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Old 02-08-2013, 11:26   #1
Gary Slider
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FL & PA Reciprocity Changed! -- OH & AZ Non-Resident -- Other Info

The PA AG has posted a newly signed Reciprocity Agreement with Florida. The wording has changed. It now states:

The Commonwealth of Pennsylvania shall give full faith and credit to a valid Concealed Handgun License issued by the State of Florida to legal residents of the State of Florida;

PA already had a signed agreement with FL and now they have signed a new one. PA has been in a running argument with residents of PA carrying in PA with a FL Non-Resident Permit/License. Mainly in Philadelphia is where this has been coming up. But from the new agreement PA will no longer Honor the FL Non-Resident Permit/License. FL no longer puts the Address of their Permit/License holder on the Permit/License so your state issued ID will tell them your state of Residence. You can read the new agreement here:
http://www.attorneygeneral.gov/uploa...florida_pa.pdf

There is also a big argument about Ohio honoring the AZ non-resident permit/license. Ohio will still not honor an AZ permit/license issued to non residents. That is the only non-resident permit/license of the states Ohio honors that it will not honor. AZ put that in the agreement when it was signed in 2004. The AG’s Officer called me today and told me that is still the law and that they are trying to change the agreement to honor AZ non-resident permit/licenses but it will take time.

The News/Legislative Updates page has not seen much added in the last month. There is so much legislation being put forth because of recent events we have just put the link to the NRA Legislative Updates there. I will be adding items but most likely only after they pass and become law. So many people put forth info on Legislation I see no use it duplicating their efforts at this time.

Handgunlaw.us depends on people just like you to keep up to date. No one can do this by themselves. Hundreds of people send me information on law changes and without them I couldn’t do this. Thank you to everyone who has assisted me. It is very much appreciated. Handgunlaw.us also has had huge growth. With growth comes unintended consequences for us. The biggest consequences is our costs have tripled with the upgrades to our server for bandwidth. So we now have a way to donate to help pay these additional costs. I am not a computer guy and Steve has always taken care of that end with me supplying information. I was really surprised to find out what it actually costs to keep a site online.

www.handgunlaw.us will be updated later this evening showing the above changes.
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Old 02-08-2013, 12:18   #2
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Thanks Gary!
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Old 02-08-2013, 13:13   #3
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The PA AG has made a press release. http://www.attorneygeneral.gov/press.aspx?id=6811
FL website has already been updated to show that PA will not honor A FL Non_resident Permit:
http://licgweb.doacs.state.fl.us/new...led_carry.html

But the press release states FL non-resident permits will be honor until June 8, 2013 to give people time to make other arrangements.
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Old 02-08-2013, 13:19   #4
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Dang, when I read the thread title I was hoping maybe OH now had reciprocity with PA :(
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Old 02-09-2013, 06:20   #5
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I'm not sure what to make of this

Local media was portraying this action as "closing a loophole" where someone who could not get a permit to carry in PA for some reason would get the FLA permit and back dooring the whole process. I did not read the new signed agreement and do not know how much it changed from what it WAS to what it IS. Also re read the original post, I'm trying to decipher what i read, i'm having a little reading comprehension problem this AM.

As far as PHI, it is a class A city, the only one in the state and you can NOT conceal carry legally in the city limits. They are allowed to circumvent the constitution on the state level. Imagine that, the most dangerous place in the state to not be allowed to legally carry.

Note: this is my understanding derived from reading our state law and asking once I was in that city.

Last edited by ARP; 02-09-2013 at 06:26..
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Old 02-09-2013, 06:25   #6
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As far as PHI, it is a class A city, the only one in the state and you can NOT conceal carry legally in the city limits. They are allowed to circumvent the constitution on the state level. Imagine that, the most dangerous place in the state to not be allowed to legally carry.

ARP - Not true at all. You most certainly can concealed carry in Philly with any permit recognized by PA. In fact, you can open carry with that same permit.

Last edited by The Fed; 02-09-2013 at 06:27..
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Old 02-09-2013, 06:28   #7
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Thanks Gary for the fine work you do for all of us.......
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Old 02-09-2013, 06:58   #8
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[QUOTE=ARP - Not true at all. You most certainly can concealed carry in Philly with any permit recognized by PA. In fact, you can open carry with that same permit.[/QUOTE]

+1...a valid PA License to Carry Firearms is the key.

Last edited by JimM_PA; 02-09-2013 at 07:00..
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Old 02-09-2013, 07:14   #9
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Excellent! Now let's get SC and GA. to recognize eachothers permits.
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Old 02-09-2013, 07:51   #10
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I'm sure this will REALLY put a damper on Philly gun violence... all those 4000 crazy law abiding Florida permit holders causing havoc...

