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Old 03-12-2007, 15:44   #26
mouser
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LIST PULLED - see this thread
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Old 03-12-2007, 16:14   #27
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Anyone have a list of advertisers?
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Old 03-12-2007, 16:23   #28
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I asked that question earlier, on the other thread. No one's listed any yet. I tried to find a few on the website, but have only found Verizon. We need a paper to try to get the local advertisers.
I'm not expecting to find any Roanoke Times in Alexandria, unfortunately.

I think the paper also needs to understand that their columnist will be expected to be held accountable should anyone be harmed from that irresponsible, arrogant, bullying (he didn't think he would be at any risk for getting in CCW's faces) jerk. Maybe VCDL will have an idea as to how to have law enforcement look at possible reckless endangerment charges.
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Old 03-12-2007, 17:05   #29
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http://www.roanoke.com/gunpermits/


The Roanoke Times Removes Database of Handgun Permit Holders

March 12, 2007 — The Roanoke Times has decided to remove the online database of registered concealed handgun permit holders from its website.

The newspaper is requesting the Virginia State Police, which provided the information, verify the data.

“When we posted the information, we had every reason to believe that the data the State Police had supplied would comply with the statutes. But people have notified us that the list includes names that should not have been released,” said Debbie Meade, president and publisher of The Roanoke Times. “Out of a sense of caution and concern for the public we have decided to take the database off of our website.”

The database was posted on roanoke.com on Sunday as part of a New River Valley editorial page column about open records. This column, as well as others that will be published this week, is part of a special focus on Sunshine Week, a national initiative to raise awareness about open government and freedom of information.


http://blogs.roanoke.com/roundtable/...column_12.html
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Old 03-12-2007, 17:52   #30
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Ive found these:

http://www.dixiebuildingproducts.com/

http://www.windowworldinc.com/

I think VCDL is on this as we speak.
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Old 03-12-2007, 19:45   #31
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There should be an apology somewhere in their words...BUT, I ain't putting money on it.

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Old 03-12-2007, 22:19   #32
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wow

what more can you say..

Amazing how stupid some folks can be on purpose. He wanted sensationalism, he got it.. I just really truly pray that no one suffers ill effects from this however doubtful that may be. Oh geez.. there i go bringing religion into it.. i should be ashamed.. NOT..

geez..

Jeff.
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Old 03-13-2007, 04:56   #33
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Dont let this thing stall guys, keep emailing and harassing people....I want this guy in the unemployment line.


Dont let the momentum of Zumbo, HR1022 and the DC ban be lost
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Old 03-13-2007, 09:06   #34
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I have not looked into this at all legally, but I'm wondering why the VSP sent them this information in the first place, and if it was proper for them to release this information at all. I'm sure there are others looking into it.
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Old 03-13-2007, 11:20   #35
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Class Action Suit?

I'm no legal expert, but I am hoping that someone finds a way to form this into a class action suit against the RT and/or Christian.

Nothing like being sued by 130K+ Virginians who have proved themselves to be law abiding citizens!
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Old 03-13-2007, 11:55   #36
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Quote:
Originally posted by MD2010
You know I kept putting off my membership to VDCL...mainly out of laziness i guess. Just signed up with my credit card. This guy is an arrogant, sanctimonious son of a ***** who couches his political liberalism and self-righteousness in his Hurst style writing. There is nothing responsible about his journalism and I am enraged at the way he has portrayed gun owners. His lack of decorum towards others is mind boggeling and I intend to write him an email this afternoon once I calm down a little.
I just joined VCDL today too...as the direct result of this situation.
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Old 03-13-2007, 12:25   #37
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Re: Class Action Suit?

Quote:
Originally posted by fohmix
I'm no legal expert, but I am hoping that someone finds a way to form this into a class action suit against the RT and/or Christian.

Nothing like being sued by 130K+ Virginians who have proved themselves to be law abiding citizens!
Not gonna happen. First Amendment almost certainly protects them on this one. If anybody made a mistake, and can be sued, it will be the Commonwealth.
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Old 03-13-2007, 12:32   #38
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I went to the Roanoke Times site today and clicked on a link to all of their employees and I could not find the origional author of the story on CHP's. Maybe they let him go? Anyone know if this is true?
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Old 03-13-2007, 14:09   #39
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You know...

