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Old 08-19-2008, 19:39   #41
Civitas
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Originally Posted by ArkinDomino View Post
My groups are getting better! I also tried a "Blind" experiment at the range with my R.O. he is already a good shoot but this part made him great with my G19.
How did you do the "experiment"? How much improvement did you see?
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Old 08-20-2008, 13:17   #42
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How much improvement did you see?
This is what I want to know too. I'd appreciate hearing from anyone about this.

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Old 08-21-2008, 12:47   #43
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Just got mine in today, and while it isn't visually much wider than factory, it makes a HUGE difference. It might be awhile before I get range results though.
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Old 08-21-2008, 19:54   #44
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I think that 99.99% of Glock aftermarket crap is just that: crap. HOWEVER, this piqued my interest as it addresses the barrel lockup which is critical to accuracy. So I called Mr. Graham and ordered two today. I will use this part like a courstesy car to a cathouse and report back.
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Old 08-21-2008, 20:14   #45
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Originally Posted by BOGE View Post
I think that 99.99% of Glock aftermarket crap is just that: crap. HOWEVER, this piqued my interest as it addresses the barrel lockup which is critical to accuracy. So I called Mr. Graham and ordered two today. I will use this part like a courstesy car to a cathouse and report back.
And many will thank you for your support!

I have one, but haven't had a chance to use it yet.
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Old 08-21-2008, 20:41   #46
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I sent a M/O on Mon. Hopefully I get mine soon. Cant wait to try it out.
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Old 08-21-2008, 22:37   #47
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Seems as though a forest fire has been started around Mr. Graham's MGSL. 1000 plus round later and mine keeps getting better and better. I believe this may be the most important must have part for the Glock pistols, aside from new sights. Thanks again TR and keep up the outstanding work. TXPOFF
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Old 08-21-2008, 23:50   #48
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Got mine today. Will have range report tomorrow. So far, very impressed, and yes, it does fit on current production CCF guns (mine's a 12xx serial number).
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Old 08-22-2008, 12:57   #49
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HOW does it work?

No disrespect to TR or to anyone who has fired a Glock with the MGSL, but I do not see how it helps. I have not tested a gun with one, so I will have to believe those of you who have tested one.

The slide lock does not "address lockup" as BOGE stated. Take the slidelock out of your gun & slip the slide/barrel assembly back on. The locking block pulls the assembly out of - & into - lockup. The slide lock simply determines how far the assembly moves forward on the guide rails before stopping. A thicker, better machined, & wider slide stop will just make stop farther to the rear by the extra thickness of the stop.

Once, I installed a factory slide stop in backward. That makes the slide sit back so much farther (because no groove on the other side) that it is noticable. The gun worked OK like this for several months. Afer I noticed the slide hanging over rear of the frame. I investigated & installed the stop correctly.

Maybe someone can explain to me - & anyone else who wants to know - HOW the MGSL works. General references to "better quality", "more precise", etc. still do not explain HOW that makes a Glock group better. If I knew that it would help, I would buy some, at least for my USPSA guns.
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Old 08-22-2008, 13:04   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noponer View Post
No disrespect to TR or to anyone who has fired a Glock with the MGSL, but I do not see how it helps. I have not tested a gun with one, so I will have to believe those of you who have tested one.

The slide lock does not "address lockup" as BOGE stated. Take the slidelock out of your gun & slip the slide/barrel assembly back on. The locking block pulls the assembly out of - & into - lockup. The slide lock simply determines how far the assembly moves forward on the guide rails before stopping. A thicker, better machined, & wider slide stop will just make stop farther to the rear by the extra thickness of the stop.

Once, I installed a factory slide stop in backward. That makes the slide sit back so much farther (because no groove on the other side) that it is noticable. The gun worked OK like this for several months. Afer I noticed the slide hanging over rear of the frame. I investigated & installed the stop correctly.

Maybe someone can explain to me - & anyone else who wants to know - HOW the MGSL works. General references to "better quality", "more precise", etc. still do not explain HOW that makes a Glock group better. If I knew that it would help, I would buy some, at least for my USPSA guns.