Good job Kane- very effective solution

An article says Philly resident were denied a PA permit with no criminal background? Last I checked we were shall issue and Philly wasn't a state

Not to mention Florida's permit requirements are stricter than PA's
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Old 02-09-2013, 09:36   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthrelf View Post
I'm sure this will REALLY put a damper on Philly gun violence... all those 4000 crazy law abiding Florida permit holders causing havoc...

Good job Kane- very effective solution

An article says Philly resident were denied a PA permit with no criminal background? Last I checked we were shall issue and Philly wasn't a state

Not to mention Florida's permit requirements are stricter than PA's
I guess I should mention I lived in Philly all my life until I retired and moved to Florida, so I kinda consider myself somewhat of an expert (except for this recent announcement). I usually keep a close eye on their websites but not lately.

Comparing the two states:

Florida is more lenient except they require some sort of firearms training or a DD214.

PA does not require any training but they require 3 references.

While PA is shall issue they still can require you to meet certain requirements, such as the background check and the references. If one of your references is not satisfactory they can use that as a excuse to deny.

Also, since you're talking about the Gulag called Philly, you need to be interviewed by a detective in the gun permit unit first. They're told to try to discourage you from getting a permit. If you don't say the right thing during the interview they can deny you.

I had a Florida permit since PA first recognized FL "non-resident" permits. Doesn't matter now that I live in Florida but I never bothered getting a PA permit. For years you couldn't get one in Philly unless the fix was in beforehand and you had to qualify at the police range. But there was no standard so you always failed without the political pull.

When PA went "shall issue" it was easier to get a Florida permit. A Philly resident needs to go downtown to the gun unit three times - pick up the application, turn it in and wait hours for an interview, then if approved pick it up in person. You're talking a long trip in traffic, no parking, etc. Then there's the renewal process. Wasn't worth the effort to me. Once you get a Florida permit you can renew by mail.

And Philly is about as corrupt as city as it gets.

Last edited by The Fed; 02-09-2013 at 09:38..
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Old 02-09-2013, 10:24   #12
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So......Virginia Nonresident is still good in PA.....Right ?
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Old 02-09-2013, 10:52   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fed View Post
I guess I should mention I lived in Philly all my life until I retired and moved to Florida, so I kinda consider myself somewhat of an expert (except for this recent announcement). I usually keep a close eye on their websites but not lately.

Comparing the two states:

Florida is more lenient except they require some sort of firearms training or a DD214.

PA does not require any training but they require 3 references.

While PA is shall issue they still can require you to meet certain requirements, such as the background check and the references. If one of your references is not satisfactory they can use that as a excuse to deny.

Also, since you're talking about the Gulag called Philly, you need to be interviewed by a detective in the gun permit unit first. They're told to try to discourage you from getting a permit. If you don't say the right thing during the interview they can deny you.

I had a Florida permit since PA first recognized FL "non-resident" permits. Doesn't matter now that I live in Florida but I never bothered getting a PA permit. For years you couldn't get one in Philly unless the fix was in beforehand and you had to qualify at the police range. But there was no standard so you always failed without the political pull.

When PA went "shall issue" it was easier to get a Florida permit. A Philly resident needs to go downtown to the gun unit three times - pick up the application, turn it in and wait hours for an interview, then if approved pick it up in person. You're talking a long trip in traffic, no parking, etc. Then there's the renewal process. Wasn't worth the effort to me. Once you get a Florida permit you can renew by mail.

And Philly is about as corrupt as city as it gets.
Thanks for the info! When I said Florida was more strict I was talking about Pennsylvania ex-Philly, didn't know about all of the crap they have to go through!... I do not live in Philly and my permit was extremely easy to obtain - Local police sign off of no arrest, drive to county courthouse with about a 10 minute wait - background check, $20, picture taken, license printed, see you in 5 years
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Old 02-09-2013, 13:32   #14
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So.. as someone who is not familiar with PA politics.. why were people being arbitrarily denied by Philly Police, causing them to go the FL route? I'm assuming there's an appeals process?

Why don't the state police administer the permits? That would keep the policies consistent. Here, the application (fingerprints, etc..) is taken by the county(and they get a part of the permit fee for this), but the system is administered by the state police.

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Old 02-10-2013, 11:14   #15
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Good information-- I'm about to add FL to my inventory of permits. I always check the following website first. http://handgunlaw.us/. Of course it's only as good as its updates. In this case, I think the reciprocity map accurately depicts what you posted.
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Old 02-10-2013, 22:58   #16
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Why thanks

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fed View Post
As far as PHI, it is a class A city, the only one in the state and you can NOT conceal carry legally in the city limits. They are allowed to circumvent the constitution on the state level. Imagine that, the most dangerous place in the state to not be allowed to legally carry.

