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Old 05-12-2013, 19:15   #76
ArtyGuy
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Originally Posted by happyguy View Post
Interesting debating technique you have there.

It was a CIA post for ****sake. They could talk to anyone that cared to listen.

The NMCC didn't give authorization for movement of the spec ops team from Croatia until 0300 on the 12th.

The C17 that evacuated the first survivors didn't even get a warning order until 0600 on the 12th.

Considering we have tanker assets in Turkey the whole story about not having the ability to do aerial refuling for F16's from Aviano sound suspect to me also.

So why don't you tell us all who staffs the NMCC. Then we can stand in awe of your incredible ability to google Wikipedia entries.


Regards,
Happyguy

P.S. You are right about one thing, you don't know anything about me.
I could care less about you to be quite honest. It's a forum FFS.

I don't need to google the NMCC-- it's called experience. But based upon your comment, you really don't know who staffs it. I'll help--- National Military Command Center. It's not a bunch of guys in ties who them go in front of podiums to give press conferences.

The CIA can't communicate with anybody they want whenever they want. Some things require coordination. Simple stuff like, what comms platform?

A medevac consists of a helicopter, crew and a flight medic. They then take you to a MTF. From there you get transported on FW to a RMC. But you knew all that, right? So the fact a C-17 arrived (too late in your opinion), is pointless. You don't push guys into combat without a plan to get them out.

I don't know what tankers were where. But an F-16 needs fuel and lots of it. Maybe the tankers in Turkey were weathered out, or were aligned against flying sorties to gas planes doing missions elsewhere. But I'm trying to imagine what we are asking the 27 yr old Captain flying the Viper. "Hey, no one knows what's going on. There's no JTAC either. But make it happen". Oh, and we don't have a good idea on the AD threat so don't fly below 20,000 AGL". What could possibly go wrong?
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Old 05-12-2013, 19:27   #77
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I could care less about you to be quite honest. It's a forum FFS.

I don't need to google the NMCC-- it's called experience. But based upon your comment, you really don't know who staffs it. I'll help--- National Military Command Center.


It's not a bunch of guys in ties who them go in front of podiums to give press conferences.

Thank you for illustrating my point for me.

The CIA can't communicate with anybody they want whenever they want. Some things require coordination. Simple stuff like, what comms platform?

A medevac consists of a helicopter, crew and a flight medic. They then take you to a MTF. From there you get transported on FW to a RMC. But you knew all that, right? So the fact a C-17 arrived (too late in your opinion), is pointless. You don't push guys into combat without a plan to get them out.

I don't know what tankers were where. But an F-16 needs fuel and lots of it. Maybe the tankers in Turkey were weathered out, or were aligned against flying sorties to gas planes doing missions elsewhere. But I'm trying to imagine what we are asking the 27 yr old Captain flying the Viper. "Hey, no one knows what's going on. There's no JTAC either. But make it happen". Oh, and we don't have a good idea on the AD threat so don't fly below 20,000 AGL". What could possibly go wrong?
Ferry range of an F16 is 2000 miles. Distance from Aviano to Bengazhi is about 1000 miles. From Bengazhi to Incirlic is about 1300 miles. All refueling could have been done over the med.

And why do you keep droning on about a medevac?

And why does everyone have this preoccupation with special forces? There are security forces at every AFB and transport aircraft come and go at every one of them as well.

It's bad enough that it happened at all.

What's shameful is no one has the balls to step up and say "I made the call." mainly because the man that should have been making the call was getting his beauty rest before a tough fund raiser.

Regards,
Happyguy
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Last edited by happyguy; 05-12-2013 at 19:41..
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Old 05-12-2013, 19:28   #78
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Given the amount of attacks on US embassies and consulates in the Middle East and other conflict prone areas it quite frankly doesn't matter what Obama/the mil/State department did or didn't do when Benghazi was going down. Because the security for US sovereign soil and a duly sworn ambassador shouldn't have been so piss poor to begin with. That alone is a failure worth firing everyone with a hand in it. Any embassy or consulate in such areas should be able to withstand sustained assault until relief assets can arrive on site, and the DSS has been utterly failing in ensuring that this happens. I have never in my life seen more reports of diplomatic casualties under their watch than I have in the last few years, and preventing such things is their PRIMARY function.
Agreed. Seems like a no brainer for any facilities in that region. That doesn't mean every facility can be 100% safe, but the impression I have is this one was nearly completely undefended. I wonder how accurate my impression is, but its woefully inadequate if correct.

Randy
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Old 05-12-2013, 19:31   #79
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Ferry range of an F16 is 2000 miles. Distance from Aviano to Bengazhi is about 1000 miles. From Bengazhi to Incirlic is about 1300 miles. All refueling could have been done over the med.

And why do you keep droning on about a medevac?

Regards,
Happyguy
Halo drops from F16 out of Aviano... now there's a military solution.
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Old 05-12-2013, 19:37   #80
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Didn't take long to find yourself reduced to pathetic ad hominems, now did it?

Hahaha. Looks like you proved your Dear Leader wrong


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Try not failing so hard next time you start speaking out of your arse.
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... they make their money by winding you up and sending you off on emotional tirades.
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Good lord, you can't be this dumb, can you?

