GlockTalk.com
Home Forums Classifieds Blogs Today's Posts Search Social Groups



  
SIGN-UP
Notices

Glock Talk
Welcome To The Glock Talk Forums.
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-02-2013, 20:41   #51
Cavalry Doc
Silver Membership
MAJ (USA Ret.)
 
Cavalry Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Republic of Texas
Posts: 41,260


Quote:
Originally Posted by Lotiki View Post
Somehow the original internet forum disrupting technique that was known as "trolling" became "troll".

The original meaning was a fishing reference, just dangle the lure out there and then sit back, wait for the bites and enjoy the mayhem created. Sometime along the way people forgot about the real trollers and decided to call people that are just stupid "trolls".

Don't bite the lure, just let the thread die.



Or if you aren't enjoying the discussion, you could just not post in the thread, or act like a stray dog pooping in your front yard. Your choice.
Cavalry Doc is offline  
Old 01-02-2013, 20:49   #52
Lotiki
All that is man
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Aurora, Co
Posts: 963
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
Or if you aren't enjoying the discussion, you could just not post in the thread, or act like a stray dog pooping in your front yard. Your choice.

You can make childish "poopy" references all you want, it doesn't change the fact that this is the umpteenth thread about the same exact subject by the same exact person who will, as he has countless times before, undoubtedly ignore scientific and proven facts presented by others, to present his own unproven opinion backed by cartoons and story-books before leaving entirely to start a new thread......

And all the time he rejoices about "poking us with a stick"........
Quote:
Originally Posted by JBnTX View Post
I know that!



Textbook definition of a troller.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=troller
Quote:
From the Urban Dictionary,
Troller

A troller, or troll (pronounced trall) is a person who purposely makes comments on controversial topics designed to piss people off. A troller is always watching his/her comment, so the best thing to do is ignore it. But if you want to make a trollers day, play along. I guarantee they'll be happy. Trollers are everywhere that people are seeing live feeds in forums to YouTube comments. Trolls are hard to upset, in fact, much of what you do to shame them, just makes them laugh louder. There are many kinds of trolls, from eleven year olds to hard core trollers. Depending on the content of the trollers comment, you can tell fairly easily.
Again, don't bite the lure people, just let the thread die.
__________________
The Bill of Rights (void where prohibited by law)

Last edited by Lotiki; 01-02-2013 at 21:01..
Lotiki is offline  
Old 01-02-2013, 22:43   #53
Geko45
CLM Number 135
Smartass Pilot
 
Geko45's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Short final
Posts: 13,392


Wow, just wow...

Religious Issues
__________________
CavDoc: "If you have to pretend that a person with a different opinion has an opinion other than his own in order to score points in an argument, you've forfeited any points that you pretended to have."
CavDoc: "You consider yourself as non-religious, and I consider you a religious zealot."

JBnTX: "Freedom of religion doesn't mean you can worship any God, anyway you see fit or not even worship any God if you so choose. [...] Christianity should be the only religion protected under the constitution, and congress shall make no law restricting its practice."
Geko45 is offline  
Old 01-03-2013, 00:10   #54
Animal Mother
Not Enough Gun
 
Animal Mother's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 14,848
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
Emotion gets the best of many people here. I understand.

Evolution is obviously possible, but so is intelligent design.

They are not mutually exclusive.
You've stated it incorrectly.

Evolution is obviously reality. It has been observed. Therefore it is science.

Intelligent design is possible, but neither the design nor the designer has been observed. Nor has any means of demonstrating the existence of either, other than arguments from incredulity and supernatural belief, been described. Therefore intelligent design is not science.
__________________
"Pain, or damage, don't end the world. Or despair. Or beatin's. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you've got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man, and give some back."
Animal Mother is offline  
Old 01-03-2013, 09:42   #55
Glock36shooter
Senior Member
 
Glock36shooter's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 3,159
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
Atheist tolerance on display?


Personally, I have a lot of friends, they are from many different persuasions.
My objection to him as a person has nothing to do with his religion. He's just a tool.

