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Old 04-26-2013, 23:21   #1
Pythonman
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Dipstick Quacks anyone?

I recently went to a sleep clinic and did a sleep study because I have sleep apnea. When I was done with the horrible ordeal they told me that if I tested positive I would have to do the test all over again, this time with a CPAP mask/machine on. I told them no way. Anyhow, to make a long story short, THREE months later I see the sleep MD (quack in question or QIQ) and he tells me I'm a ticking timebomb based on VERY suspicious test results. I say very suspicious because I know for a fact I was so miserable I only slept 45 minutes, between 2:45am and 3:30am and yet he said I slept the whole six hours and averaged 80 apnea episodes per hour and that my oxygen level went to 70%. I said well, give me the machine for crying out loud and he's saying insurance wont pay unless I do the second sleep study and I say well no way I'm going through that torture again and he says...... "Well if you're not going to do the test then I feel obligated to call your employer and have them remove you from your job because it's not safe" To which I say "Well, then I would be obligated to call a lawyer and sue your ass!" And then my wife says "So you mean to tell me that unless he agrees to another test you're going to resort to extortion against him by threatening his livelihood?" Should I sue the sorry SOB for making the threat to ruin me based on one lame, DOCTORED up test that doesn't tell crap about my true condition and who knows zero about my full past work or health history? Has anyone else even heard of such lame quackery? I mean really I hope he does call my employer. If it's so urgent that I be removed from my job then why did the quack not tell me the perils that await me three months ago? Bastard, couldn't scare me into another test with his phonied up sleep study results so he tries terrorizing me, I've never heard of anything so lame.
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Old 04-27-2013, 04:49   #2
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May I ask what was so bad about the test? Btw I'm not saying you should have another one and I would be mad enough to consider suing him also.
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Old 04-27-2013, 05:04   #3
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Sue his arse and contact the Medical Board

