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Old 03-02-2008, 13:03   #1
betyourlife
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Celox Trauma wound treatment, any good?

http://www.allthingsfirstaid.com/Cel...Sam-Cel-15.asp

I was thinking of buying some for my first aid kit for the purpose of treating major bleeding from GS wounds and the like if the SHTF. Figured I would ask the guys here who treat trauma wounds all the time and know that works best.

Also, curious to know what you recommend as an addition to a FAK that I can carry in a pack as part of other servival/backpacking equipment.

I wish my vicodin and antibiotics would keep forever but unfortunately they won't.
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Old 03-02-2008, 13:24   #2
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I know they use either that, or something very similar to it in the military. A coworker of mine went to a trauma class at Fort Bragg the other week, and they slit a pig's carotid artery, letting it bleed for a bit, and then poured the stuff into the wound. It clotted off, and stopped the bleeding. Pretty impressive for an arterial bleed to get stopped without any direct pressure.
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Old 03-02-2008, 14:22   #3
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Impressive, thanks for the info. Anyone else have any experience with this stuff?
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Old 04-01-2008, 06:34   #4
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Old 04-01-2008, 11:13   #5
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We carry Quick Clot here, haven't had a chance to use it yet but the video that I was shown was pretty impressive.
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Old 04-04-2008, 09:38   #6
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Our opinions really mean nothing. You should be talking to the medical control doctor for your area. Its really his decision whether you use that stuff while acting as a medical professional with your fire department or ambulance.
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Old 04-04-2008, 10:14   #7
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We carry it and I have saw it used once. It worked great when a pt threw his arm through a window and the glass left a nice wound on the inside of his arm.
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Old 04-04-2008, 11:33   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DTLarson View Post
Our opinions really mean nothing. You should be talking to the medical control doctor for your area. Its really his decision whether you use that stuff while acting as a medical professional with your fire department or ambulance.

Nowhere in his post did he state that he worked for a fire or EMS service, or that it was to be used for job related duties. He stated he wanted to know if it was worth him buying for his first aid or SHTF kit, and decided to come here to get opinions from those of us that do deal with this stuff on a regular basis.
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Old 04-14-2008, 09:34   #9
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<-- We as my PD are not authorized to carry it neither does the OMD authorize it in my area.
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Old 04-14-2008, 13:12   #10
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disclaimer: i am in no way an expert on this stuff, but i had the same question as you and did a bunch of reasearch awhile ago. here is what i learned for whatever it is worth...

these substances aparently work by starting a chemical reaction that essentially sucks all the water out of the blood...which makes the blood clot very quickly.

at first i was thinking of quick clot, but it seems the chemical reaction it induces is highly exothermic and can potentially rather seriously burn the patient and/or the person administering it.

the chemical reaction celox induces is apparently not exothermic...or at least not nearly as exothermic...and does not risk burning the patient or the administrator. but, it seems that celox works just as well as quick clot.

in either case, it is better to not use the stuff if you do not need to (i.e., you can control the bleeding in some other way such as with direct or indirect pressure).

the main reason seems to be that all those little pieces of celox or quick clot need to be cleaned out of the wound before it is treated at the hospital. (and, in the case of quick clot, at least, there is also the issue of it burning--and thus further damaging--the tissue.)

of course, if the bleeding cannot be controlled any other way, none of the above is as important as not letting the person bleed to death.

based on all that, i have decided to carry a couple packets of celox in my first aid kit.

again, i am by no means an expert...the above is just what i could gather from doing some research on the internet.
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Old 04-14-2008, 13:47   #11
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Your research on the quick clot was info on the first generation. The new stuff (or 2nd generation) comes in a tea bag like bag. It still does the same stuff as before but does not reach the temp of 140 as before. The new stuff reaches temp of like 105 if I recall.

There are many version of the 2nd gen quick clot out there including some that can be bought at sporting good stores that contain silver for it's anti-infection properties.
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Old 04-14-2008, 14:01   #12
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thanks for the info ryan.
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Old 04-14-2008, 18:14   #13
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Out of curiosity, I just asked my wife (emergency RN at an emergency clinic) if she had seen any of this "quickclot" type stuff, and she said no. She also said that there has been no discussion or info about it if they run into it. Granted, is not a full emergency department, but I am surprised that some gung-ho admin hasn't made up some "required" classes for this stuff.

I figure eventually they would run into this stuff.
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Old 04-14-2008, 19:08   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tvov View Post
Out of curiosity, I just asked my wife (emergency RN at an emergency clinic) if she had seen any of this "quickclot" type stuff, and she said no. She also said that there has been no discussion or info about it if they run into it. Granted, is not a full emergency department, but I am surprised that some gung-ho admin hasn't made up some "required" classes for this stuff.

I figure eventually they would run into this stuff.
The only way the local hospital would run into this stuff is if the local emergency responders were carrying it, which would then fall back on the local medical director's approval. This stuff is not quite as widely accepted in civilian EMS markets as it is in the military. I imagine something like this could become more widely used in more rural areas where transport times are longer. For shorter transport time services, they're more likely going to stick with direct pressure applications.
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Old 04-14-2008, 19:20   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by medic1213 View Post
Nowhere in his post did he state that he worked for a fire or EMS service, or that it was to be used for job related duties. He stated he wanted to know if it was worth him buying for his first aid or SHTF kit, and decided to come here to get opinions from those of us that do deal with this stuff on a regular basis.
Thank you for having good reading comprehension skills.
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Old 04-14-2008, 23:25   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by medic1213 View Post
The only way the local hospital would run into this stuff is if the local emergency responders were carrying it, which would then fall back on the local medical director's approval. This stuff is not quite as widely accepted in civilian EMS markets as it is in the military. I imagine something like this could become more widely used in more rural areas where transport times are longer. For shorter transport time services, they're more likely going to stick with direct pressure applications.
I work rural EMS with transport times ranging anywhere from 30 minutes to an hour and we don't use it. It would be nice to have for the real serious bleeds that we can't control.

For a personal SHTF bag it's not a bad idea as long as you use it with some common sense. If I have a bleeding wound I can control I'm not gonna use that stuff. I'f I'm spurting blood from one of my major arteries I'd run over an old lady to get to the stuff.
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