Two of my very best friends that I have known since the 1st grade and love like brothers are devout Christians. And we have spectacular debates. Debates bordering on The Heroic and Legendary.
Glock36shooter is offline  
Old 01-03-2013, 19:38   #56
juggy4711
Nimrod Son
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Galveston County, TX
Posts: 3,807
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
That, and he has yet to be impolite to me that I can remember. Can't say the same for the others...
Being polite to you is not a measure of whether one is incorrect or not. It's also not a measure of whether or not one is tolerant. Are you seriously going to argue that JB has tolerant beliefs of folks that do not agree with him on certain issues?

Evolution is not just a possibility. It is a scientific certitude. No level of politeness changes that. I will be the first to admit that I have little patience for fools, especially fools that deny scientific facts. But my impatience, intolerance if one prefers, only goes so far as the labeling of said fool a fool. JB has on numerous occasion advocated the government having the ability to enforce his intolerance on others via law.

I seriously respect you Doc for your service to our country and your continued Hippocratic endeavors, but your hard on against atheism is bordering on belligerent.
juggy4711 is offline  
Old 01-03-2013, 19:54   #57
Cavalry Doc
Silver Membership
MAJ (USA Ret.)
 
Cavalry Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Republic of Texas
Posts: 41,260


Quote:
Originally Posted by juggy4711 View Post
Being polite to you is not a measure of whether one is incorrect or not. It's also not a measure of whether or not one is tolerant. Are you seriously going to argue that JB has tolerant beliefs of folks that do not agree with him on certain issues?
Nope. JB and I may see eye to eye on RKBA and fiscal issues, but we differ on others. See post #43. He's never attacked me personally as far as I know, so I am respectful of his beliefs, and return the favor. We disagree politely.

I believe evolution is possible. Even likely. But I do also believe that evolution and intelligent design are not mutually exclusive.

Quote:

Evolution is not just a possibility. It is a scientific certitude. No level of politeness changes that. I will be the first to admit that I have little patience for fools, especially fools that deny scientific facts. But my impatience, intolerance if one prefers, only goes so far as the labeling of said fool a fool. JB has on numerous occasion advocated the government having the ability to enforce his intolerance on others via law.
I have argued for some issues that some may see as anti-do as-you-please issues. Yeah, I think that before a minor female has an abortion, the parents should have the responsibility of consenting to the procedure, no different than getting ears pierced or a tattoo. It should not be banned in any fashion, but also, those getting one should pay for it themselves, just like it was a butt lift when there was nothing wrong with their butt to begin with.



Quote:

I seriously respect you Doc for your service to our country and your continued Hippocratic endeavors, but your hard on against atheism is bordering on belligerent.
Seems to me, just coming here and expressing an agnostic viewpoint has invited attacks from the most militant atheists. Ironically, I haven't had any rude behavior from the Theists. Got a few invites to attend services and wishes that I would find god, but no fire and brimstone threats or name calling. A few atheists (long ago) PM'd me and told me they get where I am coming from. But most here think that Agnosticism is not a valid belief, or think that calling an agnostic names and being generally rude stops the debate.

I do try to be polite in most cases. I do occasionally fail in that and respond with the same amount of politeness I am presented with.

I am just here to offer a different perspective. When people ask questions about what I believe, and how I got there, I do try to answer them. That starts a debate......

It's cool though. We should all be able to learn from each other.
Cavalry Doc is offline  
Old 01-03-2013, 21:03   #58
juggy4711
Nimrod Son
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Galveston County, TX
Posts: 3,807
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
Nope. JB and I may see eye to eye on RKBA and fiscal issues, but we differ on others. See post #43. He's never attacked me personally as far as I know, so I am respectful of his beliefs, and return the favor. We disagree politely.

I believe evolution is possible. Even likely. But I do also believe that evolution and intelligent design are not mutually exclusive.