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Old 04-27-2013, 05:20   #4
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You are obviously smarter than the doctor. You do the sleep study and argue with the results. Why did you even bother?
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Old 04-27-2013, 05:30   #5
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You have to have the second study done, all wired up etc with the CPAP machine in place to calibrate and see if it is controlling the apnea. It is not a plug and play device, but has to be adjusted, telemetry performed and data scrutinized by a Professional (ie: Doctor) to see if the apnea is under control.
The doctor is right, untreated sleep apnea is very debilitating and you are a safety risk due to fatigue/foggy thinking.
You have a computer, just google untreated sleep apnea, read it, then see if you want to take the risks before undertaking a legal journey that you will most probably lose
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Old 04-27-2013, 06:27   #6
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Does your job require a medical certificate as for example DOT CMV certification? Untreated sleep apnea could prevent you from getting the certificate. If not, I don't know about the legality of a doctor just calling your employer out of the blue and telling them you are not safe to do your job. Nevertheless, for your own health and well-being, since you know you have sleep apnea you should get it properly treated.
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Old 04-27-2013, 06:34   #7
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Originally Posted by Geezer Glide View Post
You are obviously smarter than the doctor. You do the sleep study and argue with the results. Why did you even bother?
I probably am smarter than this doctor. Truth is yes I know I have apnea and need the machine. I also know 4 out of 5 people who did the first sleep study and got the machine without the second test who would under no circumstances go through that hell a second time. One of these people is my old man. The only reason I put up with listening to this particular doctor is that my primary physicians nurse practitioner substitute-Dr. wannabe assured me she had talked to the sleep clinic quack and that I would be able to get my machine and get a setup without doing the whole 40 electrodes plugged into the head neck chest legs and arms thing and be good to go. But, that was not the case and instead I got my job threatened. I plan on completing the second study somewhere else as I just plain don't trust the outfit that I was sent to the first time. It's not just the Dr. is an idiot, the whole staff I'd dealt with there was rude, misleading and incompetent as far as I could tell and very unprofessional overall. And I have plenty of experience with competent medical professionals to guide me in my description of this place. I myself worked in Radiation Therapy for over six years at a local hospital so even with just that experience I'm fairly confident I know a sham setup when I see one and sham test results that don't jive with reality.
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Old 04-27-2013, 06:36   #8
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lol,i had both but the funny part is that i really could'nt sleep much due to being in a strange place with all of that crap connected to me
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Old 04-27-2013, 06:43   #9
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Originally Posted by czsmithGT View Post
Does your job require a medical certificate as for example DOT CMV certification? Untreated sleep apnea could prevent you from getting the certificate. If not, I don't know about the legality of a doctor just calling your employer out of the blue and telling them you are not safe to do your job. Nevertheless, for your own health and well-being, since you know you have sleep apnea you should get it properly treated.
Thank you and no, I'm not required to have a medical certification or a yearly physical as would be required with a DOT or CDL liscensing or anything like that. Not only that but I perform at a very high level on the job compared to most of my coworkers and have never fell asleep in the middle of my work. I've had this apnea for probably 12yrs and it's something I've decided to deal with on account of I've heard the CPAP and BIPAP machines do help one get a good nights rest. It turns out I probably will end up doing both tests over at a competent facility just to make sure it's being done correctly. I'm going to have to argue for this with my insurance now and make sure they will pay for the redo of the first test.
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Old 04-27-2013, 06:50   #10
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lol,i had both but the funny part is that i really could'nt sleep much due to being in a strange place with all of that crap connected to me
Aint that the truth. It's like they go out of their way to make you as miserable as possible, so you get as little actual sleep as possible to skew the test results in their favor and then try to scare you into thinking you're going to die next week if they dont save you with their technological wizardry. Only in my case the doctor at the facility I went to apparently only just checked my test results eight weeks after I took the test and scheduled me for an emergency visit that had to be done right away and yet I had to wait an additional month to go to. Rude, condescending staff... aarrggg!
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Old 04-27-2013, 06:52   #11
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Medical billing fraud and incompetent medical care are genuine concerns, but do you realize that you tend to undermine your own credibility by repeatedly using terms like "quack" and "wannabe" when refering to medical professionals with whom you disagree?
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Old 04-27-2013, 06:54   #12
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May I ask what was so bad about the test? Btw I'm not saying you should have another one and I would be mad enough to consider suing him also.
Pictures tell all:

https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&...FYuqqQGLg4CwAw
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Old 04-27-2013, 06:57   #13
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Then see a different sleep md. Take better care of yourself by exercising, dieting, and losing weight. That is your responsibility, not some idiot doctor.

Of course, you know that already since you work in health care.
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Old 04-27-2013, 07:00   #14
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Medical billing fraud and incompetent medical care are genuine concerns, but do you realize that you tend to undermine your own credibility by repeatedly using terms like "quack" and "wannabe" when refering to medical professionals with whom you disagree?
It's a possibility but then again, when most people use the term quack in reference to a medical professional it's because they have had an unpleasant experience with them or they didn't agree with them. Same for wannabe's.
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Old 04-27-2013, 07:22   #15
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Then see a different sleep md. Take better care of yourself by exercising, dieting, and losing weight. That is your responsibility, not some idiot doctor.

Of course, you know that already since you work in health care.
Thanks and I got out of the healthcare business back in the late 1990s. Taking care of loved ones, seeing truly world class level physicians at the Mayo Clinic and elsewhere since that time have really exposed me to the level of professionalism in healthcare I wish everyone could experience. Trust me, I knew this guy at the sleep center wasn't one of those type of physicians before I saw him based upon how I was "handled" by his poorly trained staff. I had no desire to see him and wanted my primary care Dr. (whom I trust implicitly when he's not doing peace work in other countries) to send me somewhere else. But it was his subbing nurse practitioner lady who assured me she had everything taken care of, had greased the wheels to get me a CPAP machine all by herself and all I had to do was see the *quack* I didn't want to see. Total waste of my time. And the thing is his tactic of scaring me with my test results was entirely predictable, he scored 100% and met every single expectation I thought he would have. Funny thing is, he almost got me back into the sleep center for the second test as I'd finally just about relented and was going to agree and just get the damn test over with and then the SOB(!!) threw out the part about threatening my job for good measure. Well, that was exceeding my expectations by a rather alarming margin. Instead of slowly but surely turning sympathetic to his concern for my health and my desire to do whatever (mostly for my wifes sake who has to listen to me snore all night) as I'd started to do he abruptly hit me with the threat to my job and I knew right then and there the guy was dirty, a rotten bastard and a fool. I don't know what kind of people this Dr. is used to dealing with but I'm not some unschooled third grader who gets intimidated easily. It's usually me that does the intimidating.

