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Old 08-22-2008, 23:16   #61
Noponer
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I am not a skeptic of the MGSL. As I said in the beginning, I must believe those who say it works because I have not tried it. I may buy one & see what it does for me. I was not attempting to discredit the MGSL or TR Graham; if someone has taken it that way, I apologize.

Also, just because I do not agree with someone's explanation of the mechanics does not mean that I do not understand the explanation.
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Old 08-23-2008, 00:31   #62
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Quote:
...just because I do not agree with someone's explanation of the mechanics...
Did you try pressing down on the barrel/chamber with the gun in lockup?

That should satisfy you that the barrel and locking block are not usually in contact when the gun is in battery. In fact, the small lip on the bottom of the barrel is held against the slide lock by recoil spring pressure. From that point it should be easy to understand why the smaller groove in the MGSL puts the barrel lip (and therefore the barrel) in a more consistent position compared to the larger groove in the standard slide lock.
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Old 08-23-2008, 01:49   #63
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Maybe someone who has a Ransom Rest with a Glock insert...
It was always my understanding that Glocks perform poorly in a Ransom Rest due to the polymer flexing when tightened down in the rest. Has something changed?
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Old 08-23-2008, 05:52   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BOGE View Post
It was always my understanding that Glocks perform poorly in a Ransom Rest due to the polymer flexing when tightened down in the rest. Has something changed?
Surely someone can shoot over sandbags.
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Old 08-23-2008, 06:24   #65
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Surely someone can shoot over sandbags.
If the improvement is only noticeable when shooting from bags or a rest, it is not relevant to self defense or even to freehand target shooting.

The only way to do the test is to do the "blind" experiment where the shooter does not know which slide stop is in the gun. Then have someone change the slide stop and shoot again... same gun, same conditions. Compare the two targets.
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Old 08-23-2008, 08:31   #66
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Originally Posted by JohnKSa View Post
Did you try pressing down on the barrel/chamber with the gun in lockup?

That should satisfy you that the barrel and locking block are not usually in contact when the gun is in battery. In fact, the small lip on the bottom of the barrel is held against the slide lock by recoil spring pressure. From that point it should be easy to understand why the smaller groove in the MGSL puts the barrel lip (and therefore the barrel) in a more consistent position compared to the larger groove in the standard slide lock.
Thanks, John. Yes, I have pushed the barrel down many times on the 25 Glocks I have owned since 1990.

I just now tried something else. I removed the locking block on my G-34 & reassembled the gun. The slide quits moving forward at the same position, of course. To further your case, the slight rearward movement of the slide to the rear when pushing down on the barrel hood... is still there. Apparently caused by the barrel lip sliding down in the slide locks wider groove (because the lock is not vertical, but angled back at the bottom).

I have never said that the locking block holds the gun in lockup. The barrel/slide are in lockup when you put it on the frame. I never thought that the assembly had to be "held" together for correct firing, because there is typically no force causing movement there. However, it does seem that the MGSL's narrower groove would hold barrel & slide together better. I assume that pushing down on the barrel hood would not move the hood down very much when an MGSL is installed. Whether this really helps or not, I don't know. The MGSL sure seems to be doing something to help a lot of shooters reporting here on GT.

Thanks for all the answers to my question. I will just have to get an MGSL & see what it does for me.
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Old 08-23-2008, 14:47   #67
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Pushing down on the barrel with an MGSL installed will show the same amount of barrel travel as before, the difference is that you can see the MGSL moving down as the barrel moves down. With the stock part there's enough slop in the interaction between the two parts that the barrel can move downward without the slide lock moving.
Quote:
I never thought that the assembly had to be "held" together for correct firing, because there is typically no force causing movement there. However, it does seem that the MGSL's narrower groove would hold barrel & slide together better.
It's not holding the barrel & slide together, it's only helping to position the rear of the barrel more consistently.

In other words, you're looking for something that's going to rigidly lock the end of the barrel in place so it can't move at all. That's not what's happening. There is no rigid mechanical locking mechanism provided by the MGSL, it's not making things perfect, it's only providing improved consistency compared to the stock part. Better, not perfect. More consistent, not perfectly consistent.
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Last edited by JohnKSa; 08-23-2008 at 20:03..
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Old 08-23-2008, 15:02   #68
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It's prolly the light and I'm not the best photographer. They way it works is very very simple. look at the stock Glock SL, and the large area for the barrel lug to lock up to. The MGSL has a much smaller area. This translates in to a more secured area for the Barrel lug to lock up to. The barrel will actually peen a small area on the MGSL. This is where the barrel will continue to lock up to. This is what creates the consistant lockup. The barrel will lock up at the same place every time. The Factory part was not designed to do this. With the design of the Glock pistol installing the MGSL does not affect reliablity at all. I have put over a thousand rounds through my G23 since the MGSL was installed. It has gotten a little better over time as the barrel now has a peened area that is sits in every time. Not to worry about the barrel lug and damage. The tenifer treatment makes the barrels metal harder than the MSGL. For 30 bucks you can't go wrong with this part. Again the MGSL operates in the same principle as a Match Grade link on 1911. It allows for a more consistant barrel and slide lockup.
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Old 08-24-2008, 06:31   #69
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There was a time when I didnt like Glocks. T R Graham changed that for me.
He is the Medicine Man of the Glock in my opinion.
If he says this part will improve accuracy, etc. , it will.
I will order one for my G30.
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Old 08-24-2008, 09:36   #70
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The price sure is reasonable for any of us running glocks at matches but I can not shake the feeling this is a solution looking for a problem. I dont shoot my handgun out past 25 yards and even those distances are shot more for trigger disclipline. Slower shots.