I have argued for some issues that some may see as anti-do as-you-please issues. Yeah, I think that before a minor female has an abortion, the parents should have the responsibility of consenting to the procedure, no different than getting ears pierced or a tattoo. It should not be banned in any fashion, but also, those getting one should pay for it themselves, just like it was a butt lift when there was nothing wrong with their butt to begin with.

Seems to me, just coming here and expressing an agnostic viewpoint has invited attacks from the most militant atheists. Ironically, I haven't had any rude behavior from the Theists. Got a few invites to attend services and wishes that I would find god, but no fire and brimstone threats or name calling. A few atheists (long ago) PM'd me and told me they get where I am coming from. But most here think that Agnosticism is not a valid belief, or think that calling an agnostic names and being generally rude stops the debate.

I do try to be polite in most cases. I do occasionally fail in that and respond with the same amount of politeness I am presented with.

I am just here to offer a different perspective. When people ask questions about what I believe, and how I got there, I do try to answer them. That starts a debate......

It's cool though. We should all be able to learn from each other.
I agree we should all be able to learn from each other. But yet again you state, this time as a belief, that evolution is possible, even likely. Is that a statement of faith? Is that a religious belief?

Doc, evolution is not just possible or likely. It is a fact. Once again I must point out that all of science as currently understood is interconnected in such a way that you could not argue on the internet where evolution false. Were it false there would be no internet.

I grasp that is not an easy concept to accept. But the truth is no evolution, no internet. No quantum no colors. No quarks no biology, no biology and every thing you've learned to save folks would not work. Science as we understand, observe and can replicate it must be correct. Incomplete sure but incorrect? No.

Militant atheists should not take issue with you for your agnosticism, but when you make statements like evolution is possible rather than a certitude, then yes they need to take you to task.

As far as do as you please...Come on the best example you can come up with is the actions of minors without parental consent? Find me an atheist that is conservative and has argued that minors should be able to do as they please, have others pay for it and I will dissent. Find me one that thinks calling you a name and being rude stops the debate and I'll ask who they think they are.

Find me one that did not at first argue from a position of science and again I'll call them out. The religious on the other hand have no foundation for such discussion. They result to insults and impoliteness because they have no scientific position. When one argues from the point of an ancient text being divine truth in contradiction to all of science a bit of name calling is to be expected.

If one insisted that blood humors were the cause of disease would you not scoff? There is far too much importance placed on politeness. When debating such important issues politeness should never be a concern. Veracity on the other hand should be of the utmost importance.

Feelly weelings have no place in such a conversation and only serve as a politically and cowardly distraction.
juggy4711 is offline  
Old 01-04-2013, 05:03   #59
Cavalry Doc
Silver Membership
MAJ (USA Ret.)
 
Cavalry Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Republic of Texas
Posts: 41,260


Quote:
Originally Posted by juggy4711 View Post
I agree we should all be able to learn from each other. But yet again you state, this time as a belief, that evolution is possible, even likely. Is that a statement of faith? Is that a religious belief?
It's just what I believe based on what I have learned. Adaptation has been observed, evolution is an extension of that. I'm not sure if we've observed an insect evolving into a mammal, or a reptile into a bird, or a dog into a bear.

Quote:
Doc, evolution is not just possible or likely. It is a fact. Once again I must point out that all of science as currently understood is interconnected in such a way that you could not argue on the internet where evolution false. Were it false there would be no internet.

I grasp that is not an easy concept to accept. But the truth is no evolution, no internet. No quantum no colors. No quarks no biology, no biology and every thing you've learned to save folks would not work. Science as we understand, observe and can replicate it must be correct. Incomplete sure but incorrect? No.
So we agree then, except for all the other lnowledge fields depending on evolution. Even if I was shocked to find out that some animals were created in their present form [very unlikely], biology would still be a science. My iPhone would still work. Regardless of how we got here, here we are.
Quote:
Militant atheists should not take issue with you for your agnosticism, but when you make statements like evolution is possible rather than a certitude, then yes they need to take you to task.
History is full of accepted scientific belief changing when new data emerges. That whole alchemy thing was a bit embarrassing, even though you can change one element to another. Evolution occurring? Impossible to be precise with numbers, but greater than 95% that evolution has been occurring. It's just not proof that deities don't exist.