I'm sure T.R. Graham will be along shortly to explain the "how" to you. If not, I suggest giving him a call. He's a great guy to deal with and his gun knowledge is far beyond mine. He explained the "how" to me in great detail. With that all said, my G23 and two G27's have all exhibited noticeably tighter groups with the MGSL.
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Old 08-22-2008, 15:08   #51
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Anyone know how it works?
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Old 08-22-2008, 15:14   #52
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Originally Posted by skyboss_4evr View Post
I'm sure T.R. Graham will be along shortly to explain the "how" to you. If not, I suggest giving him a call. He's a great guy to deal with and his gun knowledge is far beyond mine. He explained the "how" to me in great detail. With that all said, my G23 and two G27's have all exhibited noticeably tighter groups with the MGSL.
Perhaps T.R. will explain here in GT... & I appreciate your suggestion to call him. Of course, he may prefer that I buy his video.

However, since he explained to you in great detail, I assume you are satisfied with the answer. Why not pass it along to us? It seems the answer would be fairly simple for such a simple part.
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Old 08-22-2008, 17:06   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noponer View Post
No disrespect to TR or to anyone who has fired a Glock with the MGSL, but I do not see how it helps. I have not tested a gun with one, so I will have to believe those of you who have tested one.

The slide lock does not "address lockup" as BOGE stated. Take the slidelock out of your gun & slip the slide/barrel assembly back on. The locking block pulls the assembly out of - & into - lockup. The slide lock simply determines how far the assembly moves forward on the guide rails before stopping. A thicker, better machined, & wider slide stop will just make stop farther to the rear by the extra thickness of the stop.

Once, I installed a factory slide stop in backward. That makes the slide sit back so much farther (because no groove on the other side) that it is noticable. The gun worked OK like this for several months. Afer I noticed the slide hanging over rear of the frame. I investigated & installed the stop correctly.

Maybe someone can explain to me - & anyone else who wants to know - HOW the MGSL works. General references to "better quality", "more precise", etc. still do not explain HOW that makes a Glock group better. If I knew that it would help, I would buy some, at least for my USPSA guns.


I can explain it for you. Look on your barrel. Notice how there are two lugs? The front lug has a little lip on it. That lip mates with the lip on the slide lock. The more consistent that mating, the more consistent your barrel lockup will be. What the MGSL does is provide a very smooth and consistent surface so that your barrel lockup is consistent every time. This is a picture of the slide lock from my CCF Race Frame gun after a few hundred rounds.

Gun-Parts & Access.

My accuracy was suffering and I couldn't figure out why. I was a hair away from ordering an aftermarket barrel and having it fitted to my gun when I came across this thread. Notice that divot on the slide lock? That's from the lug hitting it unevenly. The wear should be a nice, even line across.

I ordered the MGSL hoping it would be the cure for my problems, and guess what, it worked. My groups decreased in size by roughly 30% and are now on-par with what I shoot with all of my other highly accurate guns (a full custom 1911 and a Sig P228). In other words, the accuracy was exactly what I was expecting out of the CCF in the first place.

Now, do I think everyone needs the MGSL...no. If your slide lock has a very even wear pattern on it, in all likelihood the performance gain will be marginal. I have a Glock 36 like this and it's a highly accurate gun rivaling some 1911s I've shot. That said, I do think a majority of Glocks can probably benefit from it.

I'm a huge sceptic when it comes to these little "innovations" for pistols, but I honestly thing this is one of those rare occasions where it does work. If I were to spend $100 on making a Glock awesome, it'd be this, a LWD 3.5 lbs. connector, LWD overtravel stop, $.25 trigger job, and 3M grip tape. It really ranks up there as one of the best improvements you can do for a Glock.
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Old 08-22-2008, 17:51   #54
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Sorry.

Thanks, caneau.

That does not tell me what I wanted to know, but I appreciate the effort. (read my comment about lockup)
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Old 08-22-2008, 18:44   #55
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Thanks, caneau.

