GlockTalk.com
Home Forums Classifieds Blogs Today's Posts Search Social Groups



  
SIGN-UP
Notices

Glock Talk
Welcome To The Glock Talk Forums.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-15-2012, 20:56   #1
Metal Angel
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 790
Underwood Ammo 115 +P+ 1400fps!!!

Holy crap expansion!!! Nearly 9/10ths of an inch!


This video definitely settles it for me, high velocity light weight bullets are not the best option for SD. Sure, this bullet really expanded violently, but 9" penetration is worse than most .380ACPs.

I think 124 +p is kind of a sweet spot for 9mm- it expands well but still penetrates adequately, but I think I would never pick an SD round lighter and faster than that. This video makes me want to lean towards 147 standard pressure.
Metal Angel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2012, 21:40   #2
Berto
woo woo
 
Berto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: WA
Posts: 28,699


That's damn impressive velocity. Corbon used to load 9mm +P and .38sp +P+ 115gr to the same chrono'd velocities, they were also shallow penetrators and usually fragged.
Still, starfish expansion like that just looks fearsome.
__________________
...Then I found a place it's dark and it's rotted
it's a cool, sweet kinda-place where the copters won't spot it.
-T Hip
Berto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2012, 21:43   #3
Glock40man
Senior Member
 
Glock40man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 5,748
Wow, that is fast!
__________________
________________________
.... you put a whole new shine on the word overkill. "When you need it, and don't have it.... you sing a different tune."- M. Gross
Glock40man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2012, 22:05   #4
Foxtrotx1
Senior Member
 
Foxtrotx1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Scottsdale AZ
Posts: 4,025
Thats impressive for both the loading and the GD. Personally, I think the 124 grain +P offering from Underwood is the best.

BTW there is another vid on you tube showing this stuff going almost 1500 out of a 5 inch barrel.
__________________
Tin Foil Free Zone.

Eagle Scout.

Last edited by Foxtrotx1; 07-15-2012 at 22:08..
Foxtrotx1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2012, 22:21   #5
cowboy1964
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 14,408
Yeah, 9" penetration is no better than a .380. Doesn't matter how large it expands to if it doesn't go deep enough.

Not to mention the wear on your gun, the difference in feel between this and your practice ammo, etc, etc, etc.
cowboy1964 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2012, 22:22   #6
Metal Angel
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 790
Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxtrotx1 View Post
Thats impressive for both the loading and the GD. Personally, I think the 124 grain +P offering from Underwood is the best.

BTW there is another vid on you tube showing this stuff going almost 1500 out of a 5 inch barrel.
I believe it. Too lazy to watch the vid again to confirm, but his average was something like 1440 out of the Glock 19. I think everyone knows the Glock 19 produces high velocities for what it is, but I bet this load would haul ass out of a Glock 34.
Metal Angel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2012, 22:25   #7
Metal Angel
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 790
Quote:
Originally Posted by cowboy1964 View Post
Yeah, 9" penetration is no better than a .380. Doesn't matter how large it expands to if it doesn't go deep enough.

Not to mention the wear on your gun, the difference in feel between this and your practice ammo, etc, etc, etc.
Yup. These reasons make me think I should be running 147 standard pressure, just to be on the safe side. 124 +p has a good track record though, so that's what I'm running now.
Metal Angel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 06:04   #8
M&P15T
Beard One
 
M&P15T's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Arlington, VA.
Posts: 9,122
I would be very confident carrying that ammo. With it's tremendous wounding abilities, I wouldn't worry about it's shallow penetration.

