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Old 01-04-2013, 07:23   #61
Cavalry Doc
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glock36shooter View Post
Not really. Most often it's an emotional response to annoying people. You're deluding yourself if you think people are rude to you because you've made them insecure or afraid. You're just an annoying individual. Like a yappy dog that won't shut up. There's no point to its yapping... it isn't making any sense... it's just grating on the nerves.
More projection? I annoy you because I won't submit to your belief system, and all your juvenile insults haven't shut me up.

Ask anyone that is not emotionally invested in this issue, they will tell you that you have proven my point if you are unable to intimidate them. You're really not a very good bully, not for a lack of trying though.

Something else gleaned from your PUBLIC profile:

Quote:
Glock36shooter has not made any friends yet
Maybe there's a reason for that.
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Old 01-04-2013, 14:23   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
I annoy you because I won't submit to your belief system, and all your juvenile insults haven't shut me up.
I have no belief system troll. And I don't want you to shut up as long you say something with some substance. But unfortunately you haven't. Pretty much you're just annoying. All bluster and no substance.

Quote:
Ask anyone that is not emotionally invested in this issue, they will tell you that you have proven my point if you are unable to intimidate them.
Do you honestly think I give a flying rats ass what your religious buddies here think? They're not exactly prone to rational or intelligent thinking anyway. I'm not trying to intimidate anyone. Do you feel intimidated? If not why would you suggest that's my aim. I just keep waiting for you to say something that means anything.

Quote:
You're really not a very good bully
Because I'm not trying to be one maybe?

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Something else gleaned from your PUBLIC profile:
Maybe there's a reason for that.
There is... I have no interest in making internet friends. I have real life friends. There you go being a creepy stalker again.
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Old 01-04-2013, 17:28   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glock36shooter View Post
I have no belief system troll. And I don't want you to shut up as long you say something with some substance. But unfortunately you haven't. Pretty much you're just annoying. All bluster and no substance.



Do you honestly think I give a flying rats ass what your religious buddies here think? They're not exactly prone to rational or intelligent thinking anyway. I'm not trying to intimidate anyone. Do you feel intimidated? If not why would you suggest that's my aim. I just keep waiting for you to say something that means anything.



Because I'm not trying to be one maybe?



There is... I have no interest in making internet friends. I have real life friends. There you go being a creepy stalker again.

I meant for you to ask some of your friends in real life. Most people reading our interactions would agree that you basically have made up your mind, you don't want to put up any of the evidence and facts you bragged about before, and for some strange odd reason, you feel that insults and bad manners is a way to accomplish something online. Is it a catharsis exercise or something? Asfar as online friends go, I suspect you are a lot more polite in real life. Either that, or you have a hard time holding down a job.

If you think looking at your public profile is creepy, you have a very low tolerance, and a high paranoia factor.

Look on the bright side, you may be correct that none of the gods humans have describe exist. So far, it looks like you've made that decision based on faith though.
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Old 01-04-2013, 21:53   #64
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Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
It's just what I believe based on what I have learned. Adaptation has been observed, evolution is an extension of that.
Evolution has also been observed, a number of specific instances have been cited in this forum.
Quote:
I'm not sure if we've observed an insect evolving into a mammal, or a reptile into a bird, or a dog into a bear.
You're correct, we haven't observed any evolutionary changes that occur over hundreds of thousands or millions of years in the last century. On the other hand, we can see them in the fossil record and in the genetic structure of living animals.
Quote:
So we agree then, except for all the other lnowledge fields depending on evolution. Even if I was shocked to find out that some animals were created in their present form [very unlikely], biology would still be a science. My iPhone would still work.
Your iPhone works based on very specific laws of physics. If evolution is shown to be false, our understanding of biology would also be falsified. This would imply errors in our understanding of not only biological but molecular process, which would in turn affect our understanding of physics. Your iPhone might still work, but clearly our understanding of how it works would be incorrect.
Quote:
Regardless of how we got here, here we are.
This in no way implies we should give equal, or even any, weight to every possible explanation of how we got to where we are.
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History is full of accepted scientific belief changing when new data emerges.
That's the beauty of science.
Quote:
That whole alchemy thing was a bit embarrassing, even though you can change one element to another. Evolution occurring? Impossible to be precise with numbers, but greater than 95% that evolution has been occurring. It's just not proof that deities don't exist.
And no one claims that it is, except creationists. The reality of evolution and the rejection of deities are two separate topics that happen to both be held as valid by the same people in many instances. Correlation does not imply causation.
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Old 01-04-2013, 22:03   #65
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Evolution has also been observed, a number of specific instances have been cited in this forum.
You're correct, we haven't observed any evolutionary changes that occur over hundreds of thousands or millions of years in the last century. On the other hand, we can see them in the fossil record and in the genetic structure of living animals.
Doing pretty good so far. Just a different opinion.

