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Old 10-04-2012, 06:04   #26
shotgunred
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I go through several pounds of it a year. It is not that we all hate it. But it is not a good powder for new reloaders to cut their teeth on. The negatives noted above just out way the positives when there are more "forgiving" powders for a new reloader to start with.
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Old 10-04-2012, 07:11   #27
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One other plus for Titegroup is that it meters very consistently. Another "negative" is that it is temperature sensitive, although probably not more than most other powders. A "positive" is that it is less position sensitive than other powders in revolver cartridges.

I use it only in 9mm with 124gr and 147gr jacketed bullets.

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Old 10-04-2012, 09:28   #28
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One other plus for Titegroup is that it meters very consistently. Another "negative" is that it is temperature sensitive, although probably not more than most other powders. A "positive" is that it is less position sensitive than other powders in revolver cartridges.

I use it only in 9mm with 124gr and 147gr jacketed bullets.

Chris
So do all spherical or ball powders. As far as position sensative, it better not be, it occupies less volume per charge than almost any other powder. The ideal powder would be one that fills any case 3/4 full & give the desired vel w/o pushing top pressures. Obviously that does NOT exist, but it could be made. The powder manuf don't really care as long as everyone keeps buying what they are making.
If I ineherited 100# of TG, I would trade it off for 50# of just about anything else, well maybe ot Clays or BE either. Yes, I am a hater, then again, I don't make up bunnyfart loads often & that is what TG is really good for, minor loads in any service caliber.
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Old 10-04-2012, 10:21   #29
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One other plus for Titegroup is that it meters very consistently. Another "negative" is that it is temperature sensitive, although probably not more than most other powders...

I use it only in 9mm with 124gr and 147gr jacketed bullets.

Chris
VV N320 has many of the qualities (yes Fred, qualities... ) of TG and I often get on this forum and expound the virtues of N320 - and perhaps I've found yet another.

I took 30 identical (bunny fart, 147 gr) loads (my usual load) and loaded up 3 mags of 10 rounds each and shot them through a chrono. Before doing so however, I placed one mag on the dashboard of my truck in Florida's direct sun on a hot 92 degree day, one mag in a Ziploc, sitting on ice in a cooler, and the third I took into the air conditioned clubhouse for 2 hours and had lunch and conversation.

Two hours later I walked across the road to shoot and chrono these rounds. Although I didn't measure the surface temps of the rounds, I think the estimated temps are pretty close.

Average 10-rnd results at each cartridge temp w/ N320, 147 gr:

45 deg
Ave Vel 888
ES 48
SD 18

75 deg
Ave Vel 889
ES 54
SD 19

100+ deg
Ave Vel 885
ES 38
SD 12

A statistically insignificant difference from 45 to 100+ degrees with N320 and no positive temperature correlation.

Kitty

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Old 10-04-2012, 12:58   #30
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VV powders have a good rep for being very consistant. The downside is avaliablity & quite a cost diff. Curious Sardg, what positive qualities do you find in TG that are not found in several other powders? I have seen none, so the negs outway the maybe one pos of using TG, it's cost.
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Old 10-04-2012, 16:07   #31
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...Curious Sardg, what positive qualities do you find in TG that are not found in several other powders? I have seen none, so the negs outway the maybe one pos of using TG, it's cost.
Well, okay... maybe not the long list of qualities often associated with VV, but when I got my press and wanted to get started, TG was very available (at my club), reasonably priced, and I was able to find a lot of recipes from other competitors. TG is so common for competition that I actually found several fellow competitors who used the MG bullet and Starline brass that I eventually settled on.

I only ever used somewhat less than the first single pound I bought, before going with 320 - but I share the same OCD that I've seen Richard talk about, so never had a problem.
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Old 10-04-2012, 16:11   #32
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Not speaking for Kitty. But people load for different reasons. So called bunny fart loads for competition that do not have a PF. Iím in that category. Some people load in the middle or just above. And others load as close to or at max as they can. After doing a lot of testing with different powders using 135 and 147gr X-Treme plated bullets. TiteGroup and VV N320 for what I have been able to find works the best for my application. Accuracy, perceived recoil, and speed of the slide. With the same load that will work in 6 different Glocks.
Granted TiteGroup is probably not the best powder for a new reloader and probably some more experienced reloaders. But if you use it as intended light to light medium loads. It works great. If you get stupid with it or any other powder that it is not designed for and Blow up a gun itís the reloaders fault and not the powder. For me and others that I know, It has worked great. If VV N320 was not so hard to find and in stock and did not cost so much. I would probably going back to using it.
Also TiteGroup is the powder that is being used by me and the 4 other people I travel and shoot GSSF matches with. Only one has blown up a gun and it was not loaded with TiteGroup.
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Old 10-04-2012, 16:51   #33
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Not speaking for Kitty. But people load for different reasons. So called bunny fart loads for competition that do not have a PF. Iím in that category. Some people load in the middle or just above. And others load as close to or at max as they can...
Although GSSF doesn't have a PF requirement, I wanted one single (9 mil) load for GSSF, IDPA, and Steel. The 320 load I use has a PF of ~130 to satisfy IDPA requirements and is a wonderfully soft-shooter in every stock Glock I own. (which is all of Glock's 9 mils).