I noticed Roanoke.com has a privacy policy:

http://www.roanoke.com/newsservices/wb/xp-59616

In it there are terms and conditions for people who submit content. One of those conditions is:
Quote:
"You agree not to submit Content...That includes personal or identifying information about another person, or uses the name or likeness of another person for commercial purposes, without that person's explicit consent;"
Pity Trejbal and the editorial board of this paper can't be bothered to abide by the terms they demand from everyone else....


ETA: Another nugget from their privacy policy:

Quote:
We will not disclose any personal information without your advance permission except when we believe the law requires us to do so or the disclosure is necessary to protect the rights or property of Times-World Corp.
I don't believe they got my advance permission before they disclosed my personal information on their website.....
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Old 03-13-2007, 18:05   #40
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Old 03-13-2007, 20:21   #41
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Quote:
Originally posted by Auburn
I just joined VCDL today too...as the direct result of this situation.
+1, I should have done it a long time ago and have put it off. They are great, every gun owner in VA should do what they can to support them.
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Old 03-14-2007, 06:44   #42
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I'm going to reactivate my membership myself! Even though I don't agree with the VCDL's methods 100% of the time, thier action in Roanoke deserves every Virginia gun owners support!

Way to go Phil!
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Old 03-14-2007, 07:23   #43
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I am curious

I am curious...
Does anyone have a copy of the 135,000 persons with CCP/CCW, they would E-Mail me. The names only! Without the addresses and Social Security Numbers.
I do not accept private mail so, post and I will let you know how to get it to me.
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Old 03-14-2007, 15:32   #44
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Actually, it is illegal to put out or post the addresses, phone numbers, or places of employment of crime victims, or the same of the victims and family of domestic violence, family violence, or sexual crimes. As some CHP holders fall under this group, it was illegal to post their addreses, and it was illegal for the state police to give them to him. I already have an attorney looking into it, as we fall into this category.
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Old 03-14-2007, 16:20   #45
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If you have some time to hit all the companies that do business with the Roanoke Times here is the list....

http://www.roanoke.com/BizListings/
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Old 03-14-2007, 16:30   #46
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Response from RT

We have received your e-mail regarding the Concealed Handgun Permit database, and your comments are important to us.



We removed the database from our website on Monday afternoon. At this time, we have no plans to publish this information again.



Our editorial content this week will continue to promote Sunshine Week, and the importance of open government and public records.



Regards,



Dan Radmacher

Editorial Page Editor

The Roanoke Times
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Old 03-14-2007, 17:51   #47
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Here's a great editorial I found over on ARF from the local newspaper in Shelbyville TN:

link

Publishing addresses legal, but not right
Wednesday, March 14, 2007
By Brian Mosely

You might not have noticed, but this is Sunshine Week, where news outlets across the country focus on the importance of open government and public records.

This is a good idea, since an Associated Press survey of all 50 states found that open meetings and records laws are "sporadically enforced," and that "penalties for failure to comply are mild and violators almost always walk away with nothing more than a reprimand."

This writer and many of my co-workers over the years have dealt with this situation at one time or another. Secret meetings and the refusal to release documents are still encountered in this business, although not as frequently as in the past.

But a Virginia paper used this occasion not to expose wrongdoings or to call for accountability in their local governments. Instead, the Roanoke Times used Sunshine Week to justify publishing the names and addresses on their website of over 135,000 people in the New River Valley who has a concealed handgun permit.

To those who would say that it is none of the public's business if someone is packing heat, the paper's editorial writer, Christian Trejbal, disagreed by saying "the government handles the permitting, it is everyone's business."

"There are good reasons the records are open to public scrutiny. People might like to know if their neighbors carry. Parents might like to know if a member of the carpool has a pistol in the glove box. Employers might like to know if employees are bringing weapons to the office."

Trejbal even admitted that some of the data was probably inaccurate, but they published it anyway. One part of the editorial really stuck out though: "A state that eagerly puts sex offender data online complete with an interactive map could easily do the same with gun permits, but it does not."

