Store owner arrested for pulling gun on customer, threatening to shoot him

***TBO*** · 07-03-2012, 08:12

http://www.freep.com/article/2012070...g-to-shoot-him

smokin762 · 07-03-2012, 08:45

Every coin has two sides.

DScottHewitt · 07-03-2012, 09:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by TBO

http://www.freep.com/article/2012070...g-to-shoot-him

Quote:

The customer said Samona ordered him out, but he refused to leave

That's called "trespassing"

wrenrj1 · 07-03-2012, 10:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by DScottHewitt

That's called "trespassing"

Yes, but hardly the level where a weapon needs to be deployed. That just escalates the situation. Call the PD.

dosei · 07-03-2012, 10:07

Do stupid things...win stupid prizes.

When one decides to carry a gun, they often wonder where to put it. A good place to start is by first throwing away arrogance and ignorance. Once you stop carrying those around, it's easier to find a place for the gun.

DScottHewitt · 07-03-2012, 10:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by wrenrj1

Yes, but hardly the level where a weapon needs to be deployed. That just escalates the situation. Call the PD.

Or, the customer escalated the situation. No way of knowing from the outside how heated the "conversation" got before the store owner felt the need to draw. The customer might have been cool, calm, and collected. Or he might have been on the verge of taking physical action against the store owner.

And, one punch can be fatal.......

DScottHewitt · 07-03-2012, 10:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by dosei

Do stupid things...win stupid prizes.

When one decides to carry a gun, they often wonder where to put it. A good place to start is by first throwing away arrogance and ignorance. Once you stop carrying those around, it's easier to find a place for the gun.

By dscotthewitt at 2012-06-28

+87 on the "making room" part.

HandyMan Hugh · 07-03-2012, 10:17

Mr. Sanoma is not only rude, but he has way too short a fuse. He should not be in contact with the public and he should not have access to firearms. Fortunately, the law might well correct both problems soon. That's just my .50 worth.

DScottHewitt · 07-03-2012, 10:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by HandyMan Hugh

Mr. Sanoma is not only rude, but he has way too short a fuse. He should not be in contact with the public and he should not have access to firearms. Fortunately, the law mithe well correct both problems soon. That's just my .50 worth.

Except, the only side of the story we can get from the outside is coming from the other person in the argument.......

GlockFanBoy4Life · 07-03-2012, 11:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by DScottHewitt

By dscotthewitt at 2012-06-28

+87 on the "making room" part.

lmfao!

wrenrj1 · 07-03-2012, 18:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by DScottHewitt

Or, the customer escalated the situation. No way of knowing from the outside how heated the "conversation" got before the store owner felt the need to draw. The customer might have been cool, calm, and collected. Or he might have been on the verge of taking physical action against the store owner.

And, one punch can be fatal.......

I'll give you that, taking the article at face value, but the guy better have a good case that his life was threatened. Guess that'll come out in court.

Wren

lawson12 · 07-03-2012, 19:24

Whatever happened to the customer always being right?

ChuteTheMall · 07-03-2012, 19:35

Open cellphone would have prevented this.

magiaaron · 07-03-2012, 21:00

That's pretty interesting. I wonder what the full story is. As was said, if you take the article at face value, that store owner is probably in some deep manure. It does make me wonder, however, exactly what transpired.

The big thing to note is how important the concept of "complainant = victim" is. If the owner felt his life was threatened enough to pull a firearm, he should have called the police. Had he, I imagine that things could have turned out differently.

Misty02 · 07-04-2012, 06:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by DScottHewitt

That's called "trespassing"

Yeap. It would have gone quite differently if the store owner had been the one to call the police and have the customer arrested for trespassing since he acknowledges he was told to leave and refused to do so.

It appears people that carry are more in tune with trespassing laws than the general population. Most people we know, who are not into firearms, don’t seem to understand that one very well and believe they can stand there and refuse to leave until their problem is resolved.

We had that argument some time ago with a stubborn friend (birds of a feather and all that) who after a long dragged discussion agreed it would be trespassing for us because we were armed but not for him and no one but a police officer could force him to vacate an establishment open to the public. We kept trying to explain none of us could stay after being told to leave, the difference in charges could be trespass for him and possibly armed trespass for us, but the trespass part applied equally.

Next time we saw him I had printed material that demonstrated otherwise and he finally conceded with “I can’t believe I can be arrested because someone doesn’t resolve a problem they’re obligated to fix!” I’m stubborn too and wasn’t about to let it go so easily, plus, we didn’t want our friend arrested one day because he didn’t know when to give up, count his loses and address his problem another day or over the phone with supervisors.

.

jph02 · 07-04-2012, 07:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChuteTheMall

Open cellphone would have prevented this.

Actually, that was the whole problem! The customer couldn't figure out how to open his cellphone battery compartment.

Quote:

Originally Posted by magiaaron

...If the owner felt his life was threatened enough to pull a firearm, he should have called the police. Had he, I imagine that things could have turned out differently.

Bingo! At the very least, better to have trespass charges filed against a customer than to be charged with pulling a gun on your customers.

steveksux · 07-04-2012, 08:09

In this case, it seems like a right exercised is a right that's about to be lost...

Randy

Carrys · 07-04-2012, 10:29

IMO.............as the number of folks who have CCP's grows, the larger the number of knotheads will become. The folks who got their permits sooner rather than later IMO... are those who know how to use a gun......and when not to.

Those who are recent newcomers to the game may be among those not quite familiar with what to do with or how to use a gun. In other words.............knotheads.

Misty02 · 07-04-2012, 10:39

Some of us newcomers have gone out of our way to learn as quickly as humanly possible. I have a feeling you are likely to find knotheads in either sector. I don’t see the correlation between common sense and being a long term gun owner.

.

TDC20 · 07-04-2012, 10:42

I have to wonder what actually transpired, too. PO'd customer could have made up a story to get even with the rude store owner. There are 3 sides to the story. Places like this usually have security video. If it exists, that will probably be the deciding factor.

Contrary to popular belief, the customer isn't always right. If he is in this case, the store owner is in deep doo-doo.

uptomyneck · 07-04-2012, 10:59

I had a Palestinian convience store owner pull a pistol on me once while I was trying to remove our equipment that he refused to pay for. I stepped outside and called the local 5-0. They showed up and of course the Sandn&$$@# had stashed the gun and said he didn't do nuffin. I then was able to take my equipment and leave.

I didn't have a CHL back then.

Bruce M · 07-04-2012, 11:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by steveksux

In this case, it seems like a right exercised is a right that's about to be lost...

Randy

Excellently said, sir

Drain You · 07-04-2012, 11:55

Boy, I am thankful for this reminder. A reminder that not all conceal carriers are good guys, so I shouldn't feel at all put out when I'm disarmed on the side of the road for the entire world to see just because I was slightly speeding or driving in an area where black people mostly live.

Yes, so so thankful for these constant reminders in Carry Issues.

**RussP** · 07-04-2012, 12:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drain You

Boy, I am thankful for this reminder. A reminder that not all conceal carriers are good guys, so I shouldn't feel at all put out when I'm disarmed on the side of the road for the entire world to see just because I was slightly speeding or driving in an area where black people mostly live.

Yes, so so thankful for these constant reminders in Carry Issues.

Good!! Thank you for your support!!

JuneyBooney · 07-04-2012, 13:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by DScottHewitt

That's called "trespassing"

I wonder why the guy wanted the owner to open the battery up? That is rather bizarre.