Quote:
As far as do as you please...Come on the best example you can come up with is the actions of minors without parental consent? Find me an atheist that is conservative and has argued that minors should be able to do as they please, have others pay for it and I will dissent. Find me one that thinks calling you a name and being rude stops the debate and I'll ask who they think they are.

Find me one that did not at first argue from a position of science and again I'll call them out. The religious on the other hand have no foundation for such discussion. They result to insults and impoliteness because they have no scientific position. When one argues from the point of an ancient text being divine truth in contradiction to all of science a bit of name calling is to be expected.

If one insisted that blood humors were the cause of disease would you not scoff? There is far too much importance placed on politeness. When debating such important issues politeness should never be a concern. Veracity on the other hand should be of the utmost importance.
Ok, the abortion thing does not come up much. But you do know that we still use bloodletting as a treatment, right? Chemical, electrolyte and cellular imbalances of blood is still a big issue, they have been better described in the last 100 years though. Ask a hematologist. Politeness is almost always the best way to go. People respond better, learn better, and accept retraining better (usually) if you are respectful. Even in an emergency looking at the person and saying "I hear you, but we are still going to do this my way, and I'll explain why later. "
Then seek him out and explain it later. I have had young medics come up with ideas that were better than whats in the books, and I took their advice and used it.

Quote:
Feelly weelings have no place in such a conversation and only serve as a politically and cowardly distraction.
Rude behavior is evidence of discomfort and a refuge of men that are not secure in their own skin and afraid of something. It's an attempt to stifle debate, usually by someone that's keeping score, NOT in search of knowledge.

Last edited by Cavalry Doc; 01-04-2013 at 05:04..
Cavalry Doc is offline  
Old 01-04-2013, 05:36   #60
Glock36shooter
Senior Member
 
Glock36shooter's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 3,159
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
Rude behavior is evidence of discomfort and a refuge of men that are not secure in their own skin and afraid of something. It's an attempt to stifle debate, usually by someone that's keeping score, NOT in search of knowledge.
Not really. Most often it's an emotional response to annoying people. You're deluding yourself if you think people are rude to you because you've made them insecure or afraid. You're just an annoying individual. Like a yappy dog that won't shut up. There's no point to its yapping... it isn't making any sense... it's just grating on the nerves.
Glock36shooter is offline  
Old 01-04-2013, 06:23   #61
Cavalry Doc
Silver Membership
MAJ (USA Ret.)
 
Cavalry Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Republic of Texas
Posts: 41,260


Quote:
Originally Posted by Glock36shooter View Post
Not really. Most often it's an emotional response to annoying people. You're deluding yourself if you think people are rude to you because you've made them insecure or afraid. You're just an annoying individual. Like a yappy dog that won't shut up. There's no point to its yapping... it isn't making any sense... it's just grating on the nerves.
More projection? I annoy you because I won't submit to your belief system, and all your juvenile insults haven't shut me up.

Ask anyone that is not emotionally invested in this issue, they will tell you that you have proven my point if you are unable to intimidate them. You're really not a very good bully, not for a lack of trying though.

Something else gleaned from your PUBLIC profile:

Quote:
Glock36shooter has not made any friends yet
Maybe there's a reason for that.

Last edited by Cavalry Doc; 01-04-2013 at 07:01..
Cavalry Doc is offline  
Old 01-04-2013, 13:23   #62
Glock36shooter
Senior Member
 
Glock36shooter's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 3,159
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
I annoy you because I won't submit to your belief system, and all your juvenile insults haven't shut me up.
I have no belief system troll. And I don't want you to shut up as long you say something with some substance. But unfortunately you haven't. Pretty much you're just annoying. All bluster and no substance.

