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Old 04-17-2013, 13:23   #1
x_out86
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Supreme Court Ruling on Warrantless Blood Draw

Just posted, was the SCOTUS decision on Missouri v. McNeely regarding warrantless blood draws as a routine/brightline procedure.

Here is the link:
http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions...-1425_cb8e.pdf

The nickle tour version for you guys who dont want to read it is:

Conducting a warrantless non-consentual blood draw as standard procedure with no other exigent circumstances other than the natural dissipation of a persons BAC, is a No No. They would not issue a brightline rule as if this is ever okay to do or not, but rather said its a case-by-case basis depending on the circumstances at hand.


Now I dont know about you guys, but in my area, getting a search warrant drafted and signed at bar time is usually a pain in the ass. We shall see what we end up doing and what our DA says. I know that we can get an expert to testify as to what the persons BAC was at the time of the offense with formulas, but talk about lots of extra court time.
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Last edited by x_out86; 04-17-2013 at 13:43..
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Old 04-17-2013, 13:59   #2
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So we are essentially seeing Schmerber overruled here.

Edit to add:

Not exactly, they're refusing to establish a brightline exigency rule, as discussed above. It's all really irrelevant in my state anyway, since a warrant is required for blood and is only obtained in serious PI or F collision cases.
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Old 04-17-2013, 14:06   #3
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I've always disagreed with strapping someone down and putting a needle in their arm without an accident involving serious injury or death.



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Old 04-17-2013, 14:16   #4
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I've been following this closely since it came out of my state and has directly affected how we do things over the last couple of years. I think it's incorrect, but oh well.

This, ladies and gentlemen, is why you better have a better answer than "I read it in a magazine" when asked on the stand why you did something. Bad cases make bad case law.
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Old 04-17-2013, 14:22   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaBigBR View Post
So we are essentially seeing Schmerber overruled here.

Edit to add:

Not exactly, they're refusing to establish a brightline exigency rule, as discussed above. It's all really irrelevant in my state anyway, since a warrant is required for blood and is only obtained in serious PI or F collision cases.
It is impossible to prosecute a DWI without breath or blood in my county and several other Missouri counties I am aware of. It's flat out BS that this is the case as the following is the exact wording of the statute:

"A person commits the crime of "driving while intoxicated" if he operates a motor vehicle while in an intoxicated or drugged condition."

A specific BAC is NOT required. Good luck telling your average "I'm a small county prosecutor because I couldn't cut it as a defense lawyer" prosecutor that, though. Level of observable and documented impairment, which IS part of the actual statute, is meaningless without a BAC.

I had a refusal this weekend. Took me two and a half hours to get a warrant. I blew half my shift on one misdemeanor arrest.
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Old 04-17-2013, 14:41   #6
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I've always disagreed with strapping someone down and putting a needle in their arm without an accident involving serious injury or death.



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I agree completely. Anymore, I could care less about a win in court. Its not rocket science for PC to make an arrest, and ask for a chemical test. According to my state law, if they refuse its at least a one year suspension.

If they want to spend mucho denaro to beat my case, I won't lose any sleep over it since I got them off the street, got their license, and they will spend more to avoid a conviction, then fines, court costs, insurance... If they refuse its less paperwork for me.
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Old 04-17-2013, 15:46   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rockapede
I had a refusal this weekend. Took me two and a half hours to get a warrant. I blew half my shift on one misdemeanor arrest.
Which goes to prove that despite the best efforts of MADD and all of the talking out of both sides of their mouths, the lawyers and the legislators, as well as the voters who elected them, don't give a crap about DUI. If we, as a society, did care about it, it would be a Felony.

Screw it. Charge 'em with Reckless Driving- Had Been Drinking, dump 'em at the jail, and get back on the road.
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Old 04-17-2013, 15:58   #8
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What about implied consent as condition of acquiring drivers license?

I thought you had to submit to breath test, or automatically lose license, at least in MI. Can't something similar be passed for blood draw, or is that too invasive? Wouldn't breath be sufficient?

Randy

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Old 04-17-2013, 16:14   #9
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In Missouri, implied consent already covers two types of tests. So I can ask for breath and blood, sure. If they refuse, though, the application for a warrant can be a pain at 0 drunk thirty.

Andy
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Old 04-17-2013, 16:33   #10
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In Missouri, implied consent already covers two types of tests. So I can ask for breath and blood, sure. If they refuse, though, the application for a warrant can be a pain at 0 drunk thirty.

Andy
Why bother with a warrant? You are charging the suspect with DWI. That charge is based on observations that they are impaired. BAC is irrelevant.

Just as if someone is driving under the influence of narcotics, and a DRE isn't available, and in the absence of other evidence.

BAC is additional evidence, but not required for a conviction.



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Old 04-17-2013, 16:50   #11
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All this does in my area is mandate warrants for every DUI. Breath tests went away years ago. The on call commissioners/judges are going to be very busy.
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Old 04-17-2013, 16:52   #12
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Quote:
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Why bother with a warrant? You are charging the suspect with DWI. That charge is based on observations that they are impaired. BAC is irrelevant.

Just as if someone is driving under the influence of narcotics, and a DRE isn't available, and in the absence of other evidence.

BAC is additional evidence, but not required for a conviction.



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His county may be similar to mine (see my post above). DWI - BAC = declined prosecution.
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Old 04-17-2013, 17:31   #13
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His county may be similar to mine (see my post above). DWI - BAC = declined prosecution.
That's incredibly stupid, and that's not the legal standard. What a shame.
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Old 04-17-2013, 17:31   #14
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All this does in my area is mandate warrants for every DUI. Breath tests went away years ago. The on call commissioners/judges are going to be very busy.
Why did they go away?
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Old 04-17-2013, 18:21   #15
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That's incredibly stupid, and that's not the legal standard. What a shame.
There's just too much money tied up in it for the courts to take a hard line.
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Old 04-17-2013, 19:21   #16
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Which goes to prove that despite the best efforts of MADD and all of the talking out of both sides of their mouths, the lawyers and the legislators, as well as the voters who elected them, don't give a crap about DUI. If we, as a society, did care about it, it would be a Felony.

Screw it. Charge 'em with Reckless Driving- Had Been Drinking, dump 'em at the jail, and get back on the road.
Agreed! The way DUI's are handled is little more than a money making scheme, IMO

Blueiron, no Intoximeter or similar?


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Old 04-17-2013, 19:35   #17
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Here's how screwed up DWI is in Missouri: first offense DWI is a class B misdemeanor (like speeding 20 mph over the limit). Second offense is a class A misdemeanor. Know what else is a class A misdemeanor? Littering.

We can't win for losing here. Still enjoy hooking drunks, though.
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Old 04-17-2013, 20:33   #18
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Quote:
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His county may be similar to mine (see my post above). DWI - BAC = dumb@$$ prosecutors.
Fixed it to be applicable to certain jurisdictions.
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Old 04-17-2013, 20:45   #19
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It all changes when a judge's spouse gets killed by a deuce . . .
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Old 04-17-2013, 20:49   #20
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In MN refusing a test on a 1st time DUI absent any other aggravating factors is a higher level of offense than the DUI itself.

We only force blood when our criminal vehicular operation laws are violated, e.g., impairment and injury to another in a crash.
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