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Old 12-07-2012, 10:42   #1
xmanhockey7
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Important Michigan Bill- SB 59

Currently Senate Bill 59 is waiting to go in front of a House committee. According to the head of the committee, Frank Foster, the bill will be put up for a vote this upcoming Tuesday. Those in Michigan are encouraged to contact their House reps, Frank Foster, and Governor Snyder to ask for their support of the bill. While this bill is not perfect it puts us in a much better spot than we are now. Here is a summary of what SB 59 will do. I did not create this list simply posting it here for everyone to read. I did make one change that is in red as they used the word "may" when the law says "shall".

ETA: This bill will allow concealed carry in current "Pistol Free Zones" with extra training.

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CPL Reform SB 59 (S-5)

Detailed Synopsis


Best Practice delivering Better Service to the Best-trained Gun Owners in the United States
  • SB 59 modernizes the CPL law and streamlines the process statewide.
  • CPL eligibility requirements are strengthened under SB 59, not weakened. Michigan will have the strongest training standard in the nation.
  • The legislation closes the loophole in state law that allows licensees to carry openly in “pistol free” zones, while preserving our constitutional right to keep and bear arms by allowing concealed carry with advanced training.
Best Practice
    • Concealed weapons licensing boards established in 1927 will be eliminated.
    • County sheriffs will assume the authority of the boards.
    • County clerks and the MSP will continue their current role in the process.
  1. The bill places accountability for fair licensing decisions with sheriffs, not added workload.
  • In fact, the need for four different agencies – including sheriffs – to staff gun board meetings or support panels will be eliminated, saving taxpayer dollars.
  1. Annual CPL reporting requirements for the MSP will be strengthened.
  • The MSP’s annual CPL report will be expanded to include the total number of licensees charged with a violation or crime and the number convicted.
  • Current reports do not account for one licensee with multiple charges or convictions.
  1. With this added accountability, the bill also provides clerks and sheriffs with explicit immunity to civil liability for the actions of an individual with a CPL.
  1. Sheriffs will continue to consult prosecutors, the MSP and local police on applications.
  1. Local fee revenue will be set aside in special funds to be used solely by clerks and sheriffs for improving their CPL process and for refunds.
  • Many counties currently absorb the dollars into their general fund.
  • These funds will also protect the county general fund from paying out refunds if a clerk or a sheriff fails to do their statutory job.
  1. The bill’s effective date of May 1, 2013, will provide the MSP, counties, instructors and applicants with adequate time to prepare for the changes.
  • MSP can now provide all forms, booklets and compilations to local agencies and counties in electronic format, saving taxpayer dollars.
  1. Personal references required of applicants will no longer include those related to them or members of the same household.
  1. Training certificates will have to include more information than ever before.
  • The additional information will enable county sheriffs and clerks to more easily verify the credentials of instructors, legitimacy of a course and quality of training.
  1. Retired law enforcement who served in good standing will no longer be required to get a printed letter verifying their retirement for the purposes of a CPL.
  • County sheriffs can easily verify their retirement through email or a phone call.
Better Service
  1. Modern technology now allows for nearly instantaneous background checks.
  • A license decision will have to be made within 45 days from the date of application for either initial or renewal licenses, which is a modest change from current statute.
  1. If a decision is not made or a license is not issued within 45 days, applicants will be entitled to a refund of the local portion of the CPL fee, depending on which office is responsible.
  • This measure will correct the failure of many county gun boards to comply with existing statutory requirements due to a lack of consequences.
  • The county clerk may shall issue a temporary license while the failure is addressed.
  1. A licensee will not be required to appear at a meeting with the sheriff in applying for their license unless the sheriff has a statutory reason to believe they’re not qualified.
  • A meeting will occur at a date and time agreeable to the applicant.
  • Many applicants have been delayed or denied a license because they couldn’t get the time off of work for a gun board hearing scheduled without their input.
