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Old 01-13-2004, 13:58   #1
noway
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Q:Organic beef , can you tell the difference?

Title sums it up.?????

I been trying various ALL organic beef and really haven't notice a difference between it vrs Angus choice cuts. The only big difference is the price.
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Old 01-13-2004, 21:52   #2
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People will swear that they taste a difference (also w/ organic veggies, etc), the only difference is that they get their wallets lightened by buying the "organic" stuff. Give me the ranch fed, homone pumped, pesticide sprayed stuff any day.

"wow, you CAN taste the orgainc flavor" ~1 ~1 ~1

Sheesh.


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Old 01-14-2004, 01:27   #3
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I would also pose this question. Can you tell the difference from the higher priced Angus beef from others?
Angus tastes exactly like Hereford, Beefmaster, Santa Gertrudis, and even Holstein.
Its the grade/aging that makes the difference. Prime, aged beef is always better than "still fit for human comsuption" which is what most supermarkets sell.
As far as beef is concerned, I won't buy anything graded lower than choice.
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Old 01-14-2004, 08:21   #4
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{I would also pose this question. Can you tell the difference from the higher priced Angus beef from others?}

yes.... ( see below)

{As far as beef is concerned, I won't buy anything graded lower than choice.}

The problem with that is most store in my area don't have much in choice cuts and I have never seen a "prime" graded beef steak in any of the typical normal stores Choice & Select cuts yes, but no Prime and limited on choice cuts.

BTW: I have to dis-agreed that a diary cow such as Holstein has the same favor and texture of a normal beef cow such as Angus if you equally feed them the same thing. That's why angus is the perfer'd cow for raising for Prime and Choice steaks cuts. It all has todo with the tenderness and mainly the marbling in the cuts of meats and angus family of beef cows provides much better of this vrs a diary cow such as a Holstein.

That would also explain why everybody on my parent county road in Texas also raise Angus for beef industry vrs seeing a Holestein. 2 cows but serve 2 seperate purpose. One is better for diary production and the other for meat production.

True that most diary claves that are "males" are saluaghter for veal since a male diary calves serves a diary farm with nopractical use ( I shouldn't need to explain this, but if you are slow, they have nipples but you ain't going to get milk ). ;f

Now back on subject, have anybody that ever eaten Kobe Beef or Argentine grass feed beef could tell the difference from what we sell in the local stores as organic beef? I vaguely remember these 2 beef that I have had, where very nice in flavor and supposely the 2 mentionare all grass-fed and no corn-fed or hormones.
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Old 01-14-2004, 10:16   #5
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beef without

The chemical that makes them retain water.

I hate it when I cook a piece of beef and it gives off enough water to make soup.

Also some of the guys making hamburger grind ice with the meat adding 1/3 to 1/2 water weight.
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Old 01-14-2004, 23:54   #6
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The problem with that is most store in my area don't have much in choice cuts and I have never seen a "prime" graded beef steak in any of the typical normal stores Choice & Select cuts yes, but no Prime and limited on choice cuts.
----------------

You should find a butcher/raise your own.
----------------

That's why angus is the perfer'd cow for raising for Prime and Choice steaks cuts.
----------------
According to whom?
----------------

One is better for diary production and the other for meat production.
----------------

USDA studies suggest that there is no significant difference in $ invested/pounds of meat produced irregardless of breed (discounting genetic flaws like severe inbreeding). In simplistic terms, breed doesn't make a significant difference in beef sold for slaughter. Beef sold for breed recognition is just marketed better through breeder associations.
----------------
True that most diary claves that are "males" are saluaghter for veal since a male diary calves serves a diary farm with nopractical use ( I shouldn't need to explain this, but if you are slow, they have nipples but you ain't going to get milk ).
----------------
HHMMMMMM, these "males," or bulls/steers as we in the business call them, would be needed to propogate the herd if they were of desireable breeding.
-----------------
Now back on subject, have anybody that ever eaten Kobe Beef or Argentine grass feed beef could tell the difference from what we sell in the local stores as organic beef? I vaguely remember these 2 beef that I have had, where very nice in flavor and supposely the 2 mentionare all grass-fed and no corn-fed or hormones.
-----------------
These are totally different. Grass fed/finished beef tastes different because of diet and is leaner, but may have been grain fed most of its life. Kobe beef (Wagyu) is raised in a peaceful and nurturing environment ;9. They are fed beer in the summer to stimulate their appetite, massaged to relax them, and have their coats brushed with sake. Hence, the $$$$$$$$$/pound.
-----------------
I hate it when I cook a piece of beef and it gives off enough water to make soup.
----------------
Me too. Especially with hamburger, organs get ground with the meat and produce water.
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Old 01-14-2004, 23:57   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by MDT
People will swear that they taste a difference (also w/ organic veggies, etc), the only difference is that they get their wallets lightened by buying the "organic" stuff. Give me the ranch fed, homone pumped, pesticide sprayed stuff any day.