So after you start calling out your hallucinations of lies and doing your little victory dance, you're going to try to make it a matter of semantics? Yeah, I guess you're that dumb.

.
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And here comes the peanut gallery. Just to make it clear, for you or any other dunderheads that might be confused.
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And here I was thinking you could read all on your lonesome. .
when it comes to the "Ad Homs" you did build it by yourself.


Typical liberal. Oh, by the way, you used the term "hypocrites" and then you say,

"Didn't take long to find yourself reduced to pathetic ad hominems, now did it?"





You started out with them.

Last edited by countrygun; 05-12-2013 at 19:38..
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Old 05-12-2013, 19:39   #81
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Propaganda? Here I go explaining what actually happened in Libya to people that largely seem unconcerned with the truth and it's propaganda... That's rich.

Here's another word for ya. Hypocrites. They're the kind of people that barely batted an eyelash after the President ignores months worth of intelligence warnings, one of which was entitled "Bin Laden determined to strike in US" and spend months hyperventilating over Benghazi. They're the kind of people that ignore the more than half dozen attacks on US diplomatic facilities that resulted in dozen of deaths during the previous administration and make Benghazi the biggest foreign policy disaster in the last 100 years. They're the kind of people that yawn when an administration has the Secretary of State present a series of provable lies about mobile weapons labs with the direct intent of starting the most expensive and unnecessary war in the history of the world and sit opining on their computers about how Obama's and Clinton's action in Benghazi amount to treason. Hypocrites.
Oh, pardon me, you were there? Wow, it must have been intense. or maybe you were with the state department security watching it real time.

Some how I don't take you for either a mover and a shaker, or a rainmaker, much less a meat eater. Doesn't make you a bad person, just not someone I would go to for the straight skinny. Nothing follows.
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Old 05-12-2013, 19:43   #82
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Halo drops from F16 out of Aviano... now there's a military solution.
Are you suggesting this is a good idea?

Or are you insinuating that I was saying that is a good idea?

You truly are a mindless twit.

Oh shoot, was that an Ad Hominem?

Regards,
Happyguy
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Old 05-12-2013, 19:47   #83
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Hahaha. Looks like you proved your Dear Leader wrong












when it comes to the "Ad Homs" you did build it by yourself.


Typical liberal. Oh, by the way, you used the term "hypocrites" and then you say,

"Didn't take long to find yourself reduced to pathetic ad hominems, now did it?"





You started out with them.
I don't mind a good ad hom, but nothing so pathetic as evoking crack cocaine and gay sex.

But let's try it out.

Countrygun, your argument is invalid because you like to snort cocaine off of Dick Cheney's balls.

See, it still doesn't work.

But I know you put a whole lot of effort in to your comment. Take a moment and enjoy your victory, someone will be along to reinforce it in a moment.
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Old 05-12-2013, 19:49   #84
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Originally Posted by Flintlocker View Post
I don't mind a good ad hom, but nothing so pathetic as evoking crack cocaine and gay sex.

But let's try it out.

Countrygun, your argument is invalid because you like to snort cocaine off of Dick Cheney's balls.

See, it still doesn't work.

But I know you put a whole lot of effort in to your comment. Take a moment and enjoy your victory, someone will be along to reinforce it in a moment.
Thanks Freeflucker you probably just got this thread locked.

NoRegard,
Happyguy
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Old 05-12-2013, 19:51   #85
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Oh, pardon me, you were there? Wow, it must have been intense. or maybe you were with the state department security watching it real time.

Some how I don't take you for either a mover and a shaker, or a rainmaker, much less a meat eater. Doesn't make you a bad person, just not someone I would go to for the straight skinny. Nothing follows.
You weren't there either? Ok, then welcome to the club of your opinions don't mean s#!t too.

You probably spend a lot of time on the internet. You may want to peruse a study of a basic syllogism.
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Old 05-12-2013, 19:52   #86
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Thanks Freeflucker you probably just got this thread locked.

NoRegard,
Happyguy
Let me guess, you didn't read the post that started this exchange.
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Old 05-12-2013, 19:52   #87
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Thanks Freeflucker you probably just got this thread locked.

NoRegard,
Happyguy
How else are we to know we're right? In the absence of a jury, Flint locking his own threads is the most reliable indicator there is.
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Old 05-12-2013, 20:00   #88
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Good lord, you can't be this dumb, can you?

So after you start calling out your hallucinations of lies and doing your little victory dance, you're going to try to make it a matter of semantics? Yeah, I guess you're that dumb.

Perhaps you should go read a timeline of events in Benghazi and inform yourself of what happened.

No matter how you try to skirt the issue, a quick reaction force was sent from Tripoli, more than 400 miles away from Benghazi. One of them died at the CIA compound. These are the facts. Just because you didn't, or don't, comprehend them has no bearing on the truth.
Then, your OP is a lie.

BTW- the rescue team that didn't exist according to Gates was told to stand down.