That does not tell me what I wanted to know, but I appreciate the effort. (read my comment about lockup)
What more do you want to know? It works by increasing the contact surface of your front locking lug against the slide lock. More contact surface = consistent lockup = greater accuracy. If you want, I can take a picture of the MGSL after I put about 100 rounds through my gun so you can see the different wear patterns.

If you want, I can show you how these parts all fit together. It's pretty hard to explain how the slide lock relates to the barrel and secures the barrel directly to the frame but it's pretty easy to see in a picture.
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Old 08-22-2008, 19:59   #56
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If you want, I can show you how these parts all fit together.
That would be great.
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Old 08-22-2008, 20:46   #57
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The locking block pulls the assembly out of - & into - lockup. The slide lock simply determines how far the assembly moves forward on the guide rails before stopping. A thicker, better machined, & wider slide stop will just make stop farther to the rear by the extra thickness of the stop.
The barrel is not held in lockup by the locking block. In the typical case the two parts are not in direct contact when the gun is locked up. Push down on the barrel with the gun in lockup and you'll see that this is true.

The MGSL "corralls" the barrel slightly and that means that the barrel's position in lockup is more consistent.
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Old 08-22-2008, 22:03   #58
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The easiest answer to those who are skeptics of the MGSL is simply, "don't buy the part." Just keep your Glocks stock and you neither lose or gain anything. Why did I buy aftermarket triggers, buy various sights, grind/cut/stipple the grips, buy aftermarket slides, barrels, recoil gizmos, etc? Because I could and that the parts were available.

I screw around with guns and aftermarket parts just to see what they do. I like to shoot the things, guns that is. I figured for $30.00 why not try the part and if I don't like it I will throw it in the same bag all my other stuff resides that I don't use any longer, along with quite a pile of holsters -hmmm... gotta do something about those excess holsters.

I'm taking the Glock 19 that a MGSL resides in to an extensive private range this weekend to try it out in front of a bunch of pistoleros. If I see something of note I'll post, but for now the MGSL is such a much nicer part than stock that regardless of what it does it is staying put in the G19. In my two extensively customized Glocks I didn't think the MGSL contributed much, but that is more a visceral feeling after shooting several hundred rounds than scientific measurement.

However, I got a much better feel in my G19 right away with the MGSL. If it is simply a self-fulfilling prophecy so be it, but that MGSL is staying put in my customized, yet Glock polymer, CCW G19.

Maybe someone who has a Ransom Rest with a Glock insert, a good chronograph, a good handloading system and good recording & reporting skills will record and report an exhaustive study of the efficacy of the MGSL. Until such a report is made I am sticking with the well-engineered MGSL in my polymer Glocks.
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Old 08-22-2008, 22:32   #59
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In my two extensively customized Glocks I didn't think the MGSL contributed much...
'Tis to be hoped that whoever did the extensive customizations took care of this issue in other ways. That is to say, I wouldn't expect much improvement in a gun that's already been worked over by an expert.
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Old 08-22-2008, 22:45   #60
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TR Graham can be reached at (832)695-7192, or emai at GRHM458@CS.com. Great guy to deal with. The MGSL is $30.00, and super easy to install. The MGSL is the one on top. You can see the area where the barrel locks into is smaller than the OEM. The MGSL is lightly extended as well allowing for easier take down. It is hard to see in the pictures, but the OEM slide lock is actually bowed a little. TR explaind that with a stamped part this sometimes happens. This can also be a mechanical contribution to your Glock not shooting POA. It can cause shooting left of right. The one I have here is a pretty good one as you can see the wear marks are fairly even. TR said look at your slide lock, and there will usually be wear more on one side than the other. This is an effect of the part not being true, or straight. The MGSL is laser cut harded steel, and is very true. My 23 shoot POA to begin with, so this wasn't an issue for me.

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Gun-Parts & Access.
Is it just the photo or is the groove cut in the top slidelock top photo, much wider on the right side than on the left?
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