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Old 11-09-2012, 23:13   #41
Restless28
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Originally Posted by arizona_andy View Post
I agree, this election was different than 2008. This time, we've had the chance to see him attempt to lead our nation for 4 years -- and boy has it been ugly. After watching his actions during his first term, it is simply unfathomable how any rational, responsible person could vote for him. Amazingly, he still won anyway.



You weren't the only one. Unfortunately, we underestimated how much this country has changed demographically, and how firmly the carelessness of the entitlement culture has been rooted in the younger generation.



If you want to get really angry, think about this -- people who can't speak English, and who have never worked a day in their life, were the ones who cast the deciding votes for who become YOUR leader, the leader of the most powerful nation on Earth. All they care about is their "free" government handouts, and having a "cool" President.

Obama and his policies are downright un-American, and so I am also genuinely angry at those who voted for him. I have posted this elsewhere, but I'll repeat it here: "The only excuse anyone has for voting for this scum is pure ignorance, fear of losing their government handouts, a double-digit IQ, or all of the above."

That is how I feel, and I will absolutely stick with that, even if it angers friends and family members. And it has. Thankfully, virtually everyone I know did vote for Romney -- even single women. Make no mistake about it, there are some rational people still left in this country. But they are a dying breed.



Yes. At least for the foreseeable future. Once cancer starts spreading, it's very hard to stop. We can't ignore the grim truth. Only a revolution of epic proportions would change that, but at this point it doesn't seem likely anytime soon.

I am very proud to have been able to cast a vote for Mitt Romney, and I will continue to vote for those who I believe to be the best leaders for our country. I hope you'll do the same.

In the end, responsibility is a concept that completely eludes these Obama supporters. Voting for Barack Hussein Obama is one of the most irresponsible things that any America could have possibly done.
You summed up my feelings excellently. Great post!
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Old 11-09-2012, 23:19   #42
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No, voting is not pointless. Part of our problem was not enough of us getting out to vote.

How we managed to lose against an incumbent with this record who should possibly be facing two impeachable offenses is beyond me.

My suggestions for next time, drop abortion and gay marriage, find candidates that are not multi-millionaires, no odd religions, get a minority on the ticket and support student aid.
You're basically saying that conservatives must abandon very important parts of their core values.

Well, guess what: The problem is NOT the values that conservatives stand for. The problem is an ignorant, irresponsible, and careless populace. Something needs to be done to get these people to see that they must start becoming more responsible if this nation is to have a future.
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Old 11-09-2012, 23:20   #43
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I really don't understand why people are so surprised Romney lost, he's a moron. "Oh why yes I do believe in Problem A." "What do you mean I said I believe in Problem A? That's total crap." "Well, yes, I did say I believe in Problem A, but now you're trying to take it out of context." "No, I never said I believed in Problem A, I said I believed in Problem B."

The guy had such a terrible time keeping his story straight that a cop would accuse him of being intoxicated if he gave that story during a traffic stop. He's just a horrible, horrible candidate that never should have won the Republican nomination. It's not at all a surprise that he lost. Quit trying to blame everybody else and step back and take a look at the candidate, and you'll realize why Obama won another four years.

Your disdain for women and letting other people make their own decisions also doesn't help.
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Old 11-09-2012, 23:25   #44
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Originally Posted by arizona_andy View Post
You're basically saying that conservatives must abandon very important parts of their core values.

Well, guess what: The problem is NOT the values that conservatives stand for. The problem is an ignorant, irresponsible, and careless populace. Something needs to be done to get these people to see that they must start becoming more responsible if this nation is to have a future.
Sorry but that ship has sailed. Theres no selling anti abortion anti gay or anti contraception to the bulk of the populace anymore and this election proves it. We need to give that up or we wont have a country at all and then what does all that **** matter anyway?
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Old 11-09-2012, 23:29   #45
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Originally Posted by arizona_andy View Post
You're basically saying that conservatives must abandon very important parts of their core values.

Well, guess what: The problem is NOT the values that conservatives stand for. The problem is an ignorant, irresponsible, and careless populace. Something needs to be done to get these people to see that they must start becoming more responsible if this nation is to have a future.
I think he's basically saying the conservatives need to abandon all the stupid **** they keep going on, and on, and on about, where their view is radically different from the general population, and start worrying about stuff that matters.

