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Old 11-22-2008, 20:03   #41
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Originally Posted by meshmdz View Post
benn - first of all, i am not commissioned yet. I am still a cadet. i commission in May 09. branched ordnance.


if your post is factual then explain this... the bourgeoise do hire the workers. yes. however, they hire him for the LOWEST possible amount to sustain his ability to merely survive. they are NOT looking out for him and sustaining his work, as they will surely fire him and hire someone else who will work for less. this is a crime. the bourgeoise that exists today is solely responsible for the hiring and continual hiring of the illegals. now we are in a terrible situation bc our economy depends on this ILLEGAL labor so much so that, one, it is physically IMPOSSIBLE to remove illegals from this nation....our army and all the king's men couldnt expel them from this country if they tried. and secondly, the reason they have to come here ILLEGALLY is solidified in the procurement of the capitalists (bourgeoise) continual disregard for our laws by hiring this illegal working class. you can call this Marxist or Marxism all you want SGT, but the truth therein remains.

Obama's race is the LAST reason i voted for him. any black that voted for him solely on his race, is as dumb as any fool who voted for hillary bc she is a female. both are equally foolish. however, people are going to vote based on their own reasoning and justify it there no matter how torn asunder their reasoning may be. i voted for Obama because i think he has better plans for this nation. i think he is right when he says we need to make sure that more people have wealth or attain "wealth" in this nation. capitalism is not the reason i have everything i have been blessed with in this life. my parents who are hard working, lower middle class people, are the reason. they have taught in public school systems and worked for delta airlines for over 30 years and sustained this, thank God, by being hard working people and via the unions they belong to as well. (though the unions have become the capitalist entities they were built to be the antithesis of in many ways - though that is the subject of another debate all together)

also sgt, you arent abreast of the angst of people ON THIS FORUM that Obama is black? where have you been? there are NUMEROUS threads with postings about Obama being black, not being able to be trusted, socialist, etc.. he has received more death threats (not on this forum) than any other President elect in history. people that do this kind of thing are the ones that blog was referenced towards. it is awful that people would ever say such terrible things about our new President, regardless of who he is.

and i have news for you sgt, people dont have to TRY to fail in this nation. some people choose NOT to work and they are morons that abuse the system. my father losts 45,000 in various mutual funds that he had accrued money in over the past 11 years, just in this past year!!! some people say bad investing, etc... well that is false. my father chose to invest in mutual funds because they are safer than just investing the $ in other stock, yet he still lost... big time. he is not alone. far many more americans have felt the realities of a Republican led nation for the past 8 years FAR WORSE than my father who have served this nation valiantly in Vietnam. predatory loans lenders, corporate capitalists, etc, have all preyed upon people and set them up for failure, knowing full well, that they cant afford the payments, etc. government regulation should exist to see that these PRIVATE corporations dont do these things.
Cadet,

Winston Churchill once said, "If at 20 you are not a liberal you do not have a heart. At 40 if you are not conservative you do not have a brain".

Hopefully you live long enough to get some life experience that will let you think for yourself, because clearly, you are not.

You seem to think that Republicans have been running things for the last 8 years. The white house yes, but both houses of congress have been controlled by democrats for a while now. Put down the copy of Marx and pick up the constitution. Notice that CONGRESS controls the budget, not the President.

My condolences to your father. I lost about $28,000 since August. Your point is what? President Bush did it?

The predatory lenders you mention were forced to lend money to minorities that would not qualify for a loan if the government did not force banks to make the loans. As Government Sponsored Enterprises, Fannie May and Freddie Mac gave the loans and then sold them. The commercial banks could not pay the loans because 16% of the new homeowners never made the first payment. By the way, President Bush tried to get some oversight on this program, but the DEMOCRAT controlled congress stopped it.

Here is a pretty cool link that will give you a starting point to do what I do.....research everything on my own. I only believe myself. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AiEWCnpNnBQ Now, I do not put much stock in YouTube or anything on the internet, but being a young, impressionable, recently indoctrinated college student, I figured this would get you thinking.

Notice that all of the people praising Fannie and Freddy are DEMOCRATS. Weird huh?

Also because you are a "twenty-something" check out this link for a definition of a GSE. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Governm...red_enterprise

Then check out this link to understand sub prime lending: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sub_prime

Both of these are wikipedia sites, so you need to do your own homework. Wiki is notoriously inaccurate.

To be a liberal you just have to feel compassionate about people or an issue. To vote for a democrat you have to be a victim in some way. Screwed over by the man somehow.

