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Old 05-07-2006, 18:00   #1
WI-Guy
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Training with live weapons

Received an email from a friend of mine in the Army that surprised me and I would like to check on its veracity. He just did his first IDPA course at my suggestion.

He told me that Army do alot of training with "cold" (unloaded) weapons. That isn't news, hopefully everyone who handles weapons does a lot of dryfire and cold weapon training.

He also told me that all military rangework is done cold. In fact, military personnel never practice drawing, tactical maneuveres, barricade, etc with live weapons. He said the IDPA course is the first time he had ever drawn a loaded weapon or run with a loaded weapon in his hand. This was news to me.

Is it true? He also said he thinks the Marines do the same, is that true?
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Old 05-08-2006, 07:45   #2
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Live-fire training

His experience with live fire training is determined by his length of service time and MOS (job) in the Army. As an active duty NCO with almost 10 years in, I have done more than my share of live ammunition training while behind cover and on the move while shooting, as well as reacting to targets. But, I'm an infantry leader, and I'm in the sand at the moment so training is key.
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Old 05-09-2006, 00:10   #3
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+1 on time in service and MOS, also depends on assignment.

Can't speak for anyone else but myself. I'm in the Army Reserve with around 4 years in. I've most of my training with blanks. IET, AT's, and NCO academy- we used a blank firing adaptor and blanks on our weapons. For a clerk in the motor pool, I've done a good amount of tactical drills.

Believe it or not, leadership in the units I've seen worry quite a bit about risk management: they don't want people to get hurt unless it's down range.
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Old 05-13-2006, 04:40   #4
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I was an infantry LT back in the mid-70's.

The biggest thing to remember is budget. In peacetime, unless you are an elite unit, your ammo budget it severely limited. You might do nothing but the standard range qualification in a given year. In training, you use a lot of blanks. That said, we did some live move out ranges, platoon, squad, and individual. Not enough, in my opinion.

But one of my smack using privates did manage to shoot himself in the foot. Lucky for him, it was a clean thru and thru.

But when a unit is actually going to war, the funds spigot generally gets turned on, and the troops get brought up to speed.
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Old 05-13-2006, 21:06   #5
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It's not the same in the Marines. I did quite a few live fire training exercises in my first six months of being in. (during school of infantry aka SOI).

I joined the National Guard after I got out of the Corps. Before deploying to Iraq we did a live fire assault course. So if they do live fire training in the guard I'd think they'd do it on active? I'm sure it greatly depends on your unit though.
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Old 05-18-2006, 08:49   #6
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navy is no where near that...

i've got about 5 years in the navy. everything i've seen being done with weapons is either target shooting for quals, or just plain old talk through training. i'm an engineer so my experience with military firearms are VERY limited.the only ones i know of that actually do some sort of tactical training are the VBSS teams (visit board search and seasure) and they use a paintball 9mm round ( live ammo with a paint ball balistic) that is the whole reason behind me starting to shoot IDPA. i am getting tired of standing at a range in one position punching holes in a paper target.
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Old 05-18-2006, 09:08   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by Trent0341
It's not the same in the Marines. I did quite a few live fire training exercises in my first six months of being in. (during school of infantry aka SOI).

SNIP
My comments refer to AFTER basic, AIT, service schools, and while assigned to units. The quality of training at service schools WAS higher than at the unit level.
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Old 05-18-2006, 14:03   #8
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Guess it depends on his MOS. I did my fair share of training with live rounds while I was in. Most if not all of those included running, jumping, breaching wire obstacles/minfields.
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Old 05-21-2006, 01:25   #9
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sorry but the marines and army cannot stand up to each other in comparison



and yes marines have some good live fire time... especially training missions before deployments
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Old 06-18-2006, 12:41   #10
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The USMC has a lot of live fire exercises. I've done quite a few shooting on the move courses, including the MEU(SOC) qual course, which is 50 rounds from the rifle, and it encompasses standing, kneeling, prone, shooting on the move, and tactical and speed reloads.

Today I qualified with the 9mm, along with a bunch of officers. One of the things we had to do - in four seconds - was to draw our condition 1 (loaded) pistol, take the safety off, and fire two rounds, then put the weapon back on safe and holster it. We also had eight seconds to draw, fire two rounds, change mags, and fire two more rounds.

What is the point of only loading the pistol when you draw it from the holster?
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