Quote:
Ask anyone that is not emotionally invested in this issue, they will tell you that you have proven my point if you are unable to intimidate them.
Do you honestly think I give a flying rats ass what your religious buddies here think? They're not exactly prone to rational or intelligent thinking anyway. I'm not trying to intimidate anyone. Do you feel intimidated? If not why would you suggest that's my aim. I just keep waiting for you to say something that means anything.

Quote:
You're really not a very good bully
Because I'm not trying to be one maybe?

Quote:
Something else gleaned from your PUBLIC profile:
Maybe there's a reason for that.
There is... I have no interest in making internet friends. I have real life friends. There you go being a creepy stalker again.

Last edited by Glock36shooter; 01-04-2013 at 13:25..
Glock36shooter is offline  
Old 01-04-2013, 16:28   #63
Cavalry Doc
Silver Membership
MAJ (USA Ret.)
 
Cavalry Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Republic of Texas
Posts: 41,260


Quote:
Originally Posted by Glock36shooter View Post
I have no belief system troll. And I don't want you to shut up as long you say something with some substance. But unfortunately you haven't. Pretty much you're just annoying. All bluster and no substance.



Do you honestly think I give a flying rats ass what your religious buddies here think? They're not exactly prone to rational or intelligent thinking anyway. I'm not trying to intimidate anyone. Do you feel intimidated? If not why would you suggest that's my aim. I just keep waiting for you to say something that means anything.



Because I'm not trying to be one maybe?



There is... I have no interest in making internet friends. I have real life friends. There you go being a creepy stalker again.

I meant for you to ask some of your friends in real life. Most people reading our interactions would agree that you basically have made up your mind, you don't want to put up any of the evidence and facts you bragged about before, and for some strange odd reason, you feel that insults and bad manners is a way to accomplish something online. Is it a catharsis exercise or something? Asfar as online friends go, I suspect you are a lot more polite in real life. Either that, or you have a hard time holding down a job.

If you think looking at your public profile is creepy, you have a very low tolerance, and a high paranoia factor.

Look on the bright side, you may be correct that none of the gods humans have describe exist. So far, it looks like you've made that decision based on faith though.

Last edited by Cavalry Doc; 01-04-2013 at 16:29..
Cavalry Doc is offline  
Old 01-04-2013, 20:53   #64
Animal Mother
Not Enough Gun
 
Animal Mother's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 14,848
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
It's just what I believe based on what I have learned. Adaptation has been observed, evolution is an extension of that.
Evolution has also been observed, a number of specific instances have been cited in this forum.
Quote:
I'm not sure if we've observed an insect evolving into a mammal, or a reptile into a bird, or a dog into a bear.
You're correct, we haven't observed any evolutionary changes that occur over hundreds of thousands or millions of years in the last century. On the other hand, we can see them in the fossil record and in the genetic structure of living animals.
Quote:
So we agree then, except for all the other lnowledge fields depending on evolution. Even if I was shocked to find out that some animals were created in their present form [very unlikely], biology would still be a science. My iPhone would still work.
Your iPhone works based on very specific laws of physics. If evolution is shown to be false, our understanding of biology would also be falsified. This would imply errors in our understanding of not only biological but molecular process, which would in turn affect our understanding of physics. Your iPhone might still work, but clearly our understanding of how it works would be incorrect.
Quote:
Regardless of how we got here, here we are.
This in no way implies we should give equal, or even any, weight to every possible explanation of how we got to where we are.
Quote:
History is full of accepted scientific belief changing when new data emerges.
That's the beauty of science.
Quote:
That whole alchemy thing was a bit embarrassing, even though you can change one element to another. Evolution occurring? Impossible to be precise with numbers, but greater than 95% that evolution has been occurring. It's just not proof that deities don't exist.
And no one claims that it is, except creationists. The reality of evolution and the rejection of deities are two separate topics that happen to both be held as valid by the same people in many instances. Correlation does not imply causation.
__________________
"Pain, or damage, don't end the world. Or despair. Or beatin's. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you've got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man, and give some back."
Animal Mother is offline  
Old 01-04-2013, 21:03   #65
Cavalry Doc
Silver Membership
MAJ (USA Ret.)
 