Well, Mr. Trejbal, that's because sex offenders are convicted criminals, where as citizens who have applied for a handgun permit are not. What is disturbing is that Mr. Trejbal appears to be equating law-abiding gun owners with perverts, which says a lot about his mind-set.

Why not post everyone's name and address on welfare and food stamps, or post the medical records, names and addresses of everyone who uses Medicaid? Should we post how much each taxpayer pays or owes? How about we post everyone's driver's license numbers, Social Security information and the names and addresses of everyone who ...

You see where this is going ... I'm sure identity thieves would love those types of stories. It is obvious that the only reason Mr. Trejbal wanted this information published is his anti-gun bias, because his column also included this:

"This is not about being for or against guns. There are plenty of reasons people choose to carry weapons: fear of a violent ex-lover, concern about criminals or worry that the king of England might try to get into your house."

Ho, Ho.

Actually, this could save the lives of area criminals since the paper might as well have titled the gun permit list "People You Should Not Mess With." They could have been even more helpful had they published a map of places to avoid ... and homes less likely to be dangerous to break into. Perhaps they should print maps of people with expensive jewelry, rare coin collections, and valuable artwork as well.

To say there was an outcry from the public over the paper's move would be an understatement. On the newspaper's Internet message board, there were complaints from law enforcement officials who have concealed-carry permits for when they are off-duty. It would appear they are not too happy about having their names and addresses published so that anyone with a grudge can find them and their families.

One message came from a women who claimed that her ex-husband had used the list to track her down and had already contacted her. "I've moved twice to get away from a violent ex. Now I have to move again. I really appreciate you publishing my address. Gee, thanks."

On Monday afternoon, the paper pulled the database from its site. The president and publisher of the Roanoke Times, Debbie Meade, said that she was "concerned enough about complaints from readers to act out of an abundance of caution."

"Our concern is that if the information should have been protected, and it wasn't, then we don't want to run it," Meade said.

But the damage has already been done. If even one person is harmed due to the actions of this writer and the editors, it wouldn't be too difficult to imagine a class action suit being filed over such an invasion of privacy.

The fact is, there's a big difference between using your job as a journalist to uncover the truth and to harass citizens whose choices you disagree with by publishing their addresses for the world to see. The Sunshine Laws are there so we can have transparent government, not so a reporter can "out" those he or she ideologically opposes.

What Mr. Trejbal did may have been legal ... but that doesn't make it right. Instead, it was very, very wrong.
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Old 03-14-2007, 20:44   #48
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Re: Response from RT

Quote:
Originally posted by Slinger646
We have received your e-mail regarding the Concealed Handgun Permit database, and your comments are important to us.
We removed the database from our website on Monday afternoon. At this time, we have no plans to publish this information again.
Our editorial content this week will continue to promote Sunshine Week, and the importance of open government and public records.

Regards,
Dan Radmacher

Editorial Page Editor

The Roanoke Times
Received the same email....
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Old 03-14-2007, 20:51   #49
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Re: I am curious

Quote:
Originally posted by MADISON
I am curious...
Does anyone have a copy of the 135,000 persons with CCP/CCW, they would E-Mail me. The names only! Without the addresses and Social Security Numbers.
I do not accept private mail so, post and I will let you know how to get it to me.
MADISON, why don't we just let the list fade away...

Thanks...
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Old 03-15-2007, 10:45   #50
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Quote:
Originally posted by Gunfixr
Actually, it is illegal to put out or post the addresses, phone numbers, or places of employment of crime victims, or the same of the victims and family of domestic violence, family violence, or sexual crimes. As some CHP holders fall under this group, it was illegal to post their addreses, and it was illegal for the state police to give them to him. I already have an attorney looking into it, as we fall into this category.
They weren't posted as such, or identified as such. Their employers weren't posted, either, as far as I know.

If I post your name in the paper because you won the lottery, or because you were crowned the county fair queen, the fact that you also happen to be a prior victim of a crime is irrelevant. You don't get put on a "no publish" list just because you were victimized before, if the reason for publishing your name has nothing to do with your prior victimization.

Let me know what your attorney finds. I strongly suspect that there is no recourse against the paper, only - maybe - against the Commonwealth for releasing the info in the first place.
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