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Old 12-05-2012, 15:41   #21
series1811
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“The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. Leadership means that ‘the buck stops here.’ Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership . Americans deserve better. I therefore intend to oppose the effort to increase America’s debt limit."
Then Senator, Barack Obama March 16, 2006
Every Republican Congressman should get up and read this, one after the other, verbatim, and with proper attribution, at the next debate on raising the debt limit.
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Old 12-05-2012, 15:52   #22
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So is he a right wing fascist or a left wing communist? Which one? Come one, just pick one? Or does it depend on your own clueless wonderment of your leaders.
That is just regurgitating the revisionist re definitionofthe terms to set up a win/win for the liberal revisionists.

Fascism AND socialism AND Communism/Marxism are all on the same end of the spectrum and freedom is on the other. Facism is not on the Conservative end of the spectrum nor ist it a goal. It has been placed there, in discussion, falsely by revisionists in their "New View" so they can propose socialism as a lesser of two evils.
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Old 12-05-2012, 16:24   #23
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So is he a right wing fascist or a left wing communist? Which one? Come one, just pick one? Or does it depend on your own clueless wonderment of your leaders.
I don't know exactly what to call him, but Cloward and Piven approve of what he seems to be trying to do.
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Old 12-05-2012, 18:16   #24
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Fascism and communism are kissing cousins. It is a common misconception that the opposite of communism is fascism sine we equate fascism and naziism as one and the same, it is not. Naziism was a socialist movement, and socialism is the precursor to communism.

HWSNBN, uses fascist tactics to implement communist dogma. The socialist party has its blamegame in fine form. They are not responsible for anything bad, the other guy is. With the MSM on their side, it's a lock. The republican party and the republic is dying, if not dead.
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Old 12-05-2012, 20:05   #25
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Arrogant is too bland a word to describe Obama. He really is a walking, talking example of NPD.
True, so very true.
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Old 12-05-2012, 23:15   #26
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Up until yesterday I was believing along GOP party lines about how a tax increase on the upper 2% or "job creators" would negatively affect the economy. Then my daughter in law shared with me this video that explains that the middle class are the real job creators, not the rich. Anyone care to school me on why this is right or wrong, and if this is not the reason why Republicans are against raising taxes on the top 2%, then why?

http://www.athenstalks.com/rich-are-...ck-hanauer-ted
Its as simple as this: We are, or should be a capitalist system.

The top 2% are (obviously) good at aggregating CAPITAL on a scale that can fund investments in factories and storefronts that give people JOBS. They are also efficient investors and users of that capital, more so than the government that would poach that money to little effect…


The top 10% in this country provide 70% of the government's revenue. The rich ARE paying their fare share, and the share of quite a few people who are paying NOTHING. So, how much is enough, really?

If Obama got his way and raised the rates to where he wanted, the total extra take from the wealthiest folks would run the government for 8 days, and at the same time drain it from the private sector where it would actually do some good.

We do not have a revenue problem. We have a SPENDING problem. Reid pelosi and Obama squandered trillions, now they want to confiscate more to pay for their waste. Pound sand I say.
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Old 12-05-2012, 23:33   #27
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Here's some revisionist history for you: This week's 4 most ridiculous, head-scratching poll results : https://www.google.com/producer/editions/CAowsP0E/theweekcom/CAIiEEL07zrGT1VzJesjo0fgqNAqFAgEKg0IACoGCAowsP0EMIAlMJpk/this_weeks_4_most_ridiculous_head_scratc


Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire

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Old 12-05-2012, 23:43   #28
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Interesting, he claims to want to give Mortgage and student Loan debt relief by just cancelling them, and then says the way to handle debt is to just ignore it.

What a financial genius.
Can you say "dictator wannabe"?
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Old 12-05-2012, 23:53   #29
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So is he a right wing fascist or a left wing communist? Which one? Come one, just pick one? Or does it depend on your own clueless wonderment of your leaders.

Everything he's done can be found in Mao's Little Red Book.
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Old 12-06-2012, 00:12   #30
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Its as simple as this: We are, or should be a capitalist system.
Capitalism isn't a system. It is simply men engaging freely in commerce.
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Old 12-06-2012, 00:33   #31
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Originally Posted by Chesafreak View Post
Up until yesterday I was believing along GOP party lines about how a tax increase on the upper 2% or "job creators" would negatively affect the economy. Then my daughter in law shared with me this video that explains that the middle class are the real job creators, not the rich. Anyone care to school me on why this is right or wrong, and if this is not the reason why Republicans are against raising taxes on the top 2%, then why?