Cavalry Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Republic of Texas
Posts: 41,260


Quote:
Originally Posted by Animal Mother View Post
Evolution has also been observed, a number of specific instances have been cited in this forum.
You're correct, we haven't observed any evolutionary changes that occur over hundreds of thousands or millions of years in the last century. On the other hand, we can see them in the fossil record and in the genetic structure of living animals.
Doing pretty good so far. Just a different opinion.

Quote:
Your iPhone works based on very specific laws of physics. If evolution is shown to be false, our understanding of biology would also be falsified. This would imply errors in our understanding of not only biological but molecular process, which would in turn affect our understanding of physics. Your iPhone might still work, but clearly our understanding of how it works would be incorrect.
That's where you went off the deep end again. We are where we are, regardless of how we arrived at our location.

Quote:
This in no way implies we should give equal, or even any, weight to every possible explanation of how we got to where we are.
That's the beauty of science.
An ethical scientist would not discount any possibilities prior to investigation and experimentation. But those guys understand and believe in science.

Quote:
And no one claims that it is, except creationists. The reality of evolution and the rejection of deities are two separate topics that happen to both be held as valid by the same people in many instances. Correlation does not imply causation.
Are you sure only creationists claim a certain reality?
Don't atheists claim that all that is happened without the influence of deity...... without proof.......based on faith.....held to with ardor.......

Cavalry Doc is offline  
Old 01-04-2013, 21:12   #66
Animal Mother
Not Enough Gun
 
Animal Mother's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 14,848
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
Doing pretty good so far. Just a different opinion.
What is it that you believe is a matter of opinion?
Quote:
That's where you went off the deep end again. We are where we are, regardless of how we arrived at our location.
Your position is that it doesn't matter if your iPhone works based on understood interactions of energy and materials or through the actions of magical gnomes, just so long as it works?
Quote:
An ethical scientist would not discount any possibilities prior to investigation and experimentation. But those guys understand and believe in science.
Again, that's nonsensical. You don't assign equal likelihood to every possible explanation prior to every experiment or observation, to do so would mean repeating the whole of the history of science each time you perform any investigation.
Quote:
Are you sure only creationists claim a certain reality?
Yes.
Quote:
Don't atheists claim that all that is happened without the influence of deity...... without proof.......based on faith.....held to with ardor.......
No. As has been demonstrated a number of times, atheists are willing to accept the existence of a deity, if evidence of one (or many for that matter) is produced. That hasn't been done, nor has the necessity of a deity been demonstrated for any observed phenomena.
__________________
"Pain, or damage, don't end the world. Or despair. Or beatin's. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you've got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man, and give some back."
Animal Mother is offline  
Old 01-05-2013, 03:43   #67
juggy4711
Nimrod Son
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Galveston County, TX
Posts: 3,807
AM covered this but to reiterate and restate the point...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
It's just what I believe based on what I have learned. Adaptation has been observed, evolution is an extension of that. I'm not sure if we've observed an insect evolving into a mammal, or a reptile into a bird, or a dog into a bear.

That statement is proof you have no real understanding of evolution.

So we agree then, except for all the other knowledge fields depending on evolution. Even if I was shocked to find out that some animals were created in their present form [very unlikely], biology would still be a science. My iPhone would still work. Regardless of how we got here, here we are.

The other knowledge fields are not dependent on evolution. Evolution is dependent on them. Again a demonstration that you do not understand science from a quantum level up to the "macro". And no, chances are that your iPhone would not work. The physics that make/allow your iPhone to work are the very basis for biology.

History is full of accepted scientific belief changing when new data emerges. That whole alchemy thing was a bit embarrassing, even though you can change one element to another. Evolution occurring? Impossible to be precise with numbers, but greater than 95% that evolution has been occurring. It's just not proof that deities don't exist.

I could not care less if any deity or deities exist. Whether they do has no bearing on science. And as you may have forgotten I am not an atheist, but rather a non-religious believer.