  1. All applicants will be provided with a new “Rights and Responsibilities” booklet that explains the CPL process and their rights while applying for or holding a license.
  1. The bill includes a number of measures intended to end the practice in some counties of nickel-and-diming applicants with additional fees above what is authorized in state law.
  • Clerks and sheriffs will only charge the statutory $105 for a CPL, ending higher minimum fees in some areas. The license fee will get you a license.
  • Extra fees may be charged only for optional services, such as a county-provided photo or an optional hard plastic license.
  • Some county clerks provide only one format of license or mandate a county-provided photo, but then charge an additional fees for it.
  1. A number of changes in the bill will make it likely that most applicants will only need a day or two to apply for a license. The process in some counties can require 3-4 days off of work.
  • Clerks will mail approved licenses and expiration notices, eliminating additional trips and days off of work for qualified applicants and avoiding unintentional lapses.
  • Sheriffs and clerks may no longer mandate additional forms or documents of all applicants and only in individual cases if there is a clearly-stated statutory reason.
  1. An individual who held a CPL in good standing within the previous 5 years will be treated as a renewal, whether expired or not.
  • They have a clear track record of obeying the law and being a responsible gun owner.
  • They will still be required to review current CPL law and complete range time.
  1. License revocations and suspensions are clearly distinguished throughout the bill.
  1. Currently, suspensions even for minor offenses have become de facto revocations in most counties, requiring re-application and payment of the full CPL fee.
  • If a person is still eligible for a CPL after a suspension ends and their license hasn’t expired, they’ll get reinstated for a reasonable fee.
Best-Trained Gunowners in the Nation
  1. The training hours for a basic license will remain at 8 hours. The range round requirement for both initial and renewal licenses will be strengthened from 30 rounds to 98 rounds.52
  2. Training will have to be completed no more than 5 years before applying for a license or an exemption for the first time. There is presently no standard in state law.
  1. Michigan will have the strongest minimum training standard in the nation under statute, when combined with the advanced training provisions below.
Open Carry by CPL Licensees Addressed
  1. A licensee can carry openly in places like public schools and hospitals. They want to carry concealed.MSP Legal Update #86
  2. The bill prohibits open carry in these sensitive zones by all licensees, but it preserves our constitutional rights by permitting concealed carry with advanced training.
  3. Current licensees will pay a fee of no more than $20 to apply for an exemption to the zones and receive a replacement license indicating the exemption.
  4. The sheriff may delegate the authority to grant exemptions for current licensees to the county clerk, who can issue a replacement license on the spot.
The Advanced Training Course
  1. Current training required for a CPL was based on the NRA’s well-respected course, Personal ProtectionInside the Home (PPIH).
    The advanced training that will be required for an exemption to the zones is based on Phase 1 of the NRA’s advanced course, Personal Protection Outside the Home.
  2. PPOH focuses on advanced principles of the legal, defensive use of a pistol in public places with special focus on unique considerations in those places.
  3. Phase 1 provides at least 8 hours of course hours with 94 rounds fired on the range.
  4. CPL instructors will be granted an exemption to the zones because they have gone through highly-advanced instructor certification training in addition to the courses themselves.
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Old 12-07-2012, 17:55   #2
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Nice.


I wish there was more interest in the other bill to end purchase permit.
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Old 12-07-2012, 18:18   #3
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Nice.


I wish there was more interest in the other bill to end purchase permit.
According to MCRGO the NRA and Snyder have reached a "deal" on the matter.
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Old 12-07-2012, 18:47   #4
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We have that in Mississippi. It's called Enhanced carry, and it's totally worth it. You have so much more freedom to carry once you have it.
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Old 12-07-2012, 18:52   #5
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Hopefully this gets somewhere this time. There's been lots of bills to eliminate the no pistol zones, but never went anywhere. By trying something new, requiring extra training to do so, maybe this one has a chance.