That's my opinion, others may think differently about it. In fact, I carry Corbon's 115GR JHP, which is advertised to hit the same type of velocities.
__________________
Lucius Quinctius Cincinnatus (519 BC 430 BC) Power should only be given to those that want it least.
M&P15T is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 06:22   #9
SigFTW
Senior Member
 
SigFTW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: TX
Posts: 2,155
Very impressive SD round and a great price for 50 count.
__________________
Spent brass to me is like the ring to Gollum "We wants it, we needs it. Must have the precious"
SigFTW is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 08:33   #10
kjunderwood
Member
 
kjunderwood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Charleston, WV
Posts: 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metal Angel View Post
Yup. These reasons make me think I should be running 147 standard pressure, just to be on the safe side. 124 +p has a good track record though, so that's what I'm running now.
I absolutely know this round isn't for everyone. I try to offer a bit of everything to appeal to those who want expansion and other loads to those who prefer penetration. These are intended specifically for massive tissue damage without over penetration. This is 100% of energy on target that, for the average individual/ two-legged animal, will be right at the back or darn near exiting.

If you're looking for penetration, we offer regular +P 115gr or go up to our 124gr and you have +P or +P+ options.

In the next few weeks, we're also launching our 147gr Gold Dots, as well.
__________________
Underwood Ammo
Find us on Facebook
kjunderwood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 08:44   #11
WiskyT
Malcontent
 
WiskyT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 11,707
It's irresponsible to sell +P+ ammo in generic Starline brass. Once it gets passed around a bit, no one will have any idea what it is.
__________________
Drugs are bad because if you do drugs you're a hippie and hippies suck.
Eric Cartman


"If you kill enough of them, they stop fighting."-General Curtis E. LeMay
WiskyT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 09:05   #12
kjunderwood
Member
 
kjunderwood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Charleston, WV
Posts: 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT View Post
It's irresponsible to sell +P+ ammo in generic Starline brass. Once it gets passed around a bit, no one will have any idea what it is.
Starline's brass is the same, regardless of headstamp. At first, we didn't want to charge our customers more money just to have a custom headstamp read +p ...however, our last order placed we did bump up to the +p headstamp to alleviate any questions such as this.

Again, it is the exact same brass, just a change of headstamp.
__________________
Underwood Ammo
Find us on Facebook
kjunderwood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 09:50   #13
Foxtrotx1
Senior Member
 
Foxtrotx1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Scottsdale AZ
Posts: 4,025
Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT View Post
It's irresponsible to sell +P+ ammo in generic Starline brass. Once it gets passed around a bit, no one will have any idea what it is.
It's the responsibility of the person shooting a gun to know what they have loaded up.

Nanny state much?
__________________
Tin Foil Free Zone.

Eagle Scout.
Foxtrotx1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 09:55   #14
WiskyT
Malcontent
 
WiskyT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 11,707
Quote:
Originally Posted by kjunderwood View Post
Starline's brass is the same, regardless of headstamp. At first, we didn't want to charge our customers more money just to have a custom headstamp read +p ...however, our last order placed we did bump up to the +p headstamp to alleviate any questions such as this.

Again, it is the exact same brass, just a change of headstamp.
I understand that. But the ammo is not marked +P+. Once it's out of the box, there is no way to know what it is. If the ammo exceeds SAAMI pressure, it should be marked in some way. It doesn't even have a brand on it.

Why mark the new brass "+P" when it is +P+ ammo? Why not commission Starline to put your own headstamp on it with a +P+ designation, it's not that much money amortized over a large lot of ammo.
__________________
Drugs are bad because if you do drugs you're a hippie and hippies suck.
Eric Cartman


"If you kill enough of them, they stop fighting."-General Curtis E. LeMay
WiskyT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 09:59   #15
Foxtrotx1
Senior Member
 
Foxtrotx1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Scottsdale AZ
Posts: 4,025
Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT View Post
I understand that. But the ammo is not marked +P+. Once it's out of the box, there is no way to know what it is. If the ammo exceeds SAAMI pressure, it should be marked in some way. It doesn't even have a brand on it.

Why mark the new brass "+P" when it is +P+ ammo? Why not commission Starline to put your own headstamp on it with a +P+ designation, it's not that much money amortized over a large lot of ammo.
It's not Underwood's problem if it's removed from the box.
__________________
Tin Foil Free Zone.