Ok, the abortion thing does not come up much. But you do know that we still use bloodletting as a treatment, right? Chemical, electrolyte and cellular imbalances of blood is still a big issue, they have been better described in the last 100 years though. Ask a hematologist...

I worked in the medical field for 9 years and my mother has been a nurse for almost 30. I am quite familiar with modern medicine. I wasn't questioning hematology, bloodletting or leech therapy. I referenced blood humors. Your understanding of science and evolution as presented is in the blood humor range. They have been better described in the last 100 years though. ...
juggy4711 is offline  
Old 01-05-2013, 04:08   #68
juggy4711
Nimrod Son
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Galveston County, TX
Posts: 3,807
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
...That's where you went off the deep end again. We are where we are, regardless of how we arrived at our location.

No. We are where we are precisely because of "how" we arrived at our location.

An ethical scientist would not discount any possibilities prior to investigation and experimentation. But those guys understand and believe in science.

They sure do. And none of their investigations or experiments lend credibility to any religious view point.

Are you sure only creationists claim a certain reality?
Don't atheists claim that all that is happened without the influence of deity...... without proof.......based on faith.....held to with ardor.......

For the love of God give it up Doc. Atheism is not a religion. Doesn't matter if proof is absent, how much faith they have in said belief or with what ardor they hold to it. There is no reason to label atheism a religion unless one thinks they can somehow score points in a debate on the subject.

Religion
noun...the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods:

Atheists neither believe in nor worship a superhuman controlling power/s. Your definition is like insisting the use of the word "cool" means anything folks deem such must have a relative low temperature.

Last edited by juggy4711; 01-05-2013 at 04:10..
juggy4711 is offline  
Old 01-05-2013, 06:40   #69
Cavalry Doc
Silver Membership
MAJ (USA Ret.)
 
Cavalry Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Republic of Texas
Posts: 41,260


Quote:
Originally Posted by juggy4711 View Post
For the love of God give it up Doc. Atheism is not a religion. Doesn't matter if proof is absent, how much faith they have in said belief or with what ardor they hold to it. There is no reason to label atheism a religion unless one thinks they can somehow score points in a debate on the subject.

Religion
noun...the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods:

Atheists neither believe in nor worship a superhuman controlling power/s. Your definition is like insisting the use of the word "cool" means anything folks deem such must have a relative low temperature.
Well, it is, but that's a minority opinion for sure, don't worry about it.

Maybe I'm looking at this in a different way. If you wake up in a strange land, first thing to do is find a secure location, and figure out where you are. If its a bad place, figure out where you need to go quickly. When you have time, then you fugues out how you got to the strange land. Right now, we have a lot of ideas about how we got here, some are conflicting. Evolution is a plausible theory, no doubt.

And if random combinations of atoms, molecules and proteins reacting led to all life on earth, there is nothing precise about it. It's just a very rare series of events, relatively speaking.
Cavalry Doc is offline  
Old 01-05-2013, 11:57   #70
Glock36shooter
Senior Member
 
Glock36shooter's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 3,159
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
Well, it is, but that's a minority opinion for sure, don't worry about it.
No it isn't. It's held by two different types of people. 1. Very uneducated people that simply don't understand what they're talking about. 2. Antagonistic trolls that are just trying to get a rise out of people.

We know which one you are. If someone could prove a particular God existed... I'd immediate convert. If I saw Christ coming down from the clouds with trumpets blaring and angels singing... I'd instantly convert. But to date no proof has been discovered. Nor has any evidence been uncovered that any being guided, started, or engineered our existence and evolution on this planet. So until such a time... I have no belief in a God. I don't need faith to have a lack of belief.

You're just a troll.
Glock36shooter is offline  
Old 01-05-2013, 13:01   #71
Gunhaver
the wrong hands
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 2,736
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
Evolution is a plausible theory, no doubt.
How much was the subject of human evolution brought up in your studies?
Would you go so far as to say that there is far more valid evidence for the theory of evolution than there is for any competing theory?