I also think that the top two powders for this requirement are TG and 320 - both rather high in the burn rate table, and both having a limited load range and both somewhat susceptible to user error.
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Old 10-04-2012, 17:55   #34
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N320 is the best powder I have found for 9x19 and 40 for my uses. However it is a mother to find sometimes and when you do it is friggin expensive.

So I will continue to use TG and I am happy with it. Between 20 and 30,000 rounds a year with.
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Old 10-04-2012, 21:44   #35
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I like it & have never had problems. You just have to measure & charge properly.
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Old 10-06-2012, 15:18   #36
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Oh I like that name " Grandmaster Gun Destroyer".

I use it for my 9mm a bunch, I like it
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Old 10-06-2012, 16:25   #37
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So I will continue to use TG and I am happy with it. Between 20 and 30,000 rounds a year with.
Surely that must mean 200-300 guns destroyed annually.

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Old 10-06-2012, 16:42   #38
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So I will continue to use TG and I am happy with it. Between 20 and 30,000 rounds a year with.
You only use one pound a year and you worry about cost and availability?
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Old 10-06-2012, 17:06   #39
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You only use one pound a year and you worry about cost and availability?
Wow, getting 20,000 to 30,000 rounds from a pound... Talk about bunny fart.

I use Titegroup and like it. You have to be careful but hell, it is available and ecnomical. I already keep a couple of handgun and rifle powders on hand and I'm not going to bulk buy so every combination has a 3/4 case filling volume. If you're not ready to be careful, I'd think you might be best off buying ammo.
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Old 10-06-2012, 18:59   #40
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I shoot lead and I like Red Dot for 44 spl & 38 spl because it has red dots in it and the name and label is cool. I like WST for 45acp, and WSF for 9mm, but they don't have red dots or a cool label. I tried Titegroup in the past but did not like it because of all the reasons stated in the previous posts.
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Old 10-07-2012, 09:04   #41
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Wow, getting 20,000 to 30,000 rounds from a pound... Talk about bunny fart.
When I switched to magnum primers I was able to get 30,000 rounds from a pound. 20,000 with standard primers.
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Old 10-07-2012, 09:17   #42
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For those that don't know, there are 7000 grains in a pound. I know everyone saying they load 30,000 round in a pound know that as well. Some I am sure do not.
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Old 10-07-2012, 09:23   #43
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For those that don't know, there are 7000 grains in a pound. I know everyone saying they load 30,000 round in a pound know that as well.
Dont go throwing facts into this.

I also found that if I chrono facing east my bullets are faster by 348 fps because they dont have to fight the rotation of the earth. Then I can back off the powder charge even more.
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Old 10-07-2012, 09:24   #44
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Surely that must mean 200-300 guns destroyed annually.
Yup. Glocks. So nobody cares.
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Old 10-07-2012, 09:38   #45
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Dont go throwing facts into this.

I also found that if I chrono facing east my bullets are faster by 348 fps because they dont have to fight the rotation of the earth. Then I can back off the powder charge even more.
Shooting east and downhill you can even back off even more.
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Old 10-07-2012, 09:40   #46
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Yup. Glocks. So nobody cares.


I care...
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Old 10-07-2012, 09:45   #47
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Shooting east and downhill you can even back off even more.
But if you're shooting east and downhill, the slide will have to cycle west and uphill requiring our loads to be much heavier to run the slide. Won't that cancel out any advantage of easterly-downhill shooting??
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Old 10-07-2012, 09:51   #48
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Yup. Glocks. So nobody cares.
Yep Idiotís that donít know how to reload keep gun manufactures in business. They screw up and of course it has to be the powder they used. Press they use. Or the unsupported chamber of a Glock or any other excuse they can come up with.
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Old 10-07-2012, 10:07   #49
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Shooting east and downhill you can even back off even more.
Absolutely! The coriolis effect will always add a little elevation when shooting east. So you have to remember to back off on the powder.

You probably need to add a little powder if you are shooting west.

Richard
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Old 10-07-2012, 14:26   #50
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When I switched to magnum primers I was able to get 30,000 rounds from a pound. 20,000 with standard primers.
Going from 0.23 grains to 0.35 grains is pretty ballsy. I hope you got that from a manual or worked up gradually. As we've been saying, Titegroup can be tricky, please be careful.
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