Eagle Scout.
Foxtrotx1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 10:01   #16
WiskyT
Malcontent
 
WiskyT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 11,707
Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxtrotx1 View Post
It's the responsibility of the person shooting a gun to know what they have loaded up.

Nanny state much?
No. The industry standard, what we teach all shooters, even housewives and other casual shooters, is to make sure the markings on the ammunition match the markings on the gun and in the guns manual. This ammo exceeds industry pressures and is marked simply "9mm". It's not nanny sate, it's common sense. Maybe all electrical receptacles should be identical and anyone who doesn't test for voltage on every outlet deserves to have a fire or their equipment destroyed.
__________________
Drugs are bad because if you do drugs you're a hippie and hippies suck.
Eric Cartman


"If you kill enough of them, they stop fighting."-General Curtis E. LeMay
WiskyT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 10:03   #17
WiskyT
Malcontent
 
WiskyT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 11,707
Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxtrotx1 View Post
It's not Underwood's problem if it's removed from the box.
Well that's all that really matters isn't it?
__________________
Drugs are bad because if you do drugs you're a hippie and hippies suck.
Eric Cartman


"If you kill enough of them, they stop fighting."-General Curtis E. LeMay
WiskyT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 10:15   #18
kjunderwood
Member
 
kjunderwood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Charleston, WV
Posts: 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT View Post
I understand that. But the ammo is not marked +P+. Once it's out of the box, there is no way to know what it is. If the ammo exceeds SAAMI pressure, it should be marked in some way. It doesn't even have a brand on it.

Why mark the new brass "+P" when it is +P+ ammo? Why not commission Starline to put your own headstamp on it with a +P+ designation, it's not that much money amortized over a large lot of ammo.
We are in the process of working with Starline to get our own headstamp. That way, we can have it marked however we like. You're correct, it's not "that much money" to have it marked, however - it will increase the price of the rounds, which as a business I try to avoid. $750 per caliber spread out over 50 plus calibers to have our headstamp is quite the business expense that needs to be budgeted for. Easily over $40,000 with +P, +P+, and standard markings where such options are offered. We're working on it, and there's not much more that can be said. If we instituted the same mark-ups other ammo manufacturers do (which is double or more) we would have no problem doing it. I prefer to run my business differently and offer quality at a more affordable price.

I do understand your point, and am just letting you know it's in the works.
__________________
Underwood Ammo
Find us on Facebook
kjunderwood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 10:57   #19
WiskyT
Malcontent
 
WiskyT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 11,707
Quote:
Originally Posted by kjunderwood View Post
We are in the process of working with Starline to get our own headstamp. That way, we can have it marked however we like. You're correct, it's not "that much money" to have it marked, however - it will increase the price of the rounds, which as a business I try to avoid. $750 per caliber spread out over 50 plus calibers to have our headstamp is quite the business expense that needs to be budgeted for. Easily over $40,000 with +P, +P+, and standard markings where such options are offered. We're working on it, and there's not much more that can be said. If we instituted the same mark-ups other ammo manufacturers do (which is double or more) we would have no problem doing it. I prefer to run my business differently and offer quality at a more affordable price.

I do understand your point, and am just letting you know it's in the works.
I could see why you want to have your own company headstamp. But I don't think it's necessary from a safety point of view. I would consider doing the +P+ rounds first, then doing the less critical ones for branding purposes as your budget allows.

I do appreciate your responsiveness. Many small manufacturers, ammo and other gun stuff, come across as very defensive. I made a criticism of your product, and you responded in what I think is an appropriate way. Good luck with your venture.
__________________
Drugs are bad because if you do drugs you're a hippie and hippies suck.
Eric Cartman


"If you kill enough of them, they stop fighting."-General Curtis E. LeMay
WiskyT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 11:18   #20
glock_19guy1983
Senior Member
 
glock_19guy1983's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: dixie
Posts: 3,712
Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT View Post
I could see why you want to have your own company headstamp. But I don't think it's necessary from a safety point of view. I would consider doing the +P+ rounds first, then doing the less critical ones for branding purposes as your budget allows.