It's no surprise more republicans don't get elected when they keep spreading anti-women and anti-gay messages to all of the women and gay people of the country.

Want to get elected? Drop the crap nobody agrees with, and speak to the people, tell them what they want to hear, not what you want to hear, and then more republicans might get elected.

Keep telling all the gay people how evil and horrible they are, and they'll keep voting democrat.

Start accepting them, tell them they're good people and they should be able to be happy and live their life how they want to live it, and they might start voting for you.

Last edited by TK-421; 11-09-2012 at 23:29..
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Old 11-09-2012, 23:31   #46
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Sorry but that ship has sailed. Theres no selling anti abortion anti gay or anti contraception to the bulk of the populace anymore and this election proves it. We need to give that up or we wont have a country at all and then what does all that **** matter anyway?
Note that I did not say it was a solvable problem (the general ignorance of our population) -- I just said that this is what the *real* problem is.

Being forced to choose between failure or abandoning your beliefs is an extraordinarily difficult choice. It is something that many are unwilling to do... which is why I wish there was another way to attempt to educate these people. Stupid is as stupid does, though...
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Old 11-09-2012, 23:40   #47
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Originally Posted by arizona_andy View Post
Note that I did not say it was a solvable problem (the general ignorance of our population) -- I just said that this is what the *real* problem is.

Being forced to choose between failure or abandoning your beliefs is an extraordinarily difficult choice. It is something that many are unwilling to do... which is why I wish there was another way to attempt to educate these people. Stupid is as stupid does, though...
I couldnt agree more but I see no other way for us to even remain relevant.
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Old 11-09-2012, 23:44   #48
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November 6th, 2012, changed my view of this nation.

I genuinely believed that with all the various problems and economic despair of the last 4 years, Obama would lose in some form of a historic landslide (of at least modest proportions).

For the last 4 years, I closely followed politics. I tried to educate myself the best I reasonably could to the political affairs of our nation. I tuned into political TV and radio shows, and listened to pundits. I read various print and online media. I listened to pundits I disagreed with, to hear various sides of issues.

As the election drew nearer, I was dismayed at the trivial issues that gained such widespread attention. 'Evil' Bain Capital? Mitt Romney's tax returns, and his supposed tax evasion? Rights of women to free contraceptives from the government?? How 'evil' Mitt Romney was for being wealthy?

All of these things were either trivial, misleading, false, or counter to our traditional way of life.

What about the REAL issues? What about the monumental prospect of Obamacare? What about the staggering unemployment rates, with no prospects of improvement? What about the sluggish economy? What about our massive and increasing annual deficits and federal debt? What about our huge problem with illegal immigration, with no end in sight? What about massively rising fuel and energy costs? What about Obama's failure to respond to the increasingly dangerous Iran nuclear crisis in the middle east? What about his failure to respond to recent embassy attacks? What about... etc etc.

Nope. None of that really mattered, it seemed. Especially not in the blue states, where the situations were worst (ironically). A shocking amount of voters were easily swayed in the last few weeks of the election by 30 second TV "attack ads". A shocking number of people failed to even show up to vote. More shockingly, a shocking number of people were wildly still in support of Obama, especially in the states with the worst economic woes.

I can't wrap my mind around this. As best I can tell, most people in this country are now either:
  • Brainwashed by the liberal media/schools/government.
  • Single issue voters - voting for some form a handout for themselves.
  • Stupid.
  • Ignorant of real issues.
  • Blinded by race.
  • Too lazy to vote.


In any case, if the dire events of 2008-2012 were not enough to persuade the American public to remove a president like Obama from office, I have little faith in the future voting abilities of the American public.

I voted against Obama. Did it matter? Turns out it did not.

I am genuinely angry at people who voted for Obama under some false, emotional, or selfish pretense. I feel that they should have taken more time to educate themselves on the real issues, or at least voted on issues of true national importance.

To make matters worse for conservatives, the shifting demographics of our country will provide the democrats with an even larger voting base in the future (read: more illegal immigrants and offspring)


Although, one part of me never wants to surrender to liberalism.... another part of me questions whether voting even matters anymore. Is our country lost to liberalism?
Regardless of the conclusions you have drawn from your research, there are just as many people who disagree with you. Enough in fact that Obama was re-elected. Obviously, a great many people who voted for Obama did so having no real articulable reason for doing so. A lot of other people did so having plenty of reasons which were important to them-my mother being one of them.