Sorry for the long rant. It's really turned into me vs the quacks when really most of you people who've responded to the thread are totally correct, I need to have the study finished or repeated somewhere more trustworthy and I need to take better care of myself which, I'm doing my best. Believe me. Thanks for all the words everyone, I mean it!
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Old 04-27-2013, 07:28   #16
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Here's a thought - pay cash for your CPAP. You want the ins co to pay, you have to play by their rules. Don't blame the doc. He's just following the rules you agreed to when you took the insurance.

Seems for 1500, you could have this all cleared up by Wednesday.
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Old 04-27-2013, 07:29   #17
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My Experience

I had a sleep study done at a local hospital clinic and was diagnosed with sleep apnea (over 130 episodes throughout the night). They were able to have someone come over within a few days to hook me up to a CPAP machine. THAT experience wearing the mask for one night was horrible. The machine was to loud, I was always aware of it's presence. The mask fit so tightly that it actually bruised my nose. Obviously, it was not fitted right, but that one night experience was enough for me. I called the people that issued it and they took it away.
The better approach was for me to begin dieting which helped decrease obstruction of the airway (lost 28 lbs. so far and need to lose 10 lbs. more). I agree with the exercise too, even if it's just walking. Another important way to control apnea is to sleep on your sides. I flip from one side over to the other which helps a lot. I'm still not there yet, but my final act will be to have an surgery done, if that's what it takes.
If I were you, I'd contact your insurance company to see what their policy and procedure requires for you to get what you need. The day I'm hooked up to that damned CPAP machine again is the day I'm jumping out of an airplane without a parachute.

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Old 04-27-2013, 07:52   #18
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Originally Posted by ChallengerSRT View Post
I had a sleep study done at a local hospital clinic and was diagnosed with sleep apnea (over 130 episodes throughout the night). They were able to have someone come over within a few days to hook me up to a CPAP machine. THAT experience wearing the mask for one night was horrible. The machine was to loud, I was always aware of it's presence. The mask fit so tightly that it actually bruised my nose. Obviously, it was not fitted right, but that one night experience was enough for me. I called the people that issued it and they took it away.
The better approach was for me to begin dieting which helped decrease obstruction of the airway (lost 28 lbs. so far and need to lose 10 lbs. more). I agree with the exercise too, even if it's just walking. Another important way to control apnea is to sleep on your sides. I flip from one side over to the other which helps a lot. I'm still not there yet, but my final act will be to have an surgery done, if that's what it takes.
If I were you, I'd contact your insurance company to see what their policy and procedure requires for you to get what you need. The day I'm hooked up to that damned CPAP machine again is the day I'm jumping out of an airplane without a parachute.
You have my sympathies brother! It's true about sleeping on your sides. I do just fine sleeping on my sides. But hooked up to all the electrodes and chest and belly bands and wrist and finger doo hicky's....there was no way in hell to sleep on my sides! That's sure to make certain you're sleep study results are far worse than what you'd experience on the average night at home? And I'd thought about just buying the machine and could probably afford it but the Dr. wasn't about to write a script for something he's not going to get any $$$$ out of. Although once my wife hit him with the word "extortion" he was all to happy to be rid of me altogether and recommend another clinic to me if I wanted the study done elsewhere! That was funny, the look on the dudes face when his bluff had been called and charges of extortion leveled. Almost forgot about that.
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Old 04-27-2013, 08:39   #19
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One of my closest friends, a person I have spent hundreds of hours with/gone on vacations with/ known for over ten years, is the medical director of the sleep disorder center at a major metropolitan hospital. She's a board certified neurologist, lectures all over the country on sleep medicine, and is one of the smartest people I know.