Hopefully your eyes get openedand you start to think for yourself. Sound bites and liberal professors are not the answer.
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Old 11-22-2008, 20:15   #42
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Originally Posted by Colorado4Wheel View Post
You read into what I said. And we disagree. I simply do not want to be taxed more then the wealthy. You think that would cause some sort of calamity. We disagree. I truely wish it was as simple as you say. We have had "trickle down" economics for a long time. We are futher in debt then we ever have been. You try make it all sound so simple. The reality is very different. I have never said I am for a unfair burden on the wealthy. Of course I don't consider them paying the same % tax I pay unfair.
We are not in debt because of the tax system. We are in debt because our spending is out of control. Congressional earmarks (Pork) costs us BILLIONS along with the social programs for lazy people who do not contribute to society.

In his entire Senate Career John McCain never added one penny to a bill as an earmark.

Obama added about $1 MILLION for every day that he served as a U.S. Senator.

Those are also facts you can look up.

You say you are not for an unfair burden on the wealthy, but if you have looked at the IRS spreadsheets you would know that is exactly what we have.

You voted for Obama hoping for a tax cut without even knowing for sure if you pay any taxes or not. I'm not trying to be insulting, but you obviously did not research your decision through the IRS.

So, who is more responsible for the fiscal trouble we are in now? The Democrats who forced sub prime loans onto banks and made BILLIONS in earmarks, or the Republicans who fought against sub prime and had relatively few earmarks?
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Old 11-22-2008, 23:18   #43
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SGT - I am not a victim. I voted for a Democrat because I think they have better plans for this nation. Thats all there is to that. Its not because Obama is half black, etc..

So liberal professors are .... uneducated?? because of their status of "liberal"??? I am confused.. if your quote by Winston is correct then what is to be said of all the highly intellectual professors on the college campuses, nationwide? Surely they arent ALL ...dumb...
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Old 11-22-2008, 23:20   #44
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... oh yea, and the way you speak about the Dems being responsible for the problems since they have had control of the Congress....

The Congress cant get anything done because the executive branch headed by yours truly, W, hasnt allowed anything to become official. He and his cohorts have stonewalled and blocked anything the Dems have put up. Oh but my dear friend, how things are about to change.. If Franken pulls out and beats Norm Coleman, as he is on track to, we will have a fillibuster proof Congress. Imagine the things we will be able to get passed then!!
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Old 11-22-2008, 23:46   #45
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... oh yea, and the way you speak about the Dems being responsible for the problems since they have had control of the Congress....

The Congress cant get anything done because the executive branch headed by yours truly, W, hasnt allowed anything to become official. He and his cohorts have stonewalled and blocked anything the Dems have put up. Oh but my dear friend, how things are about to change.. If Franken pulls out and beats Norm Coleman, as he is on track to, we will have a fillibuster proof Congress. Imagine the things we will be able to get passed then!!
eduction does not equal smart. You are about to find that out when you go on active duty. IF you really knew what you were talking about you would not make such ignorant statements like, "...He and his cohorts have stonewalled and blocked anything the Dems have put up".

I could give you example after example about Liberals doing nothing. No energy plan etc. They did manage to pass a higher minimum wage that does nothing to improve the quality of life for poor people.

That has to be the most retarded thing I have heard since I heard a 2LT say, "Well, in my experience"

If ignorance truly is bliss then you must be the happiest idiot on the planet.

Good luck in your short career.
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Old 11-23-2008, 00:17   #46
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eduction does not equal smart. You are about to find that out when you go on active duty. IF you really knew what you were talking about you would not make such ignorant statements like, "...He and his cohorts have stonewalled and blocked anything the Dems have put up".

I could give you example after example about Liberals doing nothing. No energy plan etc. They did manage to pass a higher minimum wage that does nothing to improve the quality of life for poor people.

That has to be the most retarded thing I have heard since I heard a 2LT say, "Well, in my experience"

If ignorance truly is bliss then you must be the happiest idiot on the planet.

Good luck in your short career.

SGM, you shouldnt use such harsh language. I understand you feel strongly about your convictions, however, for you to assume that I will have a "short" career b/c i have Democratic political beliefs, is foolish. And again SGM - I am NOT a 2LT.
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Old 11-23-2008, 00:20   #47
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Originally Posted by bennwj View Post
eduction does not equal smart. You are about to find that out when you go on active duty. IF you really knew what you were talking about you would not make such ignorant statements like, "...He and his cohorts have stonewalled and blocked anything the Dems have put up".