My mother is a highly educated, highly intelligent person who never does anything without considerable research and thought. She is, and has always been Liberal. She can argue her beliefs quite well.

Ultimately the real issues as you say, are only real because you believe them to be. What is your reality is far different than someone else's and that's fine.

Most of the real issues-regardless of how one views them-are far to complex for 99.99% of the population to fathom so both sides attack each other on little issues more easily spoon fed to the American people.

Your question about whether voting is pointless is silly at best.

MF
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Old 11-09-2012, 23:45   #49
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Originally Posted by arizona_andy View Post
Being forced to choose between failure or abandoning your beliefs is an extraordinarily difficult choice. It is something that many are unwilling to do...
Which is why Republicans keep losing. Learn how to let the small fish go and worry about the big fish. Keep worrying about forcing your beliefs upon others, and you'll keep losing elections. Start worrying about what the voters want, and you might start winning, eventually.
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Old 11-09-2012, 23:46   #50
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I really don't understand why people are so surprised Romney lost, he's a moron. "Oh why yes I do believe in Problem A." "What do you mean I said I believe in Problem A? That's total crap." "Well, yes, I did say I believe in Problem A, but now you're trying to take it out of context." "No, I never said I believed in Problem A, I said I believed in Problem B."

The guy had such a terrible time keeping his story straight that a cop would accuse him of being intoxicated if he gave that story during a traffic stop. He's just a horrible, horrible candidate that never should have won the Republican nomination. It's not at all a surprise that he lost. Quit trying to blame everybody else and step back and take a look at the candidate, and you'll realize why Obama won another four years.

Your disdain for women and letting other people make their own decisions also doesn't help.
+1 I couldn't have said it better and people need to stop blaming Obama for the state that our country is in. George Bush is the reason for all of this. People need to wake up and face the cold hard facts and stop the hate, handout this handout that lol that's all I'm hearing. We do not need another greedy republican at the wheel causing us all this damage, look how hard it is to recover from it. Even 4 years wasn't enough time to repair the damage that BUSH caused and no man could've gotten us back to the state we was in back when Clinton was in office republican or democrat White or Black.

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Old 11-10-2012, 00:29   #51
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Originally Posted by Goldendog Redux View Post
Regardless of the conclusions you have drawn from your research, there are just as many people who disagree with you. Enough in fact that Obama was re-elected. Obviously, a great many people who voted for Obama did so having no real articulable reason for doing so. A lot of other people did so having plenty of reasons which were important to them-my mother being one of them.

My mother is a highly educated, highly intelligent person who never does anything without considerable research and thought. She is, and has always been Liberal. She can argue her beliefs quite well.

Ultimately the real issues as you say, are only real because you believe them to be. What is your reality is far different than someone else's and that's fine.

Most of the real issues-regardless of how one views them-are far to complex for 99.99% of the population to fathom so both sides attack each other on little issues more easily spoon fed to the American people.

Your question about whether voting is pointless is silly at best.

MF

First of all, I challenge your assertion that any truly, "highly intelligent" person can be liberal. Thus, if a person is liberal, he or she therefore cannot be "highly intelligent". Liberalism is the ideology of the stupid. It is also the ideology of the evil. Take your pick.

Second, the real issues are not too complex for "99.99% of the population to fathom". You're saying only 1 in 10,000 people has the capability to understand these things. I disagree. Most educated people should be able to understand fundamentally sound economic concepts, basic business concepts, and historical reviews of what has worked and what hasn't. This is what we are talking about, mostly. This isn't rocket science here.

Third, I say that reality is reality. Reality doesn't depend on who's context you're taking. It's like truth. People can perceive it in different ways, but there is one correct way.

Last edited by Landmonster; 11-10-2012 at 00:32..
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Old 11-10-2012, 00:35   #52
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+1 I couldn't have said it better and people need to stop blaming Obama for the state that our country is in. George Bush is the reason for all of this. People need to wake up and face the cold hard facts and stop the hate, handout this handout that lol that's all I'm hearing. We do not need another greedy republican at the wheel causing us all this damage, look how hard it is to recover from it. Even 4 years wasn't enough time to repair the damage that BUSH caused and no man could've gotten us back to the state we was in back when Clinton was in office republican or democrat White or Black.

