BELIEVE THAT CONSPIRACIES NEVER OCCUR. YOUR SIMPLETON MINDS WILL THANK YOU IN THE END."
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Old 06-30-2012, 13:24   #39
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Conspiracy theorists are just like religious people in my mind. Use believe to support their claims instead of real evidence, logic and physiques.

As such, I treat you the same.
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Old 06-30-2012, 15:02   #40
Arquebus12
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Non-broccophobe
 
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Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Centerburg, OH
Posts: 16,429
Blog Entries: 4


Quote:
Originally Posted by Rancho_Nirvana View Post
Told ya so...

...lol!!!
Nawp. Saying "I told you so" don't make it so.

I will say this... The pair of you definitely found each other AND a home on the web tubes. Between one of you projecting his foibles while loudly yelling "I GOT THE ANSWERS! NOBODY FOOLED ME! JUST ASK ME!", while simultaneously being the equivalent of a psychiatry doctoral candidates wet dream, and the other who clearly never met Roy Rogers.

I'm going to give the two of you a little privacy.


Bye...
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Last edited by Arquebus12; 06-30-2012 at 15:16.. Reason: Syntax!
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