I could give you example after example about Liberals doing nothing. No energy plan etc. They did manage to pass a higher minimum wage that does nothing to improve the quality of life for poor people.

That has to be the most retarded thing I have heard since I heard a 2LT say, "Well, in my experience"

If ignorance truly is bliss then you must be the happiest idiot on the planet.

Good luck in your short career.
And for the record, I have NEVER stated ANYTHING disrespectful about GW Bush, other than what is factual. He has NOT worked with the Democratic Congress. He DOES have the LOWEST approval rating of ANY American President in history. Those are just facts SGM..Sometimes they arent pretty.
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Old 11-23-2008, 11:16   #48
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Brilliant. You went to Wikipedia for "facts" I go to wikipedia if I need to know about a plant or some other trivial thing that I do not have to verify. ANYBODY can join wiki and post something.

Now, go to the IRS website and look up WHAT PEOPLE ACTUALLY PAY.

Here is the link: http://www.irs.gov/taxstats/index.html now look up the spreadsheet for Individual Income Tax and the other one that is called Personal Wealth. It's in the middle of the page.
All your doing is posting a link to a page with a bunch of links to other pages. Post the direct link. I looked and did not find what you are talking about. I don't have time to click through to every link either. So if you found it, post it.

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f1040a.pdf

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f1040ez.pdf

For what you said to be true you would have to come up with 60K in standard deductions. The standard deduction was $5450, standard exemption is $3500 (alls from the EZ forum). Thats a whopping $8950. I know if all my years I have never found a way to get $60K worth of deductions.

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-soi/05in02ar.xls

Tax year 05 (the most recent they have posted). Colume CC and CD listed as "Tax due at time of filing"

People in the 1-5000 paid 300,000+ as a group. I thought they paid/owed nothing. It just goes up from there of course.
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Old 11-23-2008, 14:09   #49
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All your doing is posting a link to a page with a bunch of links to other pages. Post the direct link. I looked and did not find what you are talking about. I don't have time to click through to every link either. So if you found it, post it.

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f1040a.pdf

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f1040ez.pdf

For what you said to be true you would have to come up with 60K in standard deductions. The standard deduction was $5450, standard exemption is $3500 (alls from the EZ forum). Thats a whopping $8950. I know if all my years I have never found a way to get $60K worth of deductions.

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-soi/05in02ar.xls

Tax year 05 (the most recent they have posted). Colume CC and CD listed as "Tax due at time of filing"

People in the 1-5000 paid 300,000+ as a group. I thought they paid/owed nothing. It just goes up from there of course.
If you don't have the time to click on every link, I suggest you go back and read the post I made where I referenced where you could find the spreadsheet on the page. I even told you the name of the sheet.

You are exactly what most politicians want; an uninformed voter. Obama played his class warfare like a master musician, and many people fell for it. Some of them are having second thought and HOPING that they are wrong. I mean did you REALLY believe that Obama could POSSIBLY come up with $1.3 TRILLION in new proposed spending by only raising taxes on 5% of Americans? Seriously?

Did you forget Clinton running on tax cuts, then coming on TV saying that he had worked harder in the first 100 days in office, but he was going to have to raise taxes? Remember that.

There is no way I can convince you that you are wrong about who pays taxes.

How about this. When you are ready to file your taxes, get a blank tax return form and reduce your personal income by whatever percentage necessary to lower your income (before taxes) to $30,000. Now reduce federal withholding by the same percentage. You just became a member of that $30,000 tax bracket. Now figure out how much tax you owe using the same number of dependents etc. You are going to find that you get back, more than you "paid". I know this for a fact, because I did my sister-in-law's taxes for her last year. Money that I EARNED went to her in the form of a refund.

Now, take that 1040, set it on your desk and argue with it.

Look a little closer. Those people in the lower income brackets are paying capital gains tax. I have no idea where you are coming up with your numbers for deductions though.
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Old 11-23-2008, 16:37   #50
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If you don't have the time to click on every link, I suggest you go back and read the post I made where I referenced where you could find the spreadsheet on the page. I even told you the name of the sheet.

You are exactly what most politicians want; an uninformed voter. Obama played his class warfare like a master musician, and many people fell for it. Some of them are having second thought and HOPING that they are wrong. I mean did you REALLY believe that Obama could POSSIBLY come up with $1.3 TRILLION in new proposed spending by only raising taxes on 5% of Americans? Seriously?

Did you forget Clinton running on tax cuts, then coming on TV saying that he had worked harder in the first 100 days in office, but he was going to have to raise taxes? Remember that.

There is no way I can convince you that you are wrong about who pays taxes.