Quote:
Your iPhone works based on very specific laws of physics. If evolution is shown to be false, our understanding of biology would also be falsified. This would imply errors in our understanding of not only biological but molecular process, which would in turn affect our understanding of physics. Your iPhone might still work, but clearly our understanding of how it works would be incorrect.
That's where you went off the deep end again. We are where we are, regardless of how we arrived at our location.

Quote:
This in no way implies we should give equal, or even any, weight to every possible explanation of how we got to where we are.
That's the beauty of science.
An ethical scientist would not discount any possibilities prior to investigation and experimentation. But those guys understand and believe in science.

Quote:
And no one claims that it is, except creationists. The reality of evolution and the rejection of deities are two separate topics that happen to both be held as valid by the same people in many instances. Correlation does not imply causation.
Are you sure only creationists claim a certain reality?
Don't atheists claim that all that is happened without the influence of deity...... without proof.......based on faith.....held to with ardor.......

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Old 01-04-2013, 22:12   #66
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Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
Doing pretty good so far. Just a different opinion.
What is it that you believe is a matter of opinion?
Quote:
That's where you went off the deep end again. We are where we are, regardless of how we arrived at our location.
Your position is that it doesn't matter if your iPhone works based on understood interactions of energy and materials or through the actions of magical gnomes, just so long as it works?
Quote:
An ethical scientist would not discount any possibilities prior to investigation and experimentation. But those guys understand and believe in science.
Again, that's nonsensical. You don't assign equal likelihood to every possible explanation prior to every experiment or observation, to do so would mean repeating the whole of the history of science each time you perform any investigation.
Quote:
Are you sure only creationists claim a certain reality?
Yes.
Quote:
Don't atheists claim that all that is happened without the influence of deity...... without proof.......based on faith.....held to with ardor.......
No. As has been demonstrated a number of times, atheists are willing to accept the existence of a deity, if evidence of one (or many for that matter) is produced. That hasn't been done, nor has the necessity of a deity been demonstrated for any observed phenomena.
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Old 01-05-2013, 04:43   #67
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AM covered this but to reiterate and restate the point...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
It's just what I believe based on what I have learned. Adaptation has been observed, evolution is an extension of that. I'm not sure if we've observed an insect evolving into a mammal, or a reptile into a bird, or a dog into a bear.

That statement is proof you have no real understanding of evolution.

So we agree then, except for all the other knowledge fields depending on evolution. Even if I was shocked to find out that some animals were created in their present form [very unlikely], biology would still be a science. My iPhone would still work. Regardless of how we got here, here we are.

The other knowledge fields are not dependent on evolution. Evolution is dependent on them. Again a demonstration that you do not understand science from a quantum level up to the "macro". And no, chances are that your iPhone would not work. The physics that make/allow your iPhone to work are the very basis for biology.

History is full of accepted scientific belief changing when new data emerges. That whole alchemy thing was a bit embarrassing, even though you can change one element to another. Evolution occurring? Impossible to be precise with numbers, but greater than 95% that evolution has been occurring. It's just not proof that deities don't exist.

I could not care less if any deity or deities exist. Whether they do has no bearing on science. And as you may have forgotten I am not an atheist, but rather a non-religious believer.

Ok, the abortion thing does not come up much. But you do know that we still use bloodletting as a treatment, right? Chemical, electrolyte and cellular imbalances of blood is still a big issue, they have been better described in the last 100 years though. Ask a hematologist...

I worked in the medical field for 9 years and my mother has been a nurse for almost 30. I am quite familiar with modern medicine. I wasn't questioning hematology, bloodletting or leech therapy. I referenced blood humors. Your understanding of science and evolution as presented is in the blood humor range. They have been better described in the last 100 years though. ...
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Old 01-05-2013, 05:08   #68
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Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
...That's where you went off the deep end again. We are where we are, regardless of how we arrived at our location.