I can plainly see the replacement part is better looking but this is a part that keeps my slide on the frame until I want to disassemble the firearm.

The amount the barrel might move in various positions when closing the slide are much less than the effect of the twitch, drop of sweat, rock I am standing on, brain fart we all experience when shooting 6" circles or squares on the move.

Im standing back from the Kool Aid bar just yet. Water will be just fine. Dont flame me just yet. I am open minded still.
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Old 08-24-2008, 11:27   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Delta-x View Post
There was a time when I didnt like Glocks. T R Graham changed that for me.
He is the Medicine Man of the Glock in my opinion.
If he says this part will improve accuracy, etc. , it will.
I will order one for my G30.
+1 to that. I had one on my G30 but took it off to put on my G27(for carry). Time to buy another at the next gun show. I bought T.R.'s dvd, its excellent and he doesn't try to promote any of his parts on it either. Its all just knowledge about Glocks and how to take care of them.
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Old 08-24-2008, 22:01   #72
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It doesn't seem that anyone has done a blind test with this part and that bothers me. It would take about 5 minutes and 20 rounds of ammo. Is that too much to ask? If you believe in this part and think others should give it a try, just do the test.
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Old 08-25-2008, 00:59   #73
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As soon as I get the part I'll use (test) it (as stated henceforth) like a courtesy car to a cathouse!!
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Old 08-25-2008, 06:44   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Civitas View Post
It doesn't seem that anyone has done a blind test with this part and that bothers me. It would take about 5 minutes and 20 rounds of ammo. Is that too much to ask? If you believe in this part and think others should give it a try, just do the test.
Suggestion-

If it worries you that much.....you buy one and do the test.
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Old 08-25-2008, 07:00   #75
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I bought one probably 4-5 yrs ago off TRG when he was in S/Indy:Greenwood.
I put it in my G37 that I was using as a bullseye gun.Using a Carver mount and a Ultradot it took my Groupsize from about 5" to about 3" at 50 yds.
I have them in all my Glocks-Look, the fact they make take-down easier is worth the price of admission.

TR- if you're out there please PM me- I'll take a couple more.
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Old 08-25-2008, 07:04   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Civitas View Post
It doesn't seem that anyone has done a blind test with this part and that bothers me. It would take about 5 minutes and 20 rounds of ammo. Is that too much to ask? If you believe in this part and think others should give it a try, just do the test.
Several posters have extolled the merits of this part, with their accounts of
the match grade slide lock on their guns. For such a small expenditure
(30 bucks) it wont break your bank..... Or maybe you should pass on it.
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Old 08-25-2008, 07:46   #77
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Originally Posted by Delta-x View Post
Several posters have extolled the merits of this part, with their accounts of
the match grade slide lock on their guns. For such a small expenditure
(30 bucks) it wont break your bank..... Or maybe you should pass on it.
I agree. No matter what anyone else says or does, it will not totally convince most of the others... including me. If I really want to find out what the MGSL does, I will check it out for myself.

Personally, I do not believe a "blind" test is necessary... I trust myself to make the best shots possible each time. I am well aware of "experimenter bias", but I have no bias about this... so I will not be convincing myself that one lock or the other is better or worse. I would try a set of shots off-hand & a set from a rest, though - just to see the difference.
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Old 08-25-2008, 10:11   #78
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Originally Posted by jbirds1210 View Post
Suggestion-

If it worries you that much.....you buy one and do the test.
I'm not the one who claims it works. Look, I hope it works. If it works, I will get one. But so far I've seen no evidence that it makes any difference and I don't have $30 to waste. It's not a hard test to do and it could be done during regular range practice so it would not even cost you any ammo. What bothers me is that so many people are so excited about this part but nobody has actually tested it in a scientific way.

Last edited by Civitas; 08-25-2008 at 10:13..
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Old 08-25-2008, 10:16   #79
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Originally Posted by Noponer View Post
Personally, I do not believe a "blind" test is necessary... I trust myself to make the best shots possible each time. I am well aware of "experimenter bias", but I have no bias about this... so I will not be convincing myself that one lock or the other is better or worse. I would try a set of shots off-hand & a set from a rest, though - just to see the difference.
The thing about experimenter bias is that it is subconscious. It's not something you would necessarily be aware of. All the test would take is one person who knows how to change out the slide lock and another person to shoot. How hard is that?
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Old 08-25-2008, 12:18   #80
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I am reminded of a guy who placed an ad in the Classified section of a large paper that said:
Last chance. Send $5 to POB xxx, Ny Ny.

The guy laughed because he got money and he did nothing illegal.
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