ARP - Not true at all. You most certainly can concealed carry in Philly with any permit recognized by PA. In fact, you can open carry with that same permit.
I stand corrected on my misinterpretation of the law and application in class A PHI.

I challenge you to go walk down the a street in PHI, open carry. You know as well as I do what will happen.
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Old 02-11-2013, 18:01   #17
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National Reciprocity is long over due. Good luck getting it passed with all the demojerkos in congress.
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Old 02-12-2013, 07:50   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtyGuy View Post
Good information-- I'm about to add FL to my inventory of permits. I always check the following website first. http://handgunlaw.us/. Of course it's only as good as its updates. In this case, I think the reciprocity map accurately depicts what you posted.
LOL.. You do realize the person who started this thread co-owns that site, right? So it stands to reason since he's bringing it to our attention, he's updated his own site w/ this information.
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The fire is no longer my major concern since I am leaving immediately on an unexpected road trip to Indianapolis. Watch the national news over the next couple of days, I'll wave... well, only if I'm cuffed in the front.
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Old 02-12-2013, 07:52   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NEOH212 View Post
National Reciprocity is long over due. Good luck getting it passed with all the demojerkos in congress.
I personally don't want national reciprocity. Look at where we are right now. We are perilously close to getting a AWB shoved down our throat due to the powerful congressmen/women from NY, CA, etc.. If it's this easy for these states to influence a possible AWB, it would be very easy for them to influence revoking a national CCW system.

I'd much rather this stay a state issue, and states work towards better reciprocity. What needs to happen, is states need to be required to abide by the US Constitution.

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Old 02-12-2013, 08:00   #20
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Quote:
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I stand corrected on my misinterpretation of the law and application in class A PHI.

I challenge you to go walk down the a street in PHI, open carry. You know as well as I do what will happen.
Yep - I followed Mark's case: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011...ry-gun-owners/

And never declare if you're CC-ing in Philly. You're not required to, and if you do you can I can virtually guarantee you will be given the same treatment as Mark. I knew a guy who owned a guard agency with all of the right credentials and even he was always hassled when he declared. He stopped. We're talking state private investigator license, guard agency license, guard license, and concealed carry permit. If you know what's required to get a PI license you know only police detectives or ex-military investigators can get one in PA. He was the latter.

Last edited by The Fed; 02-12-2013 at 08:08..
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Old 02-12-2013, 11:35   #21
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Old 02-13-2013, 08:46   #22
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Unless things have changed

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fed View Post
Yep - I followed Mark's case: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011...ry-gun-owners/

And never declare if you're CC-ing in Philly. You're not required to, and if you do you can I can virtually guarantee you will be given the same treatment as Mark. I knew a guy who owned a guard agency with all of the right credentials and even he was always hassled when he declared. He stopped. We're talking state private investigator license, guard agency license, guard license, and concealed carry permit. If you know what's required to get a PI license you know only police detectives or ex-military investigators can get one in PA. He was the latter.
I held a PI license in the Commonwealth for 5 years. Issued by a Judge in my County. I had no military or LEO background, just a BA and work experience in Private Security. Went thru the BG check with the County Detective/DA office, submitted prints, went to the appointment with the Judge, paid the fees, got the surety bond, deal done. My Attorney was an Assistant DA at the time, the Judge trusted their judgement. Private Detective act of 1953 was the law at that time. 1990-1995.
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Old 02-13-2013, 09:15   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fed View Post
As far as PHI, it is a class A city, the only one in the state and you can NOT conceal carry legally in the city limits. They are allowed to circumvent the constitution on the state level. Imagine that, the most dangerous place in the state to not be allowed to legally carry.

ARP - Not true at all. You most certainly can concealed carry in Philly with any permit recognized by PA. In fact, you can open carry with that same permit.
He is 100% correct.
although i would not suggest open carry.
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Old 02-13-2013, 10:45   #24
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Perhaps the worst thought out law known. I wonder what the PA legislature will say when a buttload of PA residents start giving UT permits?

http://www.attorneygeneral.gov/crime.aspx?id=184

Category 2: States that have statutory reciprocity under 6106(b)(15) of the Uniform Firearms Act.

The following states have been granted statutory reciprocity without a formal written agreement under 6106(b)(15), based on the determination of the Attorney General that the other state has granted reciprocity to Pennsylvania license holders, and that the other state's laws governing firearms are similar.

Colorado
Iowa
Idaho
Indiana
Louisiana
Mississippi
Montana
North Dakota
Utah
Wisconsin
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