How about this. When you are ready to file your taxes, get a blank tax return form and reduce your personal income by whatever percentage necessary to lower your income (before taxes) to $30,000. Now reduce federal withholding by the same percentage. You just became a member of that $30,000 tax bracket. Now figure out how much tax you owe using the same number of dependents etc. You are going to find that you get back, more than you "paid". I know this for a fact, because I did my sister-in-law's taxes for her last year. Money that I EARNED went to her in the form of a refund.

Now, take that 1040, set it on your desk and argue with it.

Look a little closer. Those people in the lower income brackets are paying capital gains tax. I have no idea where you are coming up with your numbers for deductions though.

You don't answer any of my statements directly. I show you a IRS spreedsheet showing the taxes people pay in each bracket and you still don't believe it. FYI, The numbers for deductins are right on the 1040 form. I know, that I know, that I pay taxes when I make under 60K. I have written a check for $12K one year. You can argue about deductions all you want. My reality is what I get on my taxes every year. And the accountants I use are not idiots, and many have gone back to recheck previous years just to see if there are any deductions I could have taken. I am done argueing with you. You clearly think you know everything so it's pointless.

Edit: I just realized I am arguing with someone who doesn't even know where to find the standard deductions for income on his tax forms. And is arguing about Clintion for some reasone, Never mentiond him myself. He also won't produce the supposed table that shows no one making under 60K a year pays taxes.
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Old 11-23-2008, 20:03   #51
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You don't answer any of my statements directly. I show you a IRS spreedsheet showing the taxes people pay in each bracket and you still don't believe it. FYI, The numbers for deductins are right on the 1040 form. I know, that I know, that I pay taxes when I make under 60K. I have written a check for $12K one year. You can argue about deductions all you want. My reality is what I get on my taxes every year. And the accountants I use are not idiots, and many have gone back to recheck previous years just to see if there are any deductions I could have taken. I am done argueing with you. You clearly think you know everything so it's pointless.

Edit: I just realized I am arguing with someone who doesn't even know where to find the standard deductions for income on his tax forms. And is arguing about Clintion for some reasone, Never mentiond him myself. He also won't produce the supposed table that shows no one making under 60K a year pays taxes.
CO - you arent going to change the SGM's mind. Even though he is WRONG about people that make UNDER 60k a year paying taxes (total bull**** by the way), he wont admit it and will not believe the truth in regards to the same.
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Old 11-24-2008, 21:12   #52
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If you make more moeny in this nation, then you owe it to the nation that afforded you the chance to make that money, to pay a little more in taxes... its just fairness. it is NOT fair for people who barely make it to pay more taxes in ratio to their income than the rich capitalists do that explicitly ABUSE and EXPLOIT the labour of the working class
Do you mean that they need to pay more as in higher % of their income/profit, or do you mean that they should pay the same % as everyone else and there for making more money means more taxes proportionally?

Does one have to pay taxes on welfare checks/food stamps and claim them as income? Or do they just claim the earned income credit and dependents and get free money? Sounds fair to me.
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Old 11-24-2008, 21:18   #53
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Also he is only half black. I guess you could call him a HALFrican-American
He's not even half black. His great-great grandfather was black. He is actually 50% black, from his mother (Barry hates being part white, read his book) 43.75% Arabic and....get this, are you ready....6.25% black.....6.25%.
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Old 11-25-2008, 11:33   #54
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Do you mean that they need to pay more as in higher % of their income/profit, or do you mean that they should pay the same % as everyone else and there for making more money means more taxes proportionally?

Does one have to pay taxes on welfare checks/food stamps and claim them as income? Or do they just claim the earned income credit and dependents and get free money? Sounds fair to me.
Those that can afford to pay more, need to pay more IMO.

People that are on welfare and food stamps are there bc they are in dire circumstances financially, so they would not be paying taxes on their food stamps.
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Old 11-25-2008, 17:40   #55
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Those that can afford to pay more, need to pay more IMO.
So you think that people who make a good living and succeed financially in life, and they can "afford to pay more" then they should give more to the government and underachievers. God I hope you never get in the position to make decisions because that is a poor one. IMHO

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People that are on welfare and food stamps are there bc they are in dire circumstances financially, so they would not be paying taxes on their food stamps.
Get informed man. A great portion of people on welfare and food stamp programs are mooching and leeching off society with no real ambition to get a real job and make a place in the world. Warrant there are many that need this program due to physical limitation, disability, inablity to mentally function in society, but alot mooch. The whole system needs to be reformed. There are no incentives to got a real job. It really upsets me that my cousing has 2 kids, and makes as much as I do per month and I am in the health care field, and there is no reason for her to get a job when the government pays for her to sit at home. oh yeah and they pay for a babysitter for her to go out on the weekends. Then she gets more money when April rolls around. BS INHO
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Old 11-26-2008, 11:01   #56
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So you think that people who make a good living and succeed financially in life, and they can "afford to pay more" then they should give more to the government and underachievers. God I hope you never get in the position to make decisions because that is a poor one. IMHO
I am so sick of people saying "get informed". Like they are the ONLY ones who know anything.