I do appreciate your responsiveness. Many small manufacturers, ammo and other gun stuff, come across as very defensive. I made a criticism of your product, and you responded in what I think is an appropriate way. Good luck with your venture.
Well most people tend to defend themselves when they are needlessly attacked. Its the consumers responsibility to know what they are putting in their gun. If an open class 9mm major shooter accidentally leaves a live round on the ground at the range and some fool picks it up and shoots it in their glock and blows it up, who's fault is it? the guy that dropped the bullet or the guy that shot a bullet of unknown origin?
__________________
"Our situation illustrates the American idea that governments rest on the consent of the governed, and that it is the right of the people to alter or abolish them whenever they become destructive of the ends for which they were established."
glock_19guy1983 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 11:36   #21
fnfalman
Chicks Dig It
 
fnfalman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: California & New Mexico, US
Posts: 54,774


I'm gonna have to try some of these Underwood ammo. The prices are quite reasonable.
__________________
Can you dig it?
fnfalman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 11:47   #22
WiskyT
Malcontent
 
WiskyT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 11,707
Quote:
Originally Posted by glock_19guy1983 View Post
Well most people tend to defend themselves when they are needlessly attacked. Its the consumers responsibility to know what they are putting in their gun. If an open class 9mm major shooter accidentally leaves a live round on the ground at the range and some fool picks it up and shoots it in their glock and blows it up, who's fault is it? the guy that dropped the bullet or the guy that shot a bullet of unknown origin?
Irrelevant, no one was attacked, needlessly or otherwise. Nice try at interjecting drama where none is needed.
__________________
Drugs are bad because if you do drugs you're a hippie and hippies suck.
Eric Cartman


"If you kill enough of them, they stop fighting."-General Curtis E. LeMay
WiskyT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 11:52   #23
Wishoot
Senior Member
 
Wishoot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Milwaukee
Posts: 517
Quote:
Originally Posted by fnfalman View Post
I'm gonna have to try some of these Underwood ammo. The prices are quite reasonable.
Underwood produces some excellent ammo. Bought several boxes of 44 mag and 357 mag a couple of weeks ago. It was delivered promptly and it's clean shooting, top notch stuff. I don't have a chrony , so I can't speak to velocities. Sure felt like it was moving like crazy out of my Winchester 94.

I'll be ordered more in .40 and 9mm very soon.
Wishoot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 11:57   #24
cowboywannabe
you savvy?
 
cowboywannabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: on a planet near you
Posts: 20,551
i have shot UW ammo that my friends and co-workers have in 10mm and 9mm. this is good stuff. quality, reliability, affordability are stardards with UW.

in a nut shell, you get more than you pay for with UW. you cant say that with any other ammo maker. you will pay others more without more performance, or pay others less with less performance.
__________________
with Sarah Jane, Leela, Romana, Nyssa, and Tegan.

Facts are no match against enthusiasm and ignorance...

Last edited by cowboywannabe; 07-16-2012 at 12:00..
cowboywannabe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 12:28   #25
cowboy1964
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 14,408
Quote:
Originally Posted by cowboywannabe View Post
in a nut shell, you get more than you pay for with UW. you cant say that with any other ammo maker. you will pay others more without more performance, or pay others less with less performance.
Sorry but I don't consider 9" of penetration "more performance".
cowboy1964 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 23:31.



Homepage
FAQ
Forums
Calendar
Advertise
Gallery
GT Wiki
GT Blogs
Social Groups
Classifieds


Users Currently Online: 838
250 Members
588 Guests

Most users ever online: 2,244
Nov 11, 2013 at 11:42