Quote:
Official: US Special Forces team wasn't allowed to fly to Benghazi during attack
http://openchannel.nbcnews.com/_news...ng-attack?lite
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Old 05-12-2013, 20:03   #89
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How else are we to know we're right? In the absence of a jury, Flint locking his own threads is the most reliable indicator there is.
How else could you possibly find out, unless you read zombie surgeons post that countrygun was responding to.

edit: here it is:

"You really must love how Obama tastes. Sucking him like a junkie sucks a crack pipe."

http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/show...7&postcount=58



It's a microcosm of Benghazi: you'll never know the truth because you refuse to inform yourselves and instead rely on misinformation at every turn. Very apt.

Last edited by Flintlocker; 05-12-2013 at 20:21..
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Old 05-12-2013, 20:10   #90
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I don't mind a good ad hom, but nothing so pathetic as evoking crack cocaine and gay sex.

But let's try it out.

Countrygun, your argument is invalid because you like to snort cocaine off of Dick Cheney's balls.

See, it still doesn't work.

But I know you put a whole lot of effort in to your comment. Take a moment and enjoy your victory, someone will be along to reinforce it in a moment.
There is no victory in pointing out someone else's self inflicted wounds.
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Old 05-12-2013, 20:16   #91
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Are you suggesting this is a good idea?

Or are you insinuating that I was saying that is a good idea?

You truly are a mindless twit.

Oh shoot, was that an Ad Hominem?

Regards,
Happyguy
Yeah, because you or republicans in congress, or FoxNews, or wingnut blogs haven't spent a moment exaggerating an issue for effect or cherry picking talking points to drag political foes through the mud.

No, I didn't actually think you would suggest such a thing. What I'm wondering is what you think F16s out of Ariano would have actually accomplished...
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Old 05-12-2013, 20:20   #92
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Maybe they could just land at the airport like the team did later that morning.



Regards,
Happyguy
Gates said Libyian air space was too dangerous because of missiles, but the US flew forces in the next day. Lie two.

BTW- I watched the Gates interview on CBS. He started off by saying that he only knows what he read in the paper!
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Old 05-12-2013, 20:20   #93
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Didn't take long to find yourself reduced to pathetic ad hominems, now did it?
Just stating the obvious, Obama boi.
Just starting the obvious, nothing more.

Posted from my free Obamaphone
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Old 05-12-2013, 20:22   #94
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Yeah, because you or republicans in congress, or FoxNews, or wingnut blogs haven't spent a moment exaggerating an issue for effect or cherry picking talking points to drag political foes through the mud.

No, I didn't actually think you would suggest such a thing. What I'm wondering is what you think F16s out of Ariano would have actually accomplished...
Well, if Sean Smith was lasing the mortar crew as was reported, they could have blown it to hell.

If he wasn't, they could have run about Mach 1.1 over them at about 200 feet and let the terrorists know the jig was up.

I bet if the 31st FW Wing Commander had asked for a volunteer for that mission and told them that it was probably going to be a one way mission, he would have had every single pilot volunteer.

Regards,
Happyguy

P.S. What is this Ariano?
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Old 05-12-2013, 20:24   #95
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Gates said Libyian air space was too dangerous because of missiles, but the US flew forces in the next day. Lie two.

BTW- I watched the Gates interview on CBS. He started off by saying that he only knows what he read in the paper!

Oh, this has to be repeated so certain people don't miss it.


"BTW- I watched the Gates interview on CBS. He started off by saying that he only knows what he read in the paper!"
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Old 05-12-2013, 20:33   #96
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Secretary of Defense knows nothing but what he read in the paper. I read it. It's real. More news at 11.
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Old 05-12-2013, 20:35   #97
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Secretary of Defense knows nothing but what he read in the paper. I read it. It's real. More news at 11.
I saw that interview.

Regards,
Happyguy
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Old 05-12-2013, 20:56   #98
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Given the amount of attacks on US embassies and consulates in the Middle East and other conflict prone areas it quite frankly doesn't matter what Obama/the mil/State department did or didn't do when Benghazi was going down. Because the security for US sovereign soil and a duly sworn ambassador shouldn't have been so piss poor to begin with. That alone is a failure worth firing everyone with a hand in it. Any embassy or consulate in such areas should be able to withstand sustained assault until relief assets can arrive on site, and the DSS has been utterly failing in ensuring that this happens. I have never in my life seen more reports of diplomatic casualties under their watch than I have in the last few years, and preventing such things is their PRIMARY function.
What I think happened is the Obama administration believed it's own press that the Arab Spring was going to bring enlightened secular democracy to a part of the world that has never had it.

The regime would have to acknowledge it's own dramatic foreign policy failures; in it's mind greater security simply wasn't needed.
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Old 05-12-2013, 20:58   #99
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Oh, this has to be repeated so certain people don't miss it.


"BTW- I watched the Gates interview on CBS. He started off by saying that he only knows what he read in the paper!"
Gates is out of the loop, but CBS used him to protect Obama and released his statements early, it appears.
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Old 05-12-2013, 21:21   #100
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Gates is out of the loop, but CBS used him to protect Obama and released his statements early, it appears.
CBS and Obama suppressed testimony from an open Congress? Do you just imagine your own reality as you go along?
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