"wow, you CAN taste the orgainc flavor" ~1 ~1 ~1

Sheesh.


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Amen. ;i
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Old 01-15-2004, 07:56   #8
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{You should find a butcher/raise your own.}

Kinda hard todo when you live in a apt/house in a city, don't you think?

{According to whom? }

Almost every top professional 5 star steak house.

Whens the last time you read a menu that was worded;

Here at "insert steakhouse name" we use only primed aged Holstein/Jersey/Hereford/Brahman/etc.... for our ribs/steaks/etc......

The taste we like and that rates higher are from cuts of meats like thoose of a angus or cows crossberd with the angus. The fact is for beef industry everthing is rated aganist the agnus.

{ USDA studies suggest that there is no significant difference in $ invested/pounds of meat produced irregardless of breed (discounting genetic flaws like severe inbreeding). In simplistic terms, breed doesn't make a significant difference in beef sold for slaughter. Beef sold for breed recognition is just marketed better through breeder associations.}

Try getting the same quality and most importantly quanity of milk out of a Angus vrs a Holstein/Jersey.


Or try getting the Holstein to the same market weight as a Angus and see what one would be easier and quicker.

Hint:It ain't going to happen.

That why one is more perferred as a dairy cow and the other a beef cow. The holstein that was just found to be BSE was born around 1996, and guess what it was probably doing for the 1st 6-7 years of her life till she was slaughter in Dec 2003. Producing milk. Now you going to tell me that cow's meat is going to be of the same quality of a younger quicker/younger brought to market Angus? I don't think so.

{ HHMMMMMM, these "males," or bulls/steers as we in the business call them, would be needed to propogate the herd if they were of desireable breeding.}

just how many Males ( bulls ) do you need to advance or procreate? Guess what not that many , and most cattle farms ( top notch ) don't do it the old fashion way (no need to explain here) but by artificial insemination. They put Bulls semen ( from selected males ) in storage and can draw on this and get as many cow pregant as they want. Alot of male diary cows in a dairy business is "NO" good for a diary farmer. They don't need them or let's say alot of them and they sure as "H" has plenty of semen on ice to be use as needed. Thus diary males are more suit for Veal which is a secondary market for diary-farmers and to re-collect on losts that typical diary farmer would have from his cow when giving birth of a male

a: wasted time (gestation),milk production,etc...
b: stress on COW ( giving birth ,etc....)

BTW: Have you seen the price of a veal Cutlet? ;cool

Please don't let this thread become a battle thread, just stay on subject, which is once again

"Have anybody ever notice organic Beef tasting any different?"
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Old 01-15-2004, 19:14   #9
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I don't eat meat, but I do buy a lot of organic foods because they are safer. What do you think has spurred the increase in certain diseases? Those hormones aren't good for you. Also, the pesticeides used in other country's are usually the ones banned here.
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Old 01-16-2004, 09:00   #10
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Never looked at it that way, very good point.

Let me aksed you something saturn the NON-meat eater, ( lol) in your organic veggies ( assuming you eat veggies ) can you tell the difference from non-organic vegetables?

I bought some organic potatoes a few weeks to try and was not all that amazed. Specially since I paid $1 more than my normal potatoes.
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Old 01-16-2004, 16:53   #11
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No I cannot tell the difference! When I am at work I occasionally eat canned veggies that are not organic and they taste just like the organic.
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Old 01-17-2004, 08:23   #12
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http://www.skeltonsnaturalbeef.com/retail.htm

I know these people and they did ship boxes,I think.
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Old 01-17-2004, 12:25   #13
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Spill some money, get yourselves some cuts of that Japanese Kobe beef and then tell me if you can't tell the difference between organically-raised beef and hormone-fed beef.

I must confess that I can't tell the difference in the taste and texture between organically-raised veggies and mass-produced, fast-growth-tailored veggies. But I can definitely tell if the meat is or not. It's more telling in fowl than with the four-legged kind.
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Old 01-17-2004, 19:58   #14
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by noway

Here at "insert steakhouse name" we use only primed aged Holstein/Jersey/Hereford/Brahman/etc.... for our ribs/steaks/etc......

The taste we like and that rates higher are from cuts of meats like thoose of a angus or cows crossberd with the angus. The fact is for beef industry everthing is rated aganist the agnus.

