GlockTalk.com
Home Forums Classifieds Blogs Today's Posts Search Social Groups



  
SIGN-UP
Notices

Glock Talk
Welcome To The Glock Talk Forums.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-24-2004, 18:49   #1
Texas T
CLM Number 23
TX expatriate
 
Texas T's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: W7YBY
Posts: 12,095


Reverse Thrust

Peaches' other thread got me thinking about this. I've seen several aircraft that could back up on their own and been on a few too. If you've ever flown on an MD-80 there is a strong chance that you've backed away from the gate under your own power.

I've seen the Blue Angels support C-130 back up under its own power, and when I was watching Discovery Wings yesterday I saw the C-17 land, stop, back up, and turn around in about a 1500 foot space. That's pretty impressive for a plane that weighs over 250K pounds.

Also got to see video of the C-130 that had been modified for the Iran Hostages rescue mission. It had about 8 sets of JATO rockets at various points around the fuselage because it was designed to land WITHIN a sports stadium and take off again. There is some video of a prototype (crashing) using this system at:
http://www.theaviationzone.com/media...ible_sport.mpg

But I also saw some shots on Wings of another C-130 taking off using this system and they were airborne in about 100-150 feet. ;P

Ahhh... just found some details (don't you just love google?)
http://www.spectrumwd.com/c130/artic...ible_Sport.htm

Here's a shot of it taking off:
The Flight Deck

Close up shot of some of the rockets near the front:
The Flight Deck

I'd like to know what the rate of climb was.
The Flight Deck
__________________
"A gun is a tool, Marion. No better and no worse than any other tool - an axe, a shovel, or anything.
A gun is as good or as bad as the man using it. Remember that." Alan Ladd as Shane (1953)

NRA Life Benefactor Member, AMA Champion Member, AOPA Member, ARRL Member, GOA Life Member
Texas T is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2004, 16:15   #2
Tennessee Slim
CLM Number 93
Señor Member
 
Tennessee Slim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Mucus City, USA
Posts: 6,685
Anything with a thrust reverser (or reversible props) can back up under its own power, but there are three caveats:
1) Reverse thrust kicks up taxiway debris (FOD) which then could get sucked into the engine intake or strike the props (engines are mounted too high on a Mad Dog, this doesn't much apply).
2) A/C typically are loaded with their CG very far aft. Braking while moving backwards could cause the A/C to tip over and crash down onto its tail (so coast to a stop).
3) Most airplanes have no rear view mirrors so it’s best to have clearance from someone who can see where you’re going (ground control).
__________________
It took a Carter to bring us a Reagan

"The principal feature of American liberalism is sanctimoniousness. By loudly denouncing all bad things — war and hunger and date rape — liberals testify to their own terrific goodness. More important, they promote themselves to membership in a self-selecting elite of those who care deeply about such things.... It's a kind of natural aristocracy, and the wonderful thing about this aristocracy is that you don't have to be brave, smart, strong or even lucky to join it, you just have to be liberal."
-- P.J. O'Rourke (1992)
Tennessee Slim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2004, 15:16   #3
STYX
Senior Member
 
STYX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Posts: 586
Send a message via ICQ to STYX Send a message via AIM to STYX
2) A/C typically are loaded with their CG very far aft. Braking while moving backwards could cause the A/C to tip over and crash down onto its tail (so coast to a stop).


hehe... a tail strike from breaking, horrible to explain that one to the chief pilot.

I recall doing a reverse taxi-back @ memphis, are they still done?
__________________
Give Blood, Play Rugby.
STYX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2004, 16:23   #4
Tennessee Slim
CLM Number 93
Señor Member
 
Tennessee Slim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Mucus City, USA
Posts: 6,685
Quote:
Originally posted by STYX
...I recall doing a reverse taxi-back @ memphis, are they still done?
I dunno, I've never worked from MEM. Does something wonky go on there?