http://www.athenstalks.com/rich-are-...ck-hanauer-ted
Even though Nick Hanauer is spot on you won't get anywhere with that video. I've already tried. The denial is too strong here. His very good points will be ignored by most here in favor of the "the rich are job creators!" mantra that's been programmed into them.
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Old 12-06-2012, 01:28   #32
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he was re elected for four more years of digging the USA into a hole. Maybe some of you idiots that voted for him will vote against him when he wants dictatorship. But I doubt it!
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Old 12-06-2012, 01:39   #33
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Political Issues

Political Issues
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Old 12-06-2012, 01:46   #34
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Old 12-06-2012, 02:13   #35
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Budget conscience Conservative Republicans have been painted as greedy Scrooges, starving school children and throwing grandma over the cliff, for decades. For an entire generation of voters, the mantra has been repeated until it is accepted as truth. The blame for that lies with the voter who either doesn't want to inform themselves or have a political self interest in gaining from a governmental party that promises wealth redistribution.

Clinton's supposed "balanced budget" accomplishment (scoff) is treated as some political high water mark by the Left as masterfully reaching a balance between Liberalism and Conservationism. In truth, it was settled with scorn, blame, and disdain, presenting Conservatives as evil leftovers from the Reagan "age of greed".

Conservatism has not changed. We must, as a nation, live within our financial means. And we have not. To the tune of $16 Trillion dollars. But the Liberal propaganda of vilifying political opponents has been so simple and effective to the disinterested or edacious voting populous, that Liberals have reached their political zenith of power.

America deserves exactly what we majority vote for. Our currency will default and Democrats hope that happens sooner than later. Because, if the money power is defeated, all that is left is reliance on the State.

A Socialist's dream.
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Old 12-06-2012, 08:12   #36
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Even though Nick Hanauer is spot on you won't get anywhere with that video. I've already tried. The denial is too strong here. His very good points will be ignored by most here in favor of the "the rich are job creators!" mantra that's been programmed into them.
While the video has changed my mind about who the real job creators are, I don't favor raising taxes on anyone, even the top 2%. I am in favor of cutting spending and entitlements. Obama's plan is to spend more and cut less and focus the poor's anger on the rich.
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Old 12-06-2012, 08:16   #37
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Political Issues
Yep. If you don't believe this is how they think, ask Ed Asner.
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Old 12-06-2012, 08:49   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chesafreak View Post
Up until yesterday I was believing along GOP party lines about how a tax increase on the upper 2% or "job creators" would negatively affect the economy. Then my daughter in law shared with me this video that explains that the middle class are the real job creators, not the rich. Anyone care to school me on why this is right or wrong, and if this is not the reason why Republicans are against raising taxes on the top 2%, then why?

http://www.athenstalks.com/rich-are-...ck-hanauer-ted

He does have a valid point. However, it's over simplistic. Taxes are pass through. Raising the taxes on the business owners will only increase the cost of products. Increased cost on products without a corresponding increase in wages for everybody (and the tax cut isn't even close to compensating for this), means less products purchased. Less products purchased means less income, but more overhead for the business owner. More overhead for the business owner means less to put back into the company. Less to put back into the company means stagnant or slower growth, which means fewer jobs and or cutbacks on current employment.

It's a vicious cycle that will take months, maybe even years to fully realize. The initial effects will be more layoffs and higher unemployment. Sure the unemployed will be able to survive on unemployment insurance for a time, but look what's already happening now. The unemployment rate is only dropping because people are loosing the insurance. Quite a few have just given up and are simply existing. My mother-in-law is one of these.

Some have gone back to school to go into another career field, but the market is highly competitive. My company is an example of this. The last training class had 75 QUALIFIED applicants for 15 positions. Just to get to those 75 qualified, they had to weed out thousands.
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:54   #39
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I really hope no agreement is made and we go over the cliff.

That's one sure way to cut this out of control spending and I'm afraid that might be the only hope left.
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Old 12-06-2012, 15:25   #40
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Originally Posted by Chesafreak View Post
Up until yesterday I was believing along GOP party lines about how a tax increase on the upper 2% or "job creators" would negatively affect the economy. Then my daughter in law shared with me this video that explains that the middle class are the real job creators, not the rich. Anyone care to school me on why this is right or wrong, and if this is not the reason why Republicans are against raising taxes on the top 2%, then why?

http://www.athenstalks.com/rich-are-...ck-hanauer-ted
As soon as he said "Those who believe that the rich should not pay taxes.." I stopped listening.

The Ignorance of Nick Hanauer's TED Speech
http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworst...rs-ted-speech/

Last edited by czsmithGT; 12-06-2012 at 15:29..
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