No. We are where we are precisely because of "how" we arrived at our location.

An ethical scientist would not discount any possibilities prior to investigation and experimentation. But those guys understand and believe in science.

They sure do. And none of their investigations or experiments lend credibility to any religious view point.

Are you sure only creationists claim a certain reality?
Don't atheists claim that all that is happened without the influence of deity...... without proof.......based on faith.....held to with ardor.......

For the love of God give it up Doc. Atheism is not a religion. Doesn't matter if proof is absent, how much faith they have in said belief or with what ardor they hold to it. There is no reason to label atheism a religion unless one thinks they can somehow score points in a debate on the subject.

Religion
noun...the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods:

Atheists neither believe in nor worship a superhuman controlling power/s. Your definition is like insisting the use of the word "cool" means anything folks deem such must have a relative low temperature.

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Old 01-05-2013, 07:40   #69
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For the love of God give it up Doc. Atheism is not a religion. Doesn't matter if proof is absent, how much faith they have in said belief or with what ardor they hold to it. There is no reason to label atheism a religion unless one thinks they can somehow score points in a debate on the subject.

Religion
noun...the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods:

Atheists neither believe in nor worship a superhuman controlling power/s. Your definition is like insisting the use of the word "cool" means anything folks deem such must have a relative low temperature.
Well, it is, but that's a minority opinion for sure, don't worry about it.

Maybe I'm looking at this in a different way. If you wake up in a strange land, first thing to do is find a secure location, and figure out where you are. If its a bad place, figure out where you need to go quickly. When you have time, then you fugues out how you got to the strange land. Right now, we have a lot of ideas about how we got here, some are conflicting. Evolution is a plausible theory, no doubt.

And if random combinations of atoms, molecules and proteins reacting led to all life on earth, there is nothing precise about it. It's just a very rare series of events, relatively speaking.
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Old 01-05-2013, 12:57   #70
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Well, it is, but that's a minority opinion for sure, don't worry about it.
No it isn't. It's held by two different types of people. 1. Very uneducated people that simply don't understand what they're talking about. 2. Antagonistic trolls that are just trying to get a rise out of people.

We know which one you are. If someone could prove a particular God existed... I'd immediate convert. If I saw Christ coming down from the clouds with trumpets blaring and angels singing... I'd instantly convert. But to date no proof has been discovered. Nor has any evidence been uncovered that any being guided, started, or engineered our existence and evolution on this planet. So until such a time... I have no belief in a God. I don't need faith to have a lack of belief.

You're just a troll.
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Old 01-05-2013, 14:01   #71
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Originally Posted by Cavalry Doc View Post
Evolution is a plausible theory, no doubt.
How much was the subject of human evolution brought up in your studies?
Would you go so far as to say that there is far more valid evidence for the theory of evolution than there is for any competing theory?

I figure that you have enough biology background to tend to ponder this stuff more than most so I'm actually sort of curious where that pondering might have lead.
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Old 01-05-2013, 14:13   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunhaver View Post
How much was the subject of human evolution brought up in your studies?
Would you go so far as to say that there is far more valid evidence for the theory of evolution than there is for any competing theory?

I figure that you have enough biology background to tend to ponder this stuff more than most so I'm actually sort of curious where that pondering might have lead.
He may not have any biology background.
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Old 01-05-2013, 16:23   #73
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Originally Posted by Gunhaver View Post
How much was the subject of human evolution brought up in your studies?
Would you go so far as to say that there is far more valid evidence for the theory of evolution than there is for any competing theory?

I figure that you have enough biology background to tend to ponder this stuff more than most so I'm actually sort of curious where that pondering might have lead.
I think I've already stated that there is a greater than 95% probability that evolution is occurring.

My biggest problem is that some people use evolution mistakenly as evidence that intelligent design is not also possible. It doesn't show that at all. It shows that species can adapt. Some are better at it than others.

Neonatal development was pretty cool, and there are a lot of visual similarities to the embryo's of mammals.