Too bad this isn't as high a priority as making Michigan a rightto work state. That seems to have sailed through without any delay.

Randy
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Old 12-07-2012, 19:42   #6
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Wait a second....this part confused me....
  1. An individual who held a CPL in good standing within the previous 5 years will be treated as a renewal, whether expired or not.
  • They have a clear track record of obeying the law and being a responsible gun owner.
  • They will still be required to review current CPL law and complete range time.
I just renewed my CPL and got it in the mail yesterday. Does that mean if it passes I have to spend another 105.00+ to renew again and shell out for another ccw class?

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Old 12-07-2012, 21:33   #7
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Originally Posted by Dreamchaser View Post
Wait a second....this part confused me....
  1. An individual who held a CPL in good standing within the previous 5 years will be treated as a renewal, whether expired or not.
  • They have a clear track record of obeying the law and being a responsible gun owner.
  • They will still be required to review current CPL law and complete range time.
I just renewed my CPL and got it in the mail yesterday. Does that mean if it passes I have to spend another 105.00+ to renew again and shell out for another ccw class?

No. If you want to get exempt from PFZs you'll have to take the extra training class and pay $20.00 to the state to get your CPL updated. After that thought, you'll only need to pay the $105. Also people who are newly applying or renewing for a CPL and the exemption will only have the pay $105.
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Old 12-08-2012, 12:00   #8
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Man I hope this passes!!! Id be willing to not "open carry" in pfzs, if I could conceal anywhere I wanted to.
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Old 12-08-2012, 12:21   #9
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Also note that HB 5225 is up for vote. This bill will get rid of the pistol registration.
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Old 12-08-2012, 16:32   #10
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I hope that it advances to law.
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Old 12-08-2012, 19:23   #11
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Originally Posted by xmanhockey7 View Post
According to MCRGO the NRA and Snyder have reached a "deal" on the matter.
I get the NRA updates, but nothing about a deal. The last one I read on it said something about the State Police opposing it and Snyder dragging his feet.


I really hope this goes through.
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Old 12-09-2012, 00:22   #12
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I get the NRA updates, but nothing about a deal. The last one I read on it said something about the State Police opposing it and Snyder dragging his feet.


I really hope this goes through.
My guess is we will be able to get rid of registration but still require some sort of background check on private sales. But who knows maybe the NRA was able to convince Snyder to allow 5225 to pass as he was the one holding up the darn thing.
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Old 12-09-2012, 18:10   #13
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We can hope.
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Old 12-10-2012, 19:16   #14
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Bad update :(

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Friends:

I am sad to report that we hear today's meeting with Rick Snyder (The Governor) about SB 59 wasn't as fruitful as we desired. Rumor is that Snyder is making demands that are unreasonable that both MOC and its legislative allies find unacceptable. I hear Snyder would like to give public and private property that are currently “pistol free zones” (K-12 schools, day cares, churches, stadiums, movie theaters, bars, hospitals, college dorms/classrooms) the ability to post signs banning guns that have the force of trespass law.

Philosophically, we don't have a problem with private property owners being able to control their own private property, if the property is properly posted in a painfully visible manner at every public entrance. We DO have a problem with publicly owned/operated "stadium authorities", schools, and universities regulating firearms. These concepts spit in the face of preemption.

The Bill's Sponsor, Senator Mike Green has committed to not let this bill become a gun control bill. He would torpedo his own bill before that happens.

Sources tell me Senator Green and House Natural Resources Committee Chairman Frank Foster have had several conversations today and rumor is they've come to a compromise they can both agree on (I don't have the details at this time). It's unclear if the Governor will be willing to sign their package or if he'll let it slide into the pocket. I'm told by Representative Foster he expects to have SOMETHING heard in committee on Wednesday (click for meeting time/location). Whether that is something MOC and/or our allies will be able to get behind remains to be seen. More details won't be known by the leadership of MOC until late tomorrow.