The truth is Angus isn't the best beef. Sorry to bust your bubble but you have fallen to all the hype as well. Check this out:

http://www.theamericanbeefjournal.co...article08.html

The fact is alot of certified Angus beef is actually a very small percent Angus. Alot of Angus beef is Holstein. Don't take me wrong Angus can make good cattle, we have some of them. But there are actually better breeds for beef production out there.

P.S. We use an Angus bull so we can get our Bravnviehs black to be sold for more money.
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Old 01-17-2004, 20:00   #15
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Sorry that turned out wrong. Still tryin to figure out the quote thing. This is what I said:

The truth is Angus isn't the best beef. Sorry to bust your bubble but you have fallen to all the hype as well. Check this out:

http://www.theamericanbeefjournal.c.../article08.html

The fact is alot of certified Angus beef is actually a very small percent Angus. Alot of Angus beef is Holstein. Don't take me wrong Angus can make good cattle, we have some of them. But there are actually better breeds for beef production out there.

P.S. We use an Angus bull so we can get our Bravnviehs black to be sold for more money.
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Old 01-20-2004, 10:26   #16
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I've had both grain-fed and grass-fed beef, and when it comes down to it, I'll take the opague fat, marbled cuts of grain-fed beef, over the translucent yellowish fat non-marbled cuts of grass-fed beef.

I realize there are some people who have eaten grass-fed beef exclusively, that will say that grain-fed beef tastes funny. I won't disagree with them, since they're probably used to something with a different taste.

I like my cuts of beef relatively tender, and reasonably priced, too. I haven't noticed anything different when comparing a marbled ribeye steak from the butcher's shop, to the Angus ribeye that you can buy in the stores; they taste similar, and if anything, I prefer my local butcher's cuts.

On a somewhat unrelated note, since we're talking about steaks:

Being the chemist, I've been experimenting with my own steak sauces, and have found this combination to be quite good:

grated fresh horseradish root
crushed garlic buds
light olive oil
white pepper
black pepper
vinegar
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Old 01-20-2004, 11:23   #17
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btw:Interesting sauce. I like everything but the vinegar.


For a experientment, I bought 2 sirloin steaks. One from a organic food store and the other from Win Dixie and cooked both steaks the same way, with same seasonings, same cook time, same doness and cut into strips. I served both steaks strips to 3 different friends and none of them tasted a difference.

So much for organic beef.

Now with that said, a old neighborhood friend of mine dad is trying to get on a "certified angus" listing and organic beef supplier. He has tons of research papers showing the different fatty types of the beef that are grown of all-grain or all-organic diet with the grass feed beef being less fat ( bad type ) and more better for humans healthwise.

One mis-leading fact is 90% of the "so-called oragnic beef" is not 100.00% organic in that most places the young calves where feed special hormones ( via grains feed ) at birth and also feed high protein grain fed before going to market to "cure" or fatten up the beef prior to getting package. So the all organic labeling could be wrong or misleading. Only a few places in the states offers real 100% organic grass feed cows, and it would cost alot more per cow to harvest a cow feed from all grass ( hay/oats/alfa/timonthy/etc...) then from a typical grain cattle feed.

A few of my uncles raise cows and they have both grass and feeds to subsitute for the cattle diet due to the fact that grass isn't always available and sparse in the area they raise their cows at.

So next time you are paying that extra money for organic, remember it might not be 100% organic.
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Old 01-22-2004, 05:50   #18
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Kdx 200, is your cow herd straight blood Braunvieh or cross?
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Old 01-23-2004, 13:29   #19
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JHS, Mostly we run 1/2 Braunvieh 1/2 Angus cows. We have about 45 of those and 8 regristered Brauvieh cows. The last calf crop we had were from the 1/2 angus ones bred to a Braunvieh bull. Talk about some nice hefiers. The Braunvieh really adds the muscle to the angus. But the problem we have here(southern Ohio) is most people are color-blind. So unless our calves are black we take a little hit on the price.
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Old 01-24-2004, 17:32   #20
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Quote:
The Braunvieh really adds the muscle to the angus.
So does Finaplix-H, Component-TH, Ralgro, Synovex-H!!!

It's worth the trouble and money to buy "organic." I can't say I have tasted any difference between he two, but I certainly prefer to buy organic and have no intention of eating anything but "organic" again.

The above listed products are Anabolic/androgenic steroids which are not fed to cattle, but rather implanted in them prior to slaughter (as is the case with Fina and Comp TH). Finaplix and Comp TH are nothing but Trenbolone acetate one of the most powerful and effective anabolic/androgenic steroids known. Synovex-H is intended for use on heifers 400+ pounds in weight. Synovex contains Testosterone propionate (an esterified form of pure testosterone which stays in the blood a little longer than plain unesterified testosterone USP). The purpose, pure and simple is to add weight and improve feeding ability/habits.
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