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Well, we found one of the double-digit IQ people.
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Old 11-10-2012, 00:36   #53
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Originally Posted by Goldendog Redux View Post
Regardless of the conclusions you have drawn from your research, there are just as many people who disagree with you. Enough in fact that Obama was re-elected. Obviously, a great many people who voted for Obama did so having no real articulable reason for doing so. A lot of other people did so having plenty of reasons which were important to them-my mother being one of them.

My mother is a highly educated, highly intelligent person who never does anything without considerable research and thought. She is, and has always been Liberal. She can argue her beliefs quite well.

Ultimately the real issues as you say, are only real because you believe them to be. What is your reality is far different than someone else's and that's fine.

Most of the real issues-regardless of how one views them-are far to complex for 99.99% of the population to fathom so both sides attack each other on little issues more easily spoon fed to the American people.

Your question about whether voting is pointless is silly at best.

MF


No rational person who has put in "considerable research and thought" would ever support the socialist policies of the democrats, unless the ultimate goal is destroying the country.

Last edited by Andrewsky; 11-10-2012 at 00:38..
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Old 11-10-2012, 00:47   #54
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First of all, I challenge your assertion that any truly, "highly intelligent" person can be liberal. Thus, if a person is liberal, he or she therefore cannot be "highly intelligent". Liberalism is the ideology of the stupid. It is also the ideology of the evil. Take your pick.

Second, the real issues are not too complex for "99.99% of the population to fathom". You're saying only 1 in 10,000 people has the capability to understand these things. I disagree. Most educated people should be able to understand fundamentally sound economic concepts, basic business concepts, and historical reviews of what has worked and what hasn't. This is what we are talking about, mostly. This isn't rocket science here.

Third, I say that reality is reality. Reality doesn't depend on who's context you're taking. It's like truth. People can perceive it in different ways, but there is one correct way.
Again, your views are just that, your views. You are entitled to them. I am not even arguing whether you are right or wrong.

But like my opinions, no one really cares about yours.

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Old 11-10-2012, 00:50   #55
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Again, your views are just that, your views. You are entitled to them. I am not even arguing whether you are right or wrong.

But like my opinions, no one really cares about yours.

MF
Is this some kind of half-hearted existential nihilism? Why not go all the way and say nothing matters?
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Old 11-10-2012, 00:51   #56
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Well, we found one of the double-digit IQ people.
If that's the case I was smart enough to make myself rich so I'm pretty happy with my double digit IQ :D

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Old 11-10-2012, 06:57   #57
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Is this some kind of half-hearted existential nihilism? Why not go all the way and say nothing matters?
You are reading way too much into it.
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Old 11-10-2012, 07:06   #58
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Originally Posted by arizona_andy View Post
You're basically saying that conservatives must abandon very important parts of their core values.

Well, guess what: The problem is NOT the values that conservatives stand for. The problem is an ignorant, irresponsible, and careless populace. Something needs to be done to get these people to see that they must start becoming more responsible if this nation is to have a future.
Yeah, good luck with that. Most people are shortsighted fools who survive to adulthood solely because no predator has come along to remove them from the gene pool.

There was a reason why the right to vote was reserved to land owners when our country was founded. They had something to lose. Today, you have the 47% whose vote can be bought with the fruits of the labor of the 53%, though it seems since Tuesday that it is now a majority whose vote can be bought.
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Old 11-10-2012, 07:08   #59
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Voting is promoted as a symbol of "democracy", but it does little good when the candidates you have to choose from are 1) evil and 2) lesser of two evils, one election after another.
I was going to say this, but also...

Voting has been pointless for quite some time.
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Old 11-10-2012, 07:20   #60
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For anyone that said voting isn't pointless, you obviously don't have to vote in Florida. When was the count officially done here for this election? It is the same type of garbage here every time there is an election. The saddest part about that is we actually have enough electoral votes to really matter.

Aside from that, until Republican politicians learn to STFU about sensitive issues like rape, abortion, and a few other things, we are going to be screwed. How about keeping your beliefs to yourself when they are about issues sensitive enough to swing voters in large amounts?

The saying my parents used to tell me was "Children are better seen and not heard." Apparently so are certain republican politicians.
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