What did I take from it? Life is very, very complex. A huge number of chemical reactions must occur every instant, in the right place for a single cell to survive. The cooperation of different tissues, distant in the animal, through complex negative and positive feedback loops is simply amazing. Life is much more than just DNA & RNA.

Ever have to learn the "krebs cycle"? It's hard to understand.

The krebs cycle is but one very small piece of many other biologic pathways that must occur correctly to be compatible with life.

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Old 01-05-2013, 16:38   #74
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Originally Posted by muscogee View Post
He may not have any biology background.
And you may not ever finish peeing on your shoes.


Wait a bit and let a guy answer before popping off from the peanut gallery with ignorant comments.

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Old 01-05-2013, 16:42   #75
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Originally Posted by Glock36shooter View Post
No it isn't. It's held by two different types of people. 1. Very uneducated people that simply don't understand what they're talking about. 2. Antagonistic trolls that are just trying to get a rise out of people.

We know which one you are. If someone could prove a particular God existed... I'd immediate convert. If I saw Christ coming down from the clouds with trumpets blaring and angels singing... I'd instantly convert. But to date no proof has been discovered. Nor has any evidence been uncovered that any being guided, started, or engineered our existence and evolution on this planet. So until such a time... I have no belief in a God. I don't need faith to have a lack of belief.

You're just a troll.
I'm uneducated? OK, what is your educational background? Anything that you've done that gives you special insight into life in general? Travel much?

G36S,

The fact is that you are childishly lashing out at me because we simply disagree. You are probably insecure in your positions and in other areas of your life. Otherwise, you'd be able to make at least three posts in a row without attempting to insult someone.

Think for a minute, did anyone ever try to teach you manners and tact? Whoever that was is a miserable failure. Say hi to mom for me.
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Old 01-05-2013, 16:44   #76
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The irony of this entire discussion is the hypocrisy. GT is not be bastion of tolerance, in fact tht would be to progressive for this board. If you question the 2nd amendment Jerry rabidly insults, if you suggest Obama is not a communist well then forget it, you get flayed and if you articulate religious belief of disbelief you are soon ridiculed and or condemned to Hell or retardation.


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Old 01-05-2013, 16:49   #77
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The irony of this entire discussion is the hypocrisy. GT is not be bastion of tolerance, in fact tht would be to progressive for this board. If you question the 2nd amendment Jerry rabidly insults, if you suggest Obama is not a communist well then forget it, you get flayed and if you articulate religious belief of disbelief you are soon ridiculed and or condemned to Hell or retardation.


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In all honesty, Obama is more of a fascist. He hasn't yet tried to confiscate companies, he just tries to control them and manipulate what they do.

Try being an agnostic around here if you think YOU have it hard.
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Old 01-05-2013, 18:46   #78
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I think I've already stated that there is a greater than 95% probability that evolution is occurring.

My biggest problem is that some people use evolution mistakenly as evidence that intelligent design is not also possible. It doesn't show that at all. It shows that species can adapt. Some are better at it than others.

Neonatal development was pretty cool, and there are a lot of visual similarities to the embryo's of mammals.

What did I take from it? Life is very, very complex. A huge number of chemical reactions must occur every instant, in the right place for a single cell to survive. The cooperation of different tissues, distant in the animal, through complex negative and positive feedback loops is simply amazing. Life is much more than just DNA & RNA.

Ever have to learn the "krebs cycle"? It's hard to understand.

The krebs cycle is but one very small piece of many other biologic pathways that must occur correctly to be compatible with life.
To be fair, the reason people sometimes tend to believe you are a creationist/believer in disguise is because you're constantly parroting their arguments. No one has argued that evolution shows that intelligent design is not possible. The argument which is presented is that there is overwhelming evidence for evolution and none for either the existence of intelligent design or for a designer.
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Old 01-05-2013, 19:02   #79
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The evidence of a designer is the historical and universal belief in one across cultures. Yes, there have always been Agnostics and Atheists - but a designer has existed from the beginning of thought in one form or another. Superstition? Ignorance? Fear? Maybe, or maybe sufficient evidence?


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Old 01-05-2013, 19:29   #80
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I have no belief system troll.


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That is potentially the single most ignorant statement I've ever seen on the internet, and I've been around since AOL was the hot thing. Out of curiosity, do you believe your statement to be true?
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