There's a lot of unknowns right now. After House/Senate leadership have met with Snyder's office 3 times, there is still no solid deal. We may end up at a place where we have to give up on SB 59 this session because Snyder (517.373.3400) is simply asking for too much and will veto any bill that is worth passing. The shorts of it is, Snyder is the current road block in the process and doesn't appear to care too much about us (people who take responsibility for our own personal protection by carrying firearms).

If you're interested in participating in the process, come to the committee meeting on Wednesday. Other than that, "stay tuned" and I might have more information tomorrow evening.

Tirelessly fighting for liberty,

Phillip Hofmeister
President
Michigan Open Carry, Inc.
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Old 12-10-2012, 19:52   #15
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I really found the part where you can pay a extra $20 for a different permit that allow you to have more of your Constitutional rights.




You shouldn't have to pay extra to exercise all your Constitutional rights.
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Old 12-10-2012, 21:32   #16
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I really found the part where you can pay a extra $20 for a different permit that allow you to have more of your Constitutional rights.




You shouldn't have to pay extra to exercise all your Constitutional rights.
No you shouldn't, but we do, so I'll take an incremental step in the right direction. If we hold out in an "all or nothing" stance, we're going to get the "nothing."

It's not a different permit, it's a check box marked off on your regular permit, just like LEOs can get. And it's only an extra $20 if you need to get it added to an existing permit. The $20 is to pay for the "processing" for the re-issued permit. If you are renewing or getting it the first time, you don't need to pay the additional $20.

I'm disappointed that Snyder has changed the deal at the last minute. Hopefully the Gov won't veto the bill if it doesn't get these new provisions added. He doesn't have to sign it, if he just ignores it, it still becomes law.
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Old 12-10-2012, 22:21   #17
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I really found the part where you can pay a extra $20 for a different permit that allow you to have more of your Constitutional rights.




You shouldn't have to pay extra to exercise all your Constitutional rights.
$20 spread out over 5 years to get to exercise your rights, vs not being able to exercise your rights, for any amount of money?

Sounds like a bargain to me. Its a lot less objectionable than the changes Snyder is trying to add.

Randy

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Old 12-10-2012, 23:25   #18
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Sadly I think this bill may very well be dead. If we allow for signage to have "force of law" written into the bill we will see no gun signs everywhere! A perfect example is the state of Ohio. I'm betting a lot of places would have not put up no gun signs had it not been written into the concealed carry law. I also believe some put them up because they like the power of prohibiting guns.
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Old 12-10-2012, 23:44   #19
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Sadly I think this bill may very well be dead. If we allow for signage to have "force of law" written into the bill we will see no gun signs everywhere! A perfect example is the state of Ohio. I'm betting a lot of places would have not put up no gun signs had it not been written into the concealed carry law. I also believe some put them up because they like the power of prohibiting guns.
Ohio is not a perfect example, not in the least. Michigan is way more southern than Ohio. A better example would be Texas. Texas has a law where if the business has a very specific no gun sign, that follows the exact letter of the law, then it is illegal to carry concealed in that place. And you want to know something? It's pretty damn rare to see them, even in Austin, which is way more liberal than the rest of Texas.

And, if you see people putting up no gun signs, then just make sure to make it a point to go in there, unarmed, set a bunch of stuff on the counter, let the cashier ring it up, and then ask to see the manager. Point to the amount of money owed on the register, and tell them that is how much money they just lost because they have an anti-gun sign. Get a group of people to do that at different times of the day a few days of the week, and I'm sure the sign will eventually come down. Just make sure you ask to see the manager, the average employee won't care, but the manager sure as hell will. And if the manager sees it happen three times a day, four days of the week, they will either wisen up, or you'll just find somewhere else to shop.

The signs really aren't that big of a deal.
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Old 12-11-2012, 00:38   #20
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$20 over 5 years seems well worth it to me. Granted the extra training will probably cost an arm and a leg....



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