BTW, We have a progressive tax code now. So he is not saying anything other then supporting the existing tax code.
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Old 11-27-2008, 23:45   #57
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I am so sick of people saying "get informed". Like they are the ONLY ones who know anything.

BTW, We have a progressive tax code now. So he is not saying anything other then supporting the existing tax code.
Thank you CO. The progressive tax code is the fairest way IMO. People want to post like they know everything and anyone who disagrees posts nothing but "BS".
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Old 11-27-2008, 23:47   #58
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Also, people who "choose" to live on welfare and foodstamps dont have it 'good' like many people who work like to say.. it just makes them feel better about themselves and their stance. if someone is lazy and doesnt want to work, fine. they choose to live a ****ty life. Living off of food stamps and a measly welfare check is NOT living the high life like many want to post...
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Old 11-28-2008, 11:44   #59
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Hey people, I started this tread to bring out and expose all those naive idiots that were OBAMA supporters, these are the people who voted for, 500 percent excise tax on ammo, assault weapons ban, ban on foreign ammo, registration and control of handguns, repealing CCW, and a vote against the NRA. These are little people stuck in some small time job looking for revenge and something for nothing for their lack of success they have accomplished with their life and their jobs, these types of people should not even own a gun. When their leader imposes these sanctions they will not even be able to afford the ammo for their guns.

What I would suggest is they should try again to establish the failed AIR AMERICA, Al Franken will need a job, and spout their views on world events, to their likes, AND stay off of a site that their LEADER would be totally against.

Even their Leader is going to go back on his promise to them to immediately raise the tax on the rich, rumors from his chief of staff is he will wait till Bush tax cuts expire at the end off 2010, he knows the market is in trouble, our economy is run by the market, and the MARKET IS RUNNED BY THE RICH. Tax the rich and market goes south.

As Ron Emanuel said pertaining to Assualt weapon ban, We Are Going To Do It Right This Time And There Will Be No Sunset, IT WILL BE PERMANENT.

This is the Man, when asked, said his two greatest accomplishments while in the Clinton Administration, said the Assualt Weapons Ban and NAFTA.

SUPPORT THE NRA, they will need your help to defeat OBAMA and his LIBERAL CRONIES , on this ANTI GUN LEGISLATION.

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Old 11-28-2008, 16:30   #60
meshmdz
OBAMA 2012
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kat1950 View Post
Hey people, I started this tread to bring out and expose all those naive idiots that were OBAMA supporters, these are the people who voted for, 500 percent excise tax on ammo, assault weapons ban, ban on foreign ammo, registration and control of handguns, repealing CCW, and a vote against the NRA. These are little people stuck in some small time job looking for revenge and something for nothing for their lack of success they have accomplished with their life and their jobs, these types of people should not even own a gun. When their leader imposes these sanctions they will not even be able to afford the ammo for their guns.

What I would suggest is they should try again to establish the failed AIR AMERICA, Al Franken will need a job, and spout their views on world events, to their likes, AND stay off of a site that their LEADER would be totally against.

Even their Leader is going to go back on his promise to them to immediately raise the tax on the rich, rumors from his chief of staff is he will wait till Bush tax cuts expire at the end off 2010, he knows the market is in trouble, our economy is run by the market, and the MARKET IS RUNNED BY THE RICH. Tax the rich and market goes south.

As Ron Emanuel said pertaining to Assualt weapon ban, We Are Going To Do It Right This Time And There Will Be No Sunset, IT WILL BE PERMANENT.

This is the Man, when asked, said his two greatest accomplishments while in the Clinton Administration, said the Assualt Weapons Ban and NAFTA.

SUPPORT THE NRA, they will need your help to defeat OBAMA and his LIBERAL CRONIES , on this ANTI GUN LEGISLATION.
If you are going to make a point, or attempt to, please get the person's name correct....

You meant to say Rahm Emanuel.

It just makes your argument appears weak when you cant even get the guy's name right.
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