When I was with American Eagle (early ‘90s), we had a SAAB experience a tail strike coming in to BNA. The plane had flown in to Ft. Walton/ Eglin AFB full of Air Force types with duffel bags. The station manager failed to remove 11 of their bags from the aftermost cargo area, so the 25,000 pound A/C was 1000+/- pounds heavier (that's 1000 pounds tail heavier) on their return flight to BNA than the crew realized. The flying pilot got a stick shaker on round-out and the A/C mushed through and sort of backwards pancaked, hitting simultaneously on the mains and the keel. They executed a go-around and shot the second approach at Vref +30 (basically a flap approach at a no-flap speed). The second shot was letter-perfect but the Captain needed a whole pack of smokes before he was calm enough for his drug test.

The VPS station manager was fired, as he well should have been.
__________________
It took a Carter to bring us a Reagan

"The principal feature of American liberalism is sanctimoniousness. By loudly denouncing all bad things — war and hunger and date rape — liberals testify to their own terrific goodness. More important, they promote themselves to membership in a self-selecting elite of those who care deeply about such things.... It's a kind of natural aristocracy, and the wonderful thing about this aristocracy is that you don't have to be brave, smart, strong or even lucky to join it, you just have to be liberal."
-- P.J. O'Rourke (1992)
Tennessee Slim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2004, 20:27   #5
STYX
Senior Member
 
STYX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Posts: 586
Send a message via ICQ to STYX Send a message via AIM to STYX
hehe... wow.

Yea, I really like the slabber-dog. I only have ~5 hrs in the Eagle sim, but I enjoyed it.
__________________
Give Blood, Play Rugby.
STYX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2004, 00:53   #6
Superfueler
Glockenplane
 
Superfueler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Manchester, NH
Posts: 837
Send a message via Yahoo to Superfueler
Until recently, pretty much all of AirTran's aircraft powered back from the gate using reverse thrust. I was on board a few times when this was done, and doesn't feel that much different than a normal pushback. I guess now that they are getting 737's, they are going to the normal method of using a tug and a towbar.
__________________
Aviation Forum #1903
Superfueler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2004, 08:34   #7
M2 Carbine
Senior Member
 
M2 Carbine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Texas
Posts: 28,646
I backed up all the time.



Sorry, nobody likes a smartass.;e

;f ;f

The Flight Deck
M2 Carbine is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2004, 09:44   #8
ATL Peach Girl
♥Meezers♥
 
ATL Peach Girl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: The Peach State!!
Posts: 18,243
<----flying on 4 MD-80's starting tomorrow and then again on 7/19/04........

dayum things are packed too and I hate that!! I had no clue they could back away from the gate on their own.......
__________________
The lies you tell are less frightening than the loneliness you would feel if you stopped telling them.
ATL Peach Girl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2004, 10:28   #9
Superfueler
Glockenplane
 
Superfueler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Manchester, NH
Posts: 837
Send a message via Yahoo to Superfueler
Quote:
Originally posted by ATL Peach Girl
flying on 4 MD-80's starting tomorrow and then again on 7/19/04........
Wow, what is your routing to fly on 4 Mad Dog's in a row?
__________________
Aviation Forum #1903
Superfueler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2004, 21:55   #10
Pat Beckley
Member
 
Pat Beckley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Surprise, AZ USA
Posts: 39


Reference backing up with reverse thrust: It is done with feet on the floor. Forward thrust is used to "brake" the backward movement. Any use of brakes would result in a tail strike, frowned upon by the maintenance department.
__________________
Speak Softly, carry a big glock.
Pat Beckley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2004, 10:12   #11
NetNinja
Always Faithful
 
NetNinja's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: HotLanta, GA
Posts: 2,424
Yep Our Marine Corps KC-130's would only back up in rare circumstances.
__________________
G17,G22,G30,Sig P229 Sport
Kimber CC Series 1,Kimber CCR Series 1
SA TRP Operator SA 1911A1
S&W 1911, 686, M19, 627VComp,ColtDE10mm
Anschutz 1813 Super Match
NetNinja is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:54.



Homepage
FAQ
Forums
Calendar
Advertise
Gallery
GT Wiki
GT Blogs
Social Groups
Classifieds


Users Currently Online: 1,128
308 Members
820 Guests

Most users ever online: 2,244
Nov 11, 2013 at 11:42