As she was starting up her clinic at the hospital ten years ago, and knowing I snored like a chainsaw, I underwent the same sleep tests you did, twice, once before the CPAP and once, after. She showed me the tapes of myself, coupled simultaneously with the readings from all the sensors.

I am absolutely convinced that sleep apnea exists, that I have it, and that the science behind it and its treatments is real.

http://www.osfsaintfrancis.org/physi...h-n-zallek-md/
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Old 04-27-2013, 08:44   #20
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I wonder if there's something hiding in that 2,700+ page Obamacare law that will require your doctor to "rat you out" to the Feds in situations such as this?

Won't he Feds will have all of your medical records?

Could they compel your doctor (or mine) to tell them if you or I are, or ever were, on depression meds, etc. which "could" cause you or me to be a "danger"?
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Old 04-27-2013, 08:50   #21
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One of my closest friends, a person I have spent hundreds of hours with/gone on vacations with/ known for over ten years, is the medical director of the sleep disorder center at a major metropolitan hospital. She's a board certified neurologist, lectures all over the country on sleep medicine, and is one of the smartest people I know.

As she was starting up her clinic at the hospital ten years ago, and knowing I snored like a chainsaw, I underwent the same sleep tests you did, twice, once before the CPAP and once, after. She showed me the tapes of myself, coupled simultaneously with the readings from all the sensors.

I am absolutely convinced that sleep apnea exists, that I have it, and that the science behind it and its treatments is real.

http://www.osfsaintfrancis.org/physi...h-n-zallek-md/
I have no doubt in my mind that the clinic and the staff/Dr. I went to are not even typical of other sleep centers. Can't be. I will gladly do the WHOLE thing over again at a properly run facility as I do wish to give myself the best fighting chance at not dying of a stroke, enlarged heart or suffocation, if possible. Believe me.
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Old 04-27-2013, 08:58   #22
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It's incredibly highly doubtful you'd get anywhere by trying to sue the doc. It's a waste of everyone's time and money to try. (What are you going to try to sue for? Malpractice? Good luck with that.)

You were recorded throughout the night. You "know" you only slept 45 minutes. Well, I guess you could go to the recording for the true story.

I don't know what you do for work, but sleep apnea can definitely lead to daytime hypersomnolence and falling asleep suddenly. Depending on what you do, that could kill someone. I don't blame the doc for wanting to inform your employer that you may be a danger--if you do fall asleep and kill someone, he could have some liability there.

I sure hope your interaction with the doc wasn't the same as your posting here. I can't imagine that would have gone well. I highly doubt dealing with you would have been worth the money he made.
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Old 04-27-2013, 09:01   #23
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Could they compel your doctor (or mine) to tell them if you or I are, or ever were, on depression meds, etc. which "could" cause you or me to be a "danger"?
Absolutely. Heck, they already can if you have government "insurance". If they're paying for meds and paying for doctor's visits already, how could they not know?
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Old 04-27-2013, 09:10   #24
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You now have a medical record that you have been diagnosed with Sleep Apnea. Feel free to discontinue the test and do not get the machine. Also feel free to be uninsurable in the future because you will not seek appropriate treatment. For life and disability you are currently a high risk (read high cost) insurance patient. You really have no choice at this point but to follow through.

And no, you won't be able to hide it from the insurance company. Even if you do, it is called fraud and you won't get any benefits anyway.

Go ahead, get the test, geez, they aren't bad you sleep with some electrodes hooked up - big deal. Let the ins co pay for most of the machine. My current machine as 27,000 hours on it. Won't go anywhere overnight without it.
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Old 04-27-2013, 09:12   #25
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Everyone I know that takes the tests gets a mask, just wait until this summer and pick up a few at the yard sales.
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