I figure that you have enough biology background to tend to ponder this stuff more than most so I'm actually sort of curious where that pondering might have lead.
Gunhaver is offline  
Old 01-05-2013, 13:13   #72
muscogee
Senior Member
 
muscogee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posts: 6,841


Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunhaver View Post
How much was the subject of human evolution brought up in your studies?
Would you go so far as to say that there is far more valid evidence for the theory of evolution than there is for any competing theory?

I figure that you have enough biology background to tend to ponder this stuff more than most so I'm actually sort of curious where that pondering might have lead.
He may not have any biology background.
__________________
"We don't pay taxes. Only the little people pay taxes."

Leona Helmsley
muscogee is offline  
Old 01-05-2013, 15:23   #73
Cavalry Doc
Silver Membership
MAJ (USA Ret.)
 
Cavalry Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Republic of Texas
Posts: 41,260


Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunhaver View Post
How much was the subject of human evolution brought up in your studies?
Would you go so far as to say that there is far more valid evidence for the theory of evolution than there is for any competing theory?

I figure that you have enough biology background to tend to ponder this stuff more than most so I'm actually sort of curious where that pondering might have lead.
I think I've already stated that there is a greater than 95% probability that evolution is occurring.

My biggest problem is that some people use evolution mistakenly as evidence that intelligent design is not also possible. It doesn't show that at all. It shows that species can adapt. Some are better at it than others.

Neonatal development was pretty cool, and there are a lot of visual similarities to the embryo's of mammals.

What did I take from it? Life is very, very complex. A huge number of chemical reactions must occur every instant, in the right place for a single cell to survive. The cooperation of different tissues, distant in the animal, through complex negative and positive feedback loops is simply amazing. Life is much more than just DNA & RNA.

Ever have to learn the "krebs cycle"? It's hard to understand.

The krebs cycle is but one very small piece of many other biologic pathways that must occur correctly to be compatible with life.

Religious Issues

Link to detailed photo. See links at bottom of page.
http://web.expasy.org/pathways/

Last edited by Cavalry Doc; 01-05-2013 at 15:37..
Cavalry Doc is offline  
Old 01-05-2013, 15:38   #74
Cavalry Doc
Silver Membership
MAJ (USA Ret.)
 
Cavalry Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Republic of Texas
Posts: 41,260


Quote:
Originally Posted by muscogee View Post
He may not have any biology background.
And you may not ever finish peeing on your shoes.


Wait a bit and let a guy answer before popping off from the peanut gallery with ignorant comments.

Cavalry Doc is offline  
Old 01-05-2013, 15:42   #75
Cavalry Doc
Silver Membership
MAJ (USA Ret.)
 
Cavalry Doc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Republic of Texas
Posts: 41,260


Quote:
Originally Posted by Glock36shooter View Post
No it isn't. It's held by two different types of people. 1. Very uneducated people that simply don't understand what they're talking about. 2. Antagonistic trolls that are just trying to get a rise out of people.

We know which one you are. If someone could prove a particular God existed... I'd immediate convert. If I saw Christ coming down from the clouds with trumpets blaring and angels singing... I'd instantly convert. But to date no proof has been discovered. Nor has any evidence been uncovered that any being guided, started, or engineered our existence and evolution on this planet. So until such a time... I have no belief in a God. I don't need faith to have a lack of belief.

You're just a troll.
I'm uneducated? OK, what is your educational background? Anything that you've done that gives you special insight into life in general? Travel much?

G36S,

The fact is that you are childishly lashing out at me because we simply disagree. You are probably insecure in your positions and in other areas of your life. Otherwise, you'd be able to make at least three posts in a row without attempting to insult someone.

Think for a minute, did anyone ever try to teach you manners and tact? Whoever that was is a miserable failure. Say hi to mom for me.
Cavalry Doc is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:27.



Homepage
FAQ
Forums
Calendar
Advertise
Gallery
GT Wiki
GT Blogs
Social Groups
Classifieds


Users Currently Online: 693
165 Members
528 Guests

Most users ever online: 2,